Mid-Pacific CC, Oahu---? how much Raynor?

[Peter_Herreid]

Amazing that the post brought back up today on "Raynor's most engineered course" happened to include Evan Fleisher's mention of having played Mid-Pacific CC on Oahu many years ago.

My brothers and I will be playing there over the Christmas holiday and I was curious as to whether there is anything left to see of his design--I would suspect not much...

Perhaps Evan, George Bahto or someone else who has played MPCC could chime in...

Thanks!

[Kyle Harris]

Peter, a cursory glance at the aerial shows that there probably isn't much left.

The first par 3 on the one nine looks like it was at one point a Biarritz (far north portion of the property) and then there's one that goes right out to the cliff line that could have been the Eden, but I can't distinguish between the Redan, Eden and Short from the aerial which I would assume one would be able to do quite easily if their were any Raynor left.

For a comparison, take a look at Wailaie (sp?) CC in Honolulu.

[Evan Fleisher]

Let's see if my 38 (almost 39) year old memory can recall the course from nearly seven years ago...hmmm...not all that much Raynor left, but was an enjoyable member's course nonetheless.

Sorry i cannot offer much else than that...truth be told I was less into architecture back then and was probably not "looking" around as much as I should have.  But since nothing is really sticking out for me, that should give you SOME indication.

[George_Bahto]

Like Waialae, both designed by Raynor before he died, not much left

At Mid Pacific Raynor designed 9 holes - nine were later added by ?  

Construction began in 1926 (probably Banks or one of their construction foreman - they haven't been able to figure it out yet)

By Sept 1928, eight holes (interesting number) were open for play

I'll check my files for later material. I've been in contact with their historian over the years

Tony Pioppi: did a contingent from there come to one of the Raynor Soc meeting not long ago??

[Russell Lo]

As far as the Par 3s go the 4th hole is the Redan. Like Waialae's 8th (tourney 17) the Redan slopes from back to front. It can play up to 175-185 with the normal trades in your face. The next hole, an island par 5 was originally a par 4 and par 3 (island) according to a Honolulu Advertiser Bill Kwon article and a comment from George a few years back.

The next par 3 follows that par 5 and is straight into the wind and can stretch to 210+. If you take away the shrubbery behind the green it could be viewed as an Eden.

The next Par 3 (11th) looks like it may have been a downhill Biarritz as there is a slight dip in the middle of the green.

Rick Smith re-did the next hole the Par 5 12th with gorgeous bunkers. I heard the members didn't like it as they said it didn't fit the feel of the rest of the course. Too bad.

Fun track, espescially when it's blowing.

Fun little side trip would be putting on your running shoes after the round and hiking (20-30 minutes) up to the old WW II bunker at the top of the hill near the entrance at the club. Absolutely stunning view of the Mokulua Islands, Lanikai, Kailua Beach and Olomana.

[Peter_Herreid]

Thanks, Russell, Evan, George, et al...

If I might throw another question out there to the residents of our 50th state (or anyone else in the know), what are your impressions of either Oahu CC, Honolulu CC or Kaneohe Klipper GC?  We want to get one more round in, and are looking to do something other than the resort route or busy municipal route, and maybe do something a bit more old-time O'ahu...

Thanks!

[Joel_Stewart]

I'm pretty sure that Robin Nelson was involved at Mid-Paciifc about 5 years ago with quite a bit of work.  Gib had offered to help with some Raynor information but he said there wasn't anything left.

[Sven Nilsen]

Copied below are a series of articles from late 1925 through 1927 covering Raynor's involvement with Mid-Pacific aka Kaiua CC (Raynor passed away early in 1926).  The articles answer a couple of outstanding questions from earlier in this thread, including (a) confirming that contrary to popular opinion Raynor originally designed 18 holes (with some of the templates noted in one of the articles) and (b) noting that construction of the course was not handled by Charles Banks but by one of his associates.

Honolulu Star-Bulletin Dec. 2, 1925 -



Honolulu Star-Bulletin Feb. 12, 1926 -



Honolulu Star-Bulletin Feb. 26, 1926 -



Honolulu Star-Bulletin March 12, 1926 -



Honolulu Star-Advertiser Jan. 23, 1927 -











Honolulu Star-Bulletin March 5, 1927 -

[Evan_Green]

Sven - thank you for posting these very interesting articles! Gives a great feel for the early days of golf in Hawaii.

[Evan_Green]

Below are a few photos of Mid Pac if anyone is interested to see the modern day course...

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

Great find.

I've found no record of Charles Banks traveling to Hawaii by boat at any time in his life. Contrary to the popular belief, as the newspaper article details, Banks was never in Hawai'i.

On the trail of the "Crescent of Content" booklet.

Cheers,

Anthony

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

From the Mid-Pacific website:




1948Willard Wilkinson is contracted to build second nine holesAfter World War II, Alex Beckley persuaded the Club to construct the back nine, which would give MPCC a full eighteen-hole golf course. Golf course architect Willard G. Wilkinson, who at the time was one of the only eighteen registered golf course architects in the entire United States, was engaged to build the second nine holes. He followed Seth Raynor’s original design closely.

[Bret Lawrence]

Sven,


Thanks for posting these articles.  Here are two aerial photographs from USGS dated 1951, showing the original holes on the front nine. As described in your articles and routing map, the players used to cross the stream twice to play holes 4, 5 and 6:
The first aerial includes most of the front nine:
http://magis.manoa.hawaii.edu/remotesensing/GeoserverFiles/ShpFiles/Oahu/023/jpegs/2668.jpg


The second aerial shows mostly the back nine:
http://magis.manoa.hawaii.edu/remotesensing/GeoserverFiles/ShpFiles/Oahu/023/jpegs/2669.jpg


The last aerial is from 1959:
http://magis.manoa.hawaii.edu/remotesensing/GeoserverFiles/ShpFiles/Oahu/082/jpegs/2510.jpg




Bret