[Dan Herrmann]

Good news - The '09 Walker Cup site is up, and they have a walking tour of Merrion up for your enjoyment:  http://www.2009walkercup.org/coursewalk2.html

One of the quotes from the tour:  ""The unique character of each individual bunker is what provides Merion with the most exquisite tapestry in golf." –Gil Hanse "

[Wayne_Kozun]

I just played Merion East this past Monday and once again it was a fabulous experience.  IMHO Merion East is one of the very best, if not the best, parkland courses in the world.   There are some great short par 4s but the course doesn't feel short - perhaps that is because there are only 2 par 5s and the par 3s are not that long - with the exception of #17 which is one helluva hole!  10 is one of the great short par 4s in the world - it will be very interesting to see how the pros will play it in the US Open - I can't imagine Tiger hitting much more than a 5 iron off of this tee.

I have two minor quibbles with the course:
The rough is too long and severe.
The fescue is way, way too penal.

The rough has already been commented on in this thread so I won't go into too much detail but the rough is extremely thick and when wet it is hard to hit much more than an 8 iron out of the rough.  (FWIW - I play to a 10)

But the fescue is as dense as the rough and 1.5 feet high which I believe is wrong.  I believe that fescue should be wispy but at Merion East you were very lucky to find your ball if you are in the fescue.    While there is not a huge amount of fescue on the course there is enough to make it an issue.  With the current thickness of the fescue it is more penal than a water hazard since the likely outcome is a lost ball and even when you find it one can hardly get a club on the ball - especially on the left side of 14.  I can somewhat understand the long fescue on some of the shorter par 4s like 8 and 10 but 14 is a hard enough hole without all of that fescue on the left and the fescue surrounding the bunkers on the right.

I don't think that the trees are an issue, they don't really come into play unless you are well off the fairway.

Maybe the current setup makes sense in June of 2013, but man it kicks your ass!  That being said I look forward to an opportunity to play the course in the future as it is one of the truly special golf courses (and clubs) on the planet. 

[mike_malone]

Wayne,

   So if Tiger hits a five iron wouldn't that mean it is not a great par four?

[RichMacafee]

Fantastic set of photos, thankyou Sean.

Having not played it makes any judgements lack value, but the cut of the fairways and the rough lines on the par 4's, combined with the bunkers all being in the rough (a pet hate), makes me think that this is one amazing golf course being held back by modern set-up practices.

[Dan Herrmann]

Wayne Kozun - Keep in mind that we've had a TON of rain this year with cool temperatures.  Both prescriptions for abundant grass growth.    It's gotten to the point that a shot from the rough at my club (25 miles from Merion East) now requires a well struck pitching wedge just to advance.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Sean Arble,

Thanks for the pictures.

For some reason I like pictures taken on overcast days, perhaps you pick up more of the contours on the golf course.

This is what I don't see at Merion-- a routing that knocks my socks off.


Mayday,

I think the routing is brilliant, especially the crossovers, which I'm not usually fond of.  But, at Merion, their use is ingenious.

While I haven't attempted the exercise, with that property and roads running through it, along with the location of the facilities, I think you'd be hard pressed to come up with a better routing.[/color]

The two par fives over by #4 creates a lack of variety for me for the rest of the course.

Can't you say that about all par 70's ?

How do you rate/evaluate the back nine at Pacific Dunes, with 4 par 3's, 3 par 5's and only 2 par 4's ?[/color]

Also, there is just too much back and forth for my taste.  The section from #6 through #13 is too long a stretch of less than terrific holes for me with several short par fours in a short time..

To each his own.
George Haines described Merion as a three course meal and I tend to agree with him.  1-5, 6-13 and 14-18.  Each component has their own feel or personality.  I happen to love the stretch of 6-13, it's very "sporty".[/color]

My objections are about Merion not being at the very highest level.


I don't understand the comment.

At the very highest level for whom ?[/color]

There can't be so many blemishes for the very best courses.

I don't see the blemishes.
Perhaps love is blind, or, perhaps you have a unique standard by which to measure a courses greatness.[/color]

How much do the two plaques add to the aura of Merion ?


For me ?
In evaluating the architecture, the golf course and its playability, NONE at all.

Giving or taking merit from a golf course based upon the clubs Tiger Woods uses in his approach shots seems like a seriously flawed evaluative process.

I couldn't care less, as to the clubs Tiger hits into the greens at Maidstone, NGLA, GCGC, Seminole, Wild Horse, Hidden Creek, Merion, Inwood and many, many other "sporty" golf courses.[/color]

Dan Herrmann,

You definitely have those special "philly" glasses on.

The rough is penal, especially around the bunker edges.
And, the fairways are too narrow.
They were never returned to their pre-U.S. Open widths years ago, and, I suspect that they will continue to shrink.

While the club can take great pride in hosting another U.S. Open, from a purist view, I can't wait until the event is over and the course returned to "user friendly" member play ....... if that happens..... and I hope it does.

[Sean_A]

Wayne

How do the members feel about the rough?  Are there any murmerings of "hack it down" or trying to connect fairways with bunkers?

Dan

Of course I have some sympathy for spring growth being difficult to control, but a club with a budget the size of Merion's must make some sort of decision to keep the rough because they surely could cut it down if they wanted to. 

Ciao

[wsmorrison]

Sean,

I believe it would be a mistake to discuss the feelings of the membership on this website.

I will say that the rough is generally kept at a lower height than in the past.  If there are heavy rains the day before or morning of play, the rough will not get cut.  This is a time when you can get a lot of growth in a short period of time.  It is also a time of year when the blades of grass aren't that strong so the balls tend to sit down more so than later in the year.  I believe the rough is cut everyday under normal circumstances.  I also believe the result of rotary mowers (grass tends to stand up) versus reel mowers (grass tends to lay in one direction) is that the same grass height plays harder for grass mown by rotaries.

[ChipOat]

Sean:

You noted that the approach to #16 is blind???  Not to my recollection.  I suppose if you were standing on the right edge of the fairway and the wickerbasketstick was cut on the right 1/3 of the green, the quarry might block out the wickerbasketstick from sight.  But even from there, you could still see most of the front of the green.  From everywhere left of that, the whole front of the green is in plain sight.  We might be talking semantics here, but with nothing obstructing your view of the green, how is that a "blind" approach.

The approach to #14 is truly blind as is the approach to #18 from the bottom of the hill.  If you're going for #4 in two shots, that will also be a blind approach.  But #16??  Please explain.

Phil McDade:

The "tree" up the left side of #2 is actually a trio of very tall trees spaced about 20 yards apart that, frankly, are essential to the difficulty of that hole.  Without them, a long hitter could bail out way left off the tee all day long and still have an unencumbered second shot back across the far bunker that would set up a fairly routine approach.  Bottom line: the OB right would be taken out of play (plus the golfers playing the 5th hole would need pith helmets or worse).  As it now stands, those 3 trees are big enough, and positioned so perfectly, that there is virtually no way that a 2nd shot from over there can be aimed so as to make the green reachable in regulation.  If they ever die, especially the front one closest to the green, they/it really need to be replaced.

Mayday:

It was noted earlier on this thread that #6 isn't at all short and is always included with #'s 1-5 as part of Merion's "first act".

Frankly, I've thought the knock about #'s 7-13 has always been overdone and never more so than in the last 5 years since #9 has been lengthened to almost 190 yards from the new back tee and, especially, since #12 has been lengthened such that the tee shot must now carry 240+ yards to safely cross Cobbs Creek.  Does that stretch seem underwhelming compared to the first six and the "Back Five"?  Probably - but look what those holes are being compared TO.

[Wayne_Kozun]

Wayne,

   So if Tiger hits a five iron wouldn't that mean it is not a great par four?

Sorry for the delayed response -I meant that it must be very unusual to be hitting a 5 iron off the tee on a US Open course.  I have no problems with pros hitting a 5 iron off of a tee on a par 4 and I think #10 is a great short par 4.  Short par 4s are also one of my favourite types of holes - it is a shame that you do not see as many built nowadays.  Who would build a course like Merion today? With short par 4s back-to-back on 10&11.

By the way I meant the 11th hole is where it is likely that Tiger will play a 5 iron.  It will be interesting to see what he uses on 10 - will the pros go for the green?

[Sean_A]

Sean:

You noted that the approach to #16 is blind???  Not to my recollection.  I suppose if you were standing on the right edge of the fairway and the wickerbasketstick was cut on the right 1/3 of the green, the quarry might block out the wickerbasketstick from sight.  But even from there, you could still see most of the front of the green.  From everywhere left of that, the whole front of the green is in plain sight.  We might be talking semantics here, but with nothing obstructing your view of the green, how is that a "blind" approach.

The approach to #14 is truly blind as is the approach to #18 from the bottom of the hill.  If you're going for #4 in two shots, that will also be a blind approach.  But #16??  Please explain.

Phil McDade:

The "tree" up the left side of #2 is actually a trio of very tall trees spaced about 20 yards apart that, frankly, are essential to the difficulty of that hole.  Without them, a long hitter could bail out way left off the tee all day long and still have an unencumbered second shot back across the far bunker that would set up a fairly routine approach.  Bottom line: the OB right would be taken out of play (plus the golfers playing the 5th hole would need pith helmets or worse).  As it now stands, those 3 trees are big enough, and positioned so perfectly, that there is virtually no way that a 2nd shot from over there can be aimed so as to make the green reachable in regulation.  If they ever die, especially the front one closest to the green, they/it really need to be replaced.

Mayday:

It was noted earlier on this thread that #6 isn't at all short and is always included with #'s 1-5 as part of Merion's "first act".

Frankly, I've thought the knock about #'s 7-13 has always been overdone and never more so than in the last 5 years since #9 has been lengthened to almost 190 yards from the new back tee and, especially, since #12 has been lengthened such that the tee shot must now carry 240+ yards to safely cross Cobbs Creek.  Does that stretch seem underwhelming compared to the first six and the "Back Five"?  Probably - but look what those holes are being compared TO.

Chipoat

Sorry for the late response!

Perhaps we have different ideas of what blind is.  The 14th to me is not anything close to blind unless one defines blind as not seeing the green from the tee.  The landing zone is clearly visible from the tee, and the green, while difficult to get a feel for from the fairway, isn't at all blind. 

The 16th does have a blind drive unless one hits it further than I go for holidays!  The approach can be blind, but it isn't the sort of shot I would call a "blind shot" because as you point out, a well placed drive earns a view of much of the green.   

[Sean_A]

Wayne

I am still going through Merion in my mind.  One of the things which struck me was that there didn't seem to be THAT many bunkers on the course.  Just out of curiosity, just exactly how many are there?   Also, how many come in the first 4 holes?  I may be wrong, but perhaps what seemed like a load of bunkers on the opening holes is why it didn't seem that there were loads on the rest of the course. 

Ciao

[wsmorrison]

Sean,

From memory, I think there are 118 bunkers:

1.   13
2.   9
3.   5
4.   12
5.   5
6.   7
8.   5
9.   5
10.  5
11.  2 + 4 shared with 12
12.  2 + 4 shared with 11
13.  5
14.  7
15.  6
16.  13
17.  5
18.  4

I guess that's a lot of bunkers.  Even though some are quite large, they don't overwhelm in the way that MacKenzie or Tillinghast bunkers tend to.  Their placement is excellent and they don't interfere with ground movement and thus deflection as do the bunkers at Bethpage Black for instance.  Merion bunkers, though in the original locations and considering today's technologies, are still very much in play and in some cases (cross bunker on 1) are even more meaningful today.  This is the genius of the bunkering few discuss.  How a bunker scheme can remain strategic and interesting 90 years later on some courses by design (Merion and Oakmont for example) or by nature/randomness (The Old Course) while other bunker designs become outmoded and others are overdone.  I hope we can start a discussion on this on a new thread.  It is a subject that has long interested me.

[Sean_A]

Sean,

From memory, I think there are 118 bunkers:

1.   13
2.   9
3.   5
4.   12
5.   5
6.   7
8.   5
9.   5
10.  5
11.  2 + 4 shared with 12
12.  2 + 4 shared with 13
13.  5
14.  7
15.  6
16.  13
17.  5
18.  4

I guess that's a lot of bunkers.  Even though some are quite large, they don't overwhelm in the way that MacKenzie or Tillinghast bunkers tend to.  Their placement is excellent and they don't interfere with ground movement and thus deflection as do the bunkers at Bethpage Black for instance.  Merion bunkers, though in the original locations and considering today's technologies, are still very much in play and in some cases (cross bunker on 1) are even more meaningful today.  This is the genius of the bunkering few discuss.  How a bunker scheme can remain strategic and interesting 90 years later on some courses by design (Merion and Oakmont for example) or by nature/randomness (The Old Course) while other bunker designs become outmoded and others are overdone.  I hope we can start a discussion on this on a new thread.  It is a subject that has long interested me.

Wayne

Cheers, that helps out a bit.  So 1/3 of the bunkers come in the opening four holes.  This is an interesting dynamic.  Do you know of any reason how this came about?

I don't think the bunkering at Merion tends (though there are a few cases where I believe the bunkering does just this) to overwhelm the greens/fairways like Dr Mac can do is because so many bunkers are isolated from the ideal angles of play.  It would be interesting to see a hole by hole evolution of the bunkering at Merion. 

Ciao

[Jon Wiggett]

Wayne,

I am a little confused by the bunker numbers you have given. You say that 11 has 2 + 4 shared with 12 meaning that 12 has atleast 4 but you give 12 as having 2 + 4 shared with 13 leaving only two ways I can think of that this could be. Either 2 of the shared bunkers ar shared by all three holes or its a typo. I am hoping for the former.

[Ted Kramer]

Having never been there, and only judging from pics and discussions on this site, Merion is probably the one course that I am most sure I would fall in love with after just one round. It seems to exude everything that I'd want in a golf course and club experience. Thanks for sharing the photos!

-Ted

[wsmorrison]

Jon,

Typo.  I meant that 12 has 2 + 4 shared with 11.  Sorry for the confusion. 

[TEPaul]

Wayne:

Off the top of my head I'd have said Merion East had about 100-110 bunkers. That's quite a lot for a course of that age not on sandy soil. My course probably has about 70 and perhaps it was a bit more by Ross if one considers all those "top shot" bunkers that're all gone now.

[Jon Wiggett]

Jon,

Typo.  I meant that 12 has 2 + 4 shared with 11.  Sorry for the confusion. 

Thanks for clearing that up Wayne. I was hoping it wasn't as I could not figure out how it would be possible and so hoped for a new wow moment. Maybe this is a new way for developers to create headlines. Imagine it a golf course with say four quadruple greens and each bunker sharde by atleast 3 holes. Now thats a challenge for a GCA

[Anthony_Nysse]

I'm hearing that fairway lines are being adjusted to fall into the bunkers, along with some creek banks. If you look at the recent google maps aerials, they're is some major fairways contouring that was being adjusted this fall

[Stephen Britton]

Does anyone know what plant that is growing in the bunker on no.14 with the yellow flower?

[GBoring]

Stephen,

I believe it is Scotch Broom.

[Tom ORourke]

There was a show this week on Comcast in Philly, Inside Golf. Much of the show was devoted to the maintenance shed at Merion, and their tools. Very neat. The last minutes of the segment covered the course changes for the open. It looked to have been filmed around a month ago. The fairway on #2 has been moved in around 15 yards from the left, forcing players to aim more toward the out of bounds. I think it takes driver away for many, even though not that many drivers would have been in play. The fairway on #11 has been moved way to the left, over near the creek. very different angle for a tee shot. The new tee on #14 has been discussed here before, and the Stop sign will be removed for the open. There was a minor fairway shift on #18 and the rough over the quarry has been cut back, extending the view of the fairway back in view of the tee. The change that I found interesting was at #5. I always thought that to be the hardest hole I have ever played, with the slope, the difficulty of the green, and the creek in play on every shot. The rough on the left side of the fairway is gone. The fairway is cut right into the bunkers so anything heading that way will roll in. But there is also nothing to stop the ball from going into the creek. This is going to be nasty. The play off the tee there is to be as far left off the tee as you can, and I am not sure that is an option now. And when you play away from the creek you increase the slope causing more of a hook toward the creek on the second shot. The rough to the left of the fairway on #11 is gone as well, bringing the creek more into play. It looks like the graduated rough setup is being shelved in at least a few places. Might be very interesting.

[Joe Bausch]

There was a show this week on Comcast in Philly, Inside Golf. Much of the show was devoted to the maintenance shed at Merion, and their tools. Very neat. The last minutes of the segment covered the course changes for the open. It looked to have been filmed around a month ago. The fairway on #2 has been moved in around 15 yards from the left, forcing players to aim more toward the out of bounds. I think it takes driver away for many, even though not that many drivers would have been in play. The fairway on #11 has been moved way to the left, over near the creek. very different angle for a tee shot. The new tee on #14 has been discussed here before, and the Stop sign will be removed for the open. There was a minor fairway shift on #18 and the rough over the quarry has been cut back, extending the view of the fairway back in view of the tee. The change that I found interesting was at #5. I always thought that to be the hardest hole I have ever played, with the slope, the difficulty of the green, and the creek in play on every shot. The rough on the left side of the fairway is gone. The fairway is cut right into the bunkers so anything heading that way will roll in. But there is also nothing to stop the ball from going into the creek. This is going to be nasty. The play off the tee there is to be as far left off the tee as you can, and I am not sure that is an option now. And when you play away from the creek you increase the slope causing more of a hook toward the creek on the second shot. The rough to the left of the fairway on #11 is gone as well, bringing the creek more into play. It looks like the graduated rough setup is being shelved in at least a few places. Might be very interesting.

You can watch the show online here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWiApvqqAS0&feature=youtu.be&a

[Chris Tritabaugh]

Great video, thanks for sharing. No two ways about it those new rough lines look terrible, even to someone who has only seen pictures of the course.

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