Will American Golfers Ever Accept This?

[Norbert P]

 A bunker with heather at Woking . . .


Photo from www.golfarchitecturepictures.com

I like the idea of a mixed hazard because it is more apt to enter into the mind of the golfer than the predictable sand shot.  If anybody has ever played out of heather, you know its unpredictability of escape or advancement. 

I realize that heather won't grow everywhere, but where appropriate, or with another playable low-growing shrub, will this hazard design ever be accepted by golfers outside of Britain and Ireland?

[Tom_Doak]

Heather is a great plant for golf, as long as it doesn't get too long or thick ... I still cringe at memories of a friend having a bad day off the tee at Walton Heath.

Heather, iceplant, etc. ... my guess is that PLANT MATERIALS are the true "next innovation" in golf.

[RJ_Daley]

My personal feelings about it, I wouldn't want to see it too often.  I guess it is OK in limitted quantities for giving the natural flavor to the design, where the plant is native.  But, importing and purposely planting it wouldn't be too well accepted, IMHO.  I sure wouldn't want a steady diet of it.

[Norbert P]

 It would be brutal to see it hole after hole but I don't think I've ever seen this in America. I wouldn't consider this a double hazard either. Each has its own risk factor without blocking the next shot.  The closest thing I've seen stateside is tall grass rough, which I consider effective but this combo piqued my curiosity for acceptance.  I think it's pretty cool; perhaps because of its rarity.  I also like the fact that the heather covers about the same area as the sand bunker, not just a trim feature.

[David Stamm]

It's not heather, but it's the same premise at Rustic Canyon. I haven't heard any complaints, but then I play the course with those that both love and appreciate the design.

[Norbert P]

 Thanks David.  Yea, that works for me.  I wonder if Rosemary would be a good hazard shrub. It's tough and can take some drought - and at the end of the day your clubs'll smell nice.

  I remember when I played Rustic, I hit a bad shot, (imagine that) and I had to hit out of a melon plant.   Probably the oddest plant I'd ever hit out of. 

[David Stamm]

   It's tough and can take some drought - and at the end of the day your clubs'll smell nice.

  

That's rich! I would imagine if you had a day of hitting out of Rosemary the sudden craving for a hearty Italian meal woud ensue after a long day in the hazards!

[Sean_A]

As Tom states, I think it could fly in the States if the stuff was controlled and it doesn't combine with trees - which is a bit of a problem in the heathlands.  So far as the bunkering us concerned, there are generally so few bunkers on heathland courses that the actual issue of heather surrounding bunkers is a non issue - plus many of the bunkers don't have heather. 

Incidentally, this pic illustrates wonderfully how mundane many of these heathland bunkers are - they need the heather for added interest.  Take away the beauty of the heather and bad luck aspect  and the bunker itself is very ho hum. 

Ciao

[Dan Herrmann]

But we need to be careful with introducing non-native plants.  Shoot, wasn't the heather and its tendency to catch fire that led to the Bandon golf complex in the first place?

We don't want another killer bee type episode.

What would be a good plant to use in the northern USA or Canada that hasn't been used in the past?

[Bill Brightly]

I'm sure it would lots of fun to be in thr group behind the guy who takes his five minutes searching for a ball in that stuff...

[Sean_A]

I'm sure it would lots of fun to be in thr group behind the guy who takes his five minutes searching for a ball in that stuff...

Bill

If the heather is controlled it generally isn't too hard to find your ball.  For the most part it is far easier to find a ball in heather than in links gunge.  The real problem with heather is getting the ball out.  If your ball manages to lodge under the branches it can be a devil of a time to get a club on it.  Its odd stuff because its most ferocious and beautiful when blooming.  Most of the time heather isn't particularly attractive, but it is a tamer hazard then.  For my part, I know when there is healthy heather about then the course is draining about as well as it naturally can - this is by far the biggest benefit. 

Dan, of course there are likely few places in North America in which planting heather is viable.  Perhaps there are more native plants that could serve the same purpose of helping to create challenge, beauty and drainage. 

Ciao

[TEPaul]

Slag:

You know in the last dozen years or so Merion East had some bunkers that had really rough vegetation that looked something like that first photo above (actually those few Merion bunkers had even rougher vegetation in them). I remember them in the sides one or two fairway bunkers on the right side of #10 and right of #14 green. That stuff is gone now.

There's a fairly famous photo of David Graham trying to play out of one of them the year he won the US Open at Merion (1981).

David Stamm:

Thanks for those photos of Rustic Canyon. Man, that course really does look like everything the designers of it were hoping it could be. I really would like to know how most of those who play Rustic Canyon feel about it. Certainly enough time has gone by now to tell. If a lot of them don't like it or even don't like it a lot more than some of the other courses out there it really would be sort of depressing as some of those who conceived the idea of it, like Shackelford, were obviously hoping if public golf out there could be given something that different from the usual that they would really react positively. But if for whatever reasons they haven't then that really does tell us something.

[Phil McDade]

David:

I noticed in a few of your pictures of Rustic Canyon a rake, which strongly implies that the usual rules about bunker play -- such as grounding a club -- apply. Yet other parts of the bunkering (such as the sandy-looking areas near the plants within the bunkers) look like they could be "through the green" material.

What's the rule about the bunkering at Rustic Canyon? (The third picture in particular stoked my interest in this, with that rake there and then a bunch of areas that look non-bunkerish...)

Thanks for the photos; I like the look of those bunkers.

[Kalen Braley]

Dan,

It was the gorse at Bandon that caused the problems in the past, and it is non-native.  While it works great on the compex to give it a more authentic scottish links look and feel, it burns very hot and is very difficult to get rid of.

[Doug Ralston]

Went into some non-descript rough on a course in Indiana once and contacted some stinging nettle [I think]. Fealt like poison ivy that onsets instantaneously. Lends a new meaning to hazard.

Biological defenses could get pretty extreme.

Doug

[David Stamm]

David:

I noticed in a few of your pictures of Rustic Canyon a rake, which strongly implies that the usual rules about bunker play -- such as grounding a club -- apply. Yet other parts of the bunkering (such as the sandy-looking areas near the plants within the bunkers) look like they could be "through the green" material.

What's the rule about the bunkering at Rustic Canyon? (The third picture in particular stoked my interest in this, with that rake there and then a bunch of areas that look non-bunkerish...)

Thanks for the photos; I like the look of those bunkers.

Phil, there are some areas that were/are bunkers that the line of definition has been somewhat blurred due to the floods. Meaning that some bunkers were bunkers (and still are in a functional sense) when the course was first built, but the floods blended them into natural washes and the riverbed that runs through the property. If I see rakes, I rake where I've been. I haven't played the course as long as some here who might be able to tell you the differences between now and before the flooding occured.

[Mike Nuzzo]

I hope so, but that does look a little thick.

I learned of an interesting plant that I hoped would work for us here in TX, but bermuda is a very aggressive environment.  I'm planning on trying some experiments - it did look quite a bit like heather when mature.

[Ally Mcintosh]

I love the heather / heathland look but it only works if it is natural and ties in to the surrounds.

Queenwood have imported heather on to their bunker faces but have not yet tied it in to the rough and playing edges so it looks unnatural. I believe they are attempting this at present.

[Mark Bourgeois]

Don't assume there's no grumbling about these bunkers amongst the Woking membership!

Here's another one: the fairway "grass" at Woking used to be...closely-mown heather.

Mark

[Rob_Waldron]

The biggest issue I have with overgrown vegetation on a course is how to apply the "Rules of Golf" if a ball is hit into it. If the ball cannot be found is it considered to be lost in a hazard whereby the rules applying to hazards are used. If it is not considered to be a hazard and just a lost ball then the rules for a lost ball must ne used. The latter not only frustrates the player but slows down play due to the fact the the player must return to the location of his previous stroke.

Many architects have incorporated tall fescue and "love" (or is it hate) grass into their designs creating lost ball city! There must be a better way!

[TEPaul]

"The biggest issue I have with overgrown vegetation on a course is how to apply the "Rules of Golf" if a ball is hit into it. If the ball cannot be found is it considered to be lost in a hazard whereby the rules applying to hazards are used."

Rob:

That's a water hazard. See the exceptions to Rule 27-1.

[Garland Bayley]

Heather is a great plant for golf, as long as it doesn't get too long or thick ... I still cringe at memories of a friend having a bad day off the tee at Walton Heath.

Heather, iceplant, etc. ... my guess is that PLANT MATERIALS are the true "next innovation" in golf.

"The biggest issue I have with overgrown vegetation on a course is how to apply the "Rules of Golf" if a ball is hit into it. If the ball cannot be found is it considered to be lost in a hazard whereby the rules applying to hazards are used."

Rob:

That's a water hazard. See the exceptions to Rule 27-1.

Perhaps if the rules of golf were revised to allow for vegetative hazards, the plant materials innovation could come about more readily.

[Dan]

As someone who plays at a course that features deep heather like this (Hindhead GC), both on bunker faces and on various mounds, I strongly agree with the sentiment of Mark and Rob's comments.

It may look pretty, particularly when the heather is flowering, but if it gets too deep then it does little or nothing to enhance the enjoyment or interest of actually playing the course.

On the rare occasions when the ball is found, the next move is typically either a drop or a hack out with a wedge. This is not so bad as a fairway hazard (not least because there is usually an option to play well away from it), but I really do not like it close to the green.

The picture below shows a greenside example from the 12th at Hindhead. The bunker itself is about 3 yards from the left edge of the green, but the mound that makes up the face of the bunker directly adjoins the fringe, meaning that you can lose your ball within a yard of the green. The whole of the back of the green is also surrounded by similar mounding covered in deep heather.

[Norbert P]

 When I first saw the original photo from Frank Pont's website, I thought, "now that is a hazard not to reckon with. Not worth flirting with that one."  And Woking being a Paton/Low redesign, with much documentation on theory of hazards by Low, I'm thinking this could be used elsewhere to great effect in extreme moderation.  I don't know if Paton or Low planted the heather there, probably not, as sand bunkers were real hazards to players back then.  I wouldn't want to see this everywhere but when good players start aiming to get into bunkers, then I think another hazardous medium can be effective.  I wouldn't like to see it become prevalent lining fairways, but perhaps strategically spotted at those short par 4's that the pros bomb away on.  Or next to a bunker or kickboard at your home club.

 Any examples where this might work?

Danial, nice photo and I can understand the sentiment when the heather gets out of control. Looks great until your golf ball finds it.

[Jay Flemma]

I have no problem with it.  Full speed ahead:)