2015 US Open to Chambers Bay

[Garland Bayley]

I am in SHOCK!!!

....

Wow... it is about time the place with the best summer weather in the country got to host the US Open.

Richard,

You got that right!

Kalen, I don't care if you lived in Eastern Washington and California. The best, most consistent, US Open weather would be west of the Cascade Mts.

[Kirk Gill]

With permission, I am going to pick on Kyle's comments about getting to CB now.

Along with his previous desire to visit CB, he makes it a priority now that the USGA has made this announcement. Any denying the marketing power of hosting an event of this stature? Can you imagine how many golfers in the Pac NW are going the same route as Kyle? And couple that with Jason's observation of granting an Open to a course not even played for a full season and you start to know how the golf industry works.

$$$$$$$$$$

As opposed to all those other industries that AREN'T about money.  

Still, I get your point. But one of the realities of the US Open being played on public-access courses is that people get the experience of playing on the same venues as their heroes, attempting the same shots as they saw during the big tourney. Is this somehow wrong? Part of the joy of playing St. Andrews is thinking of all those players who have tread the same ground. Is this an enthusiasm that I should somehow mute within myself?

Or am I misinterpreting your comments?

[Richard Choi]

Should arrange another GCA outing at Chambers Bay this year to accomodate all the renewed interest?

[Joe Hancock]

Kirk,

I think you get my gist OK. And yes, everyone needs and desires money. The part that bothers me is the pre-hype that actually seems to work so well in golf. CB and Erin Hills both presented themselves as something worthy of the highest level of competition before the first round was played. I don't understand that. I guess, ideally, I would favor a track record that proves itself on the local level before it jumps so high on the national level.

It really doesn't matter one way or the other to me, I just don't comprehend how all this works.

Joe

[Jeff Goldman]

This seems to me to be potentially steps along the road to development of a sort of rota of TPC-type USGA tournament courses, including possibly Chambers Bay, Erin Hills, Bethpage (and Torrey maybe).  It could be a very good thing if it significantly lowers the pressure to modify some of our most beloved classic era courses in preparation for hosting these tournaments (if they change 11 holes at Erin Hills, who cares?).  

[tlavin]

Gee, imagine my surprise when I got back in town and saw a thread that was positive about the USGA.  As I live and breathe!

[Kalen Braley]

Garland,

If you think an average of 2 inches of rain per month and 59 degrees is ideal US Open weather, then I can't help you.  I do think the course works anyways being sand-based and will be fast and firm, but I'm not buying for 1 second its "optimal" conditions.

[Richard Choi]

The average high for middle of June is 72 to 74 degrees. And most of the rain in June is in the beginning of the month (left over from the winter/spring rains).

Late June is almost ideal weather for golf, not too hot, no humidity, and plenty of sun.

[Kalen Braley]

Richard,

I'd like to see your source.  I have attach the link to mine.  And they are playing in Tacoma, not Seattle.  Sometimes microclimates can be vastly different when you are outside a major metropolitan area.  This is from Ft. Lewis, only a few miles away from Chambers Bay.

http://www.worldclimate.com/cgi-bin/data.pl?ref=N47W122+1102+7279303G1

[Kirk Gill]

Joe, understood, and thanks.

I guess the message is that the USGA is serious about holding this event at public-access courses. Or is there another agenda that is too subtle for my blunt-instrument brain? What I'd love is the double-whammy combination of playing the US Open at some of our most fabled venues without having to compromise the architecture of those venues. If that can't be done, then Jeff Goldman is right as......rain.

[Ken Moum]

Richard,

I'd like to see your source.  I have attach the link to mine.  And they are playing in Tacoma, not Seattle.  Sometimes microclimates can be vastly different when you are outside a major metropolitan area.  This is from Ft. Lewis, only a few miles away from Chambers Bay.

http://www.worldclimate.com/cgi-bin/data.pl?ref=N47W122+1102+7279303G1

I believe you and Richard are talking about two different things. He's referring to average maximum temps for June, and it appears that the chart on worldclimate.com is an average of the 24-hour temps.

They don't list average maximums for Fort Lewis, but here's they are for McChord AFB
http://www.worldclimate.com/cgi-bin/data.pl?ref=N47W122+1200+0051676G2

As you can see, June is ~70*.

Ken

[Scott_Burroughs]

Kalen,

The average temperature you're looking at accounts for all time points in the day, including chillier morning temps.  From weather.com, it says that Tacoma averages 1.58" of rain in June.

While I like warmer temperatures, at least they won't have to worry about extreme heat possible in places such as Pinehurst or Tulsa, OK (and has also happened in Pittsburgh, the DC suburbs, Springfield, NJ, etc.).

[Kalen Braley]

Richard,

I'd like to see your source.  I have attach the link to mine.  And they are playing in Tacoma, not Seattle.  Sometimes microclimates can be vastly different when you are outside a major metropolitan area.  This is from Ft. Lewis, only a few miles away from Chambers Bay.

http://www.worldclimate.com/cgi-bin/data.pl?ref=N47W122+1102+7279303G1

I believe you and Richard are talking about two different things. He's referring to average maximum temps for June, and it appears that the chart on worldclimate.com is an average of the 24-hour temps.

They don't list average maximums for Fort Lewis, but here's they are for McChord AFB
http://www.worldclimate.com/cgi-bin/data.pl?ref=N47W122+1200+0051676G2

As you can see, June is ~70*.

Ken

Kmourn,

Understood those are the average "max" temps, but the US Open is played over a roughly 12 hour time slot.  I think a 24 hr average temp is more accurate than a max temp that is only reached for what 1 hour of the day?

And come on, even the average high in june was still under 70 for that area.  69.3.  

[Garland Bayley]

This seems to me to be potentially steps along the road to development of a sort of rota of TPC-type USGA tournament courses, including possibly Chambers Bay, Erin Hills, Bethpage (and Torrey maybe).  It could be a very good thing if it significantly lowers the pressure to modify some of our most beloved classic era courses in preparation for hosting these tournaments (if they change 11 holes at Erin Hills, who cares?). 

How dare you refer to Chambers Bay as a "TPC-type" course! 



 

[Tom_Doak]

Nothing against Chambers Bay in particular, but I think it's a bad thing -- only because it will make everybody developing a new public course drool unrealistically about hosting a U.S. Open themselves.

We don't need architects to create more potential U.S. Open venues.  We need the USGA to do something about preserving the ones we've got.

[Kalen Braley]

Kalen,

The average temperature you're looking at accounts for all time points in the day, including chillier morning temps.  From weather.com, it says that Tacoma averages 1.58" of rain in June.

While I like warmer temperatures, at least they won't have to worry about extreme heat possible in places such as Pinehurst or Tulsa, OK (and has also happened in Pittsburgh, the DC suburbs, Springfield, NJ, etc.).

Scott,

What do you think the temp will likely be closer to when that first group goes off at 7 AM?  59 degrees or 69?

And remember the early morning hours just before dawn are generally the coldest.

[Garland Bayley]

Kalen,

If you haven't lived there in June, then you are unqualified to comment!

Pat Mucci

[Kalen Braley]

Kalen,

If you haven't lived there in June, then you are unqualified to comment!

Pat Mucci

Lol...good one Garland.

I should have known that thermometers in the Pacific Northwest always read 10-15 degrees lower than what it actually is.   

[Scott_Burroughs]

Kalen,

I bet the Tour pros will LOVE the (cooler) weather.  Having to wear long pants, the June temps there are great for that.   Sweater vest that can come off once it warms up, but never too hot.  Pebble Beach has similar weather in June for the U.S. Open.

Ask them if they liked Tulsa last August.

[Jeff Goldman]

Hey Garland,

I wasn't talking about the quality of the course, just the idea that there could be "tournament" courses groomed for holding these events.   On a related front, the USGA might be in very good shape on this issue anyways, with Mike Davis as tourney director.  Hard to find more "classic" greens than at Oakmont, and I don't think we heard a peep about flattening any.  

Jeff

[Kalen Braley]

Scott,

No doubt they will prefer it over the hotter venues.  I was just going after those Seattle/Portland guys who think June is ideal in that part of the country.    

Temps in the 60s, very likely to be overcast with off an on rain....I'm not seeing it.

[Norbert P]

USGA AWARDS 2015 U.S. OPEN, 2010 U.S. AMATEUR TO CHAMBERS BAY IN WASHINGTON STATE

I'm very interested in the 2010 Amateur selection, in just 2 years.  It will be a good practice run for the US Open.  I realize they'll be set up differently, but there are so many factors to consider beyond how the golf course plays.  

 I can't wait to hear and see a rumbling freight train blow its horn in Sergio's backswing on the 16th tee.

 Tom makes an interesting point about setting a precedent.

[RJ_Daley]

Geez, you guys are going back and forth on weather 8 years from now!  Didn't you hear about global climate change coming?  

Nothing against Chambers Bay in particular, but I think it's a bad thing -- only because it will make everybody developing a new public course drool unrealistically about hosting a U.S. Open themselves.

We don't need architects to create more potential U.S. Open venues.  We need the USGA to do something about preserving the ones we've got.

I could agree if the statement by TomD were surely the way archies will direct their design goals.  But, I really don't think that GCA is going to be oriented towards every muni or public venue course shooting for a US Open.  Muni's in general can't afford it and CB is an abberation, I believe, in terms of how much the muni was able to project for a high end budget.  

Maybe developers like Kohler and Kaiser and the like might still think in terms of their next dream course hosting the big one.  But, they better be pretty young if they want to see it in their life times.  And, even they might consider the cost of acquiring a property in an urban area where such could be hosted, let alone the design/construction cost.  These guys do still not desire to go broke, don't they?  In a way, Kohler is lucky he has lived long enough to see WS host some big ones.  

[Jim Nugent]

Is there often/usually lots of wind there that time of year?  What are the greens like, and what might they stimp at?  If the pro's in 2015 hit the ball about the same distance as now, is CB long enough, or will they have to add new tees?  (And if they do need new tees, whatever the reason, is there space for them?) 

[Pete_Pittock]

I am happy for the people of Tacoma. Right now the infrastructure is inadequate for any major event. They will need to build a better clubhouse with locker room facilities. Traffic is going to be tough, but that seems to be a problem. Who gets dibs on the wharf?

Update: I went to the Portland Golf Show today and Jay Blasi was manning the Chamber Bay booth. Smile as wide as a coathanger. They already have an RFP out for the clubhouse.

I can't speak about Tacoma weather, but having lived in Portland Oregon for 60 years, we have a saying that summer doesn't start until after Rose Festival, which is early June. It's not the date that is important, just the event. Many June days have a marine cloud layer which burns off around noon. I'm guessing maybe a 20% chance of .25 inches at our premier auto event (Champ Cars) in mid-late June.