[David Ober]

For you California guys, how about ranking the following in order of preference. I will include my ranking, but will leave out Spyglass since I haven't played it yet (but will be playing it soon, Woohoo!!).

Here goes:

Spyglass???

1. MPCC - Shore
2. Pebble Beach
3. MPCC - Dunes   
4. Pasatiempo
5. Lakeside
6. Riviera
7. Barona
8. Oak Valley
9. Rancho Santa Fe (played it three times, but about 10 years ago -- should probably be ranked higher)
10. Rustic Canyon
11. Hillcrest
12. Stevinson Ranch
13. Pauma Valley
14. Morgan Creek
15. Torrey Pines South
16. Oakmont
17. North Ranch
18. Oak Quarry
19. Mission Hills Tournament Course
20. The Golf Club of California

I'm guessing many of you will think I have Lakeside listed way too high, but I just love that course. Tight, fun, bizarre, challenging -- and great history. Particularly love the 75 yard par 3 and the 250 yard par 3 9th.

Let's discuss....

[Lynn_Shackelford]

Cypress Point and SFGC.

Dog tracks?

[David Ober]

Cypress Point and SFGC.

Dog tracks?

Haven't played 'em, or I'm sure they would be on my list. Ditto Olympic, Los Angeles, Wilshire, et al. :-)

[Tom_Doak]

There aren't five courses in California better than Riviera -- including the ones you haven't played -- even with the couple of unfortunate changes they've made in recent years.

What the heck is The Golf Club of California?

[Adam Clayman]

Cal Club

[David Ober]

There aren't five courses in California better than Riviera -- including the ones you haven't played -- even with the couple of unfortunate changes they've made in recent years.

What the heck is The Golf Club of California?

If they could figure out a way to keep the kikuyu away from the approach areas, then I'd probably rate it #2 on my list.

But I really don't know what I'm talking about anyway. I just love golf. :-)

[David Stamm]

For you California guys, how about ranking the following in order of preference. I will include my ranking, but will leave out Spyglass since I haven't played it yet (but will be playing it soon, Woohoo!!).

Here goes:

Spyglass???

1. MPCC - Shore
2. Pebble Beach
3. MPCC - Dunes   
4. Pasatiempo
5. Lakeside
6. Riviera
7. Barona
8. Oak Valley
9. Rancho Santa Fe (played it three times, but about 10 years ago -- should probably be ranked higher)
10. Rustic Canyon
11. Hillcrest
12. Stevinson Ranch
13. Pauma Valley
14. Morgan Creek
15. Torrey Pines South
16. Oakmont
17. North Ranch
18. Oak Quarry
19. Mission Hills Tournament Course
20. The Golf Club of California

I'm guessing many of you will think I have Lakeside listed way too high, but I just love that course. Tight, fun, bizarre, challenging -- and great history. Particularly love the 75 yard par 3 and the 250 yard par 3 9th.

Let's discuss....

I haven't played MPCC (either course), Lakeside, Hillcrest, Stevinson Ranch, Morgan Creek, Oakmont or North Ranch. My ranking would not be based on best per se, but what I like the most.

Pasatiempo
Riviera (tied with Pasa)
Pebble Beach
Rustic Canyon
Pauma Valley
Barona Creek
Rancho Santa Fe
Oak Valley
Torrey Pines South


...the rest is a pick 'em thing.

[David Stamm]

What the heck is The Golf Club of California?

Tom, it's a Landmark course by Wade Cable and Johnny Pott in Fallbrook, Ca. It's about 15 minutes west of Pauma Valley.

[John Kirk]

I'm surprised neither Toscana nor Stone Eagle are on this list.

[David Ober]

I'm surprised neither Toscana nor Stone Eagle are on this list.

Haven't played Stone Eagle.

Have only played Toscana once and don't feel comfortable adding it to the list yet. After the Mid-Am, maybe.

[David Stamm]

I would insert Spyglass between Rustic and Pauma, btw.

John Kirk, I would place Stone Eagle between Pebble and Rustic on my list, fwiw.

[David Ober]

I'm surprised neither Toscana nor Stone Eagle are on this list.

Just visited the Stone Eagle website.

Wow. Gorgeous.

[Mike Benham]

No right or wrong answer here ...


Pasatiempo
Pebble Beach
MPCC - Dunes   
Spyglass
Rustic Canyon
MPCC - Shore
Barona
Morgan Creek
Stevinson Ranch
Hillcrest
Oakmont - in the Valley of the Moon?

[Peter Zarlengo]

I've never played in CA, but was fascinated by the pictures of The Valley Club in Ran's review.  Why no love for Montecito?

[David Stamm]

I've never played in CA, but was fascinated by the pictures of The Valley Club in Ran's review.  Why no love for Montecito?

Peter, I think Ober was sticking to what he has played. I have not had the privilege of playing  Valley Club, but have seen alot of the course when I walked around it one day. I suspect Valley Club would be in the top 5 or 6 in the state quite easily.

[Tom Huckaby]

I have a very hard time putting MPCC-Shore as #1, as I don't even think it's #1 in it's club.  That is, I sincerely and honestly do find the Dunes to be the slightly superior course on the overall.  So my re-ranking of the courses on David's list would go pretty much as Mike says, only I have to put Pebble Beach #1.  I'd also switch MPCC-Shore and Rustic Canyon.  But close enough.   

Obviously many courses David has yet to play merit the inclusion in any ranking... yes Valley Club, CPC, SFGC, Olympic Lake, etc.

TH

ps - the Oakmont David lists must be the one in Glendale.  Pretty good course, but falls off the list once we add in Valley Club and the NorCal greats.

[Mike Benham]

ps - the Oakmont David lists must be the one in Glendale. 

I didn't think David was old enough to play Oakmont in the Valley of the Moon ...

[Craig Van Egmond]

Tom,

         Is that the general consensus that the Dunes course is still better than the Shore course?  I played them back before Stranz came in and although the old Shore course wasn't horrible by any stretch the Dunes courses was clearly the better course, on of my favorites.  Is there anything in particular that makes the Dunes course better?

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom,

         Is that the general consensus that the Dunes course is still better than the Shore course?  I played them back before Stranz came in and although the old Shore course wasn't horrible by any stretch the Dunes courses was clearly the better course, on of my favorites.  Is there anything in particular that makes the Dunes course better?

Craig:

Before the Strantz re-do, the consensus was pretty clear that the Dunes was the better course.  After that, the consensus - particularly in this forum - has shifted the other way.  It seems to be pretty much only me and Benham who favor the Dunes.  But I could have this wrong - others feel free to chime in.

TH

[Jed Peters]

Of what I've played on your list....

Pebble Beach
MPCC - Shore   
Pasatiempo
Morgan Creek
Stevinson Ranch
Mission Hills Tournament Course

[Adrian_Stiff]

If you do a 'ranking' and omitt ones you have not played its gonna get complicated..... One thing that could be done is a GCA ranking, wherby everyone ranked courses they have played on using the 'Doak scale' To get an official ranking you need 10 different ranks... the ranking is maintained by always taking the middle 10 votes, so a course with say 20 votes has its best 5 and worst 5 ommitted.... it would take a lot of time but it might end up being very accurate eventually.

[Craig Van Egmond]

Tom,

           The Dunes course was one of the few courses that really exceeded my expectations, so the Shore course would have to be as spectacular as it looks. Either way, I'd say the members of MPCC are pretty well off with two stellar courses that seem to be in nice contrast to one another. If there is a better 36 hole complex on the left coast I am not aware of it.

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom,

           The Dunes course was one of the few courses that really exceeded my expectations, so the Shore course would have to be as spectacular as it looks. Either way, I'd say the members of MPCC are pretty well off with two stellar courses that seem to be in nice contrast to one another. If there is a better 36 hole complex on the left coast I am not aware of it.

Craig - right on, my friend.  The new Shore is pretty darn spectacular, so it's not crazy at all to say it's better than the Dunes.  I just do think in the honeymoon over the new Shore some do forget how great the Dunes is.  In any case, oh yes, MPCC rules the west coast in terms of 36 hole clubs... and I'd dare say it holds up it's head pretty darn high nation-wide?  What is better?  Winged Foot?  Probably... but by not that much of a margin... any others?

TH

[David Stamm]

Tom,

           The Dunes course was one of the few courses that really exceeded my expectations, so the Shore course would have to be as spectacular as it looks. Either way, I'd say the members of MPCC are pretty well off with two stellar courses that seem to be in nice contrast to one another. If there is a better 36 hole complex on the left coast I am not aware of it.

Craig - right on, my friend.  The new Shore is pretty darn spectacular, so it's not crazy at all to say it's better than the Dunes.  I just do think in the honeymoon over the new Shore some do forget how great the Dunes is.  In any case, oh yes, MPCC rules the west coast in terms of 36 hole clubs... and I'd dare say it holds up it's head pretty darn high nation-wide?  What is better?  Winged Foot?  Probably... but by not that much of a margin... any others?

TH

While I haven't played either, I would suspect Huck's assesment is spot on. I can't imagine a better 36 hole club. While LACC is a solid 36 hole club (one great course and one good course), I would think overall MPCC would be one tough hombre to beat and has the edge. WF? I don't know, I haven't played there either, but I can't imagine it being miles better.

[Jed Peters]

Merion? Sure is talked about enough here....

Baltusrol?

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