UNFAIR golf course maintenance, NOT

[Garland Bayley]

This thread changes title with post #65 explaining why the title is changed.

I find that A high percentage of parkland golf courses are maintained in an unfair manner. The USGA says the lower branches of trees should be trimmed off to allow for recovery shots. I do not know if they specify a height to which they should be trimmed. I find however that at a large number of courses they are trimmed to a level that will not impede the swing of a relatively short golfer, but will impede the swing of a relatively tall golfer. Is this not unfair?

[Phil Benedict]

Just one more example of how life is unfair for tall people.  Being forced to sit in airplane seats built for people of average height; hitting our heads on low obstacles; limited clothing selection - the list goes on.

[Jim_Kennedy]

Garland,
No, that's why you have knees.

p.s. I've heard that Phil never hits into the woods, so it wouldn't matter to the big fella.

[Garland Bayley]

Garland,
No, that's why you have knees.

p.s. I've heard that Phil never hits into the woods, so it wouldn't matter to the big fella.

So I take it that you support a new decision in decisions on the rules of golf that all players must kneel when playing from under trees?!?!
 

[Jim_Kennedy]

Garland,
The operative word in the USGA's stance(pardon me) is "should".

If you want the trees limbed higher, buy taller rough mowers.    

[Trey Kemp]

I know what you mean, but a lot of courses don't have the budget to keep up with the trimming.   The USGA also recommends having USGA spec'd greens, but many still have push up or modified greens.  

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

Jim is right. You want trees limbed higher make sure to equip all rough mowers with roll bars then have the worker who has the least regard for the golf course operate it and  - viola! -  trees limbed to about six feet. Everybody who has ever mowed rough has tree pruning stories.

Anthony

[CHrisB]

Garland,

There are also places on golf courses where badly missed drives have a clear shot while barely missed drives have no shot, places where right-handers have to chip out while left-handers have a clear swing (and vice-versa), places where taller players can reach the ball while shorter players may not (think a ball on the side edge of a deep bunker), places where taller players can see the flag (or the hole when putting) where shorter players may not, etc.

Why would you want golf to be fair, anyway?

Are you losing money to an equally wild, much shorter golf buddy or something?

[Ron Farris]

Have you not heard - GOLF IS NOT FAIR

My son beat me in a match play competition we had the other night.  We were all square when I hit my ball into an unbelievable divot in the approach.  Damn Bentgrass approaches and poor mannered golfers.  I chunked it out over the green and into a bunker.  1Up he went.  Life is not fair sometimes, either!

[Grant Saunders]

I find that A high percentage of parkland golf courses are maintained in an unfair manner. The USGA says the lower branches of trees should be trimmed off to allow for recovery shots. I do not know if they specify a height to which they should be trimmed. I find however that at a large number of courses they are trimmed to a level that will not impede the swing of a relatively short golfer, but will impede the swing of a relatively tall golfer. Is this not unfair?

What do you determine as a "swing"?

Do you feel the golfer should be entitled to a full unimpeded swing as you encounter in the middle of the fairway?

For a golfer whose 6ft 2, plus the additional 45 inches of shaft length when the club points upright at around shoulder level this would lead to having to prune trees up to at least  8 1/2 foot (2.5 metres) give or take. Most courses I have played would have to undertake a pretty major pruning program to achieve this.

I like to at least see trees pruned up from ground level to enable players to find balls and have some kind of half swing to chip out.

[Grant Saunders]

I find that A high percentage of parkland golf courses are maintained in an unfair manner. The USGA says the lower branches of trees should be trimmed off to allow for recovery shots. I do not know if they specify a height to which they should be trimmed. I find however that at a large number of courses they are trimmed to a level that will not impede the swing of a relatively short golfer, but will impede the swing of a relatively tall golfer. Is this not unfair?

[Mark_Fine]

Garland,
See the other thread on fairness  
Mark

[Garland Bayley]

Garland,

There are also places on golf courses where badly missed drives have a clear shot while barely missed drives have no shot, irrelevant to the topic of maintenance at hand

places where right-handers have to chip out while left-handers have a clear swing (and vice-versa), equal opportunity, so what is your point?

places where taller players can reach the ball while shorter players may not (think a ball on the side edge of a deep bunker), get serious would you! at least make your examples actually something that happens once in 10000 rounds

places where taller players can see the flag (or the hole when putting) where shorter players may not, etc.What? You have never heard of a tended flagstick?

Why would you want golf to be fair, anyway?

Are you losing money to an equally wild, much shorter golf buddy or something?

I see nothing here that remotely challenges my proposition. Furthermore, I did not ask that golf be fair. I simply asked that golf course maintenance be nondiscriminatory.

[Garland Bayley]

Garland,
See the other thread on fairness  
Mark

Mark,

The topic here is maintenance of parkland golf courses. Not whether or not golf in general should be fair. The original links land golf courses did not have this issue. If the USGA did not say limb trees up, there wouldn't be such an issue.

[Pete_Pittock]

Garland,
A lot of trees on my home course are shorter than you are.
Are you advocating that they just keep the trunk?

[Joe Hancock]

What about if one tree is limbed high enough for all golfers to swing unimpeded, but another tree that hasn't been limbed at all....is that fair, or unfair.....

[Michael_Stachowicz]

Why does everyone take their poor game and blame it on maintenance?  Shouldn't people be blaming it on their teachers (if they are going to blame it on themselves)?  shouldn't they demand better lessons so that they are not under the trees getting discriminated against?

[Garland Bayley]

Why does everyone take their poor game and blame it on maintenance?  Shouldn't people be blaming it on their teachers (if they are going to blame it on themselves)?  shouldn't they demand better lessons so that they are not under the trees getting discriminated against?

Come on Michael! If the best players in the world can't keep out of the trees, how are the rest of us to be able to? Get real!

[Garland Bayley]

What about if one tree is limbed high enough for all golfers to swing unimpeded, but another tree that hasn't been limbed at all....is that fair, or unfair.....

It is fine by me. The maintenance would have been equitable.

[Garland Bayley]

Garland,
A lot of trees on my home course are shorter than you are.
Are you advocating that they just keep the trunk?

Them's just weeds. I can probably just pull them out.  
Don't suppose JVB would have a rules problem with that do you?

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

Yeah Mike, get real. Blame it on themselves? What the hell is wrong with you? I don't think your chemical room is properly ventilated, you're acting funny.

By the way, I was on your course and the sand is too hard/soft, the greens are too fast/slow, the rough is too tall/short and the course played too hard/easy.


Anthony

[Garland Bayley]

Yeah Mike, get real. Blame it on themselves? What the hell is wrong with you? I don't think your chemical room is properly ventilated, you're acting funny.

By the way, I was on your course and the sand is too hard/soft, the greens are too fast/slow, the rough is too tall/short and the course played too hard/easy.


Anthony

Sorry Anthony. Everything you name is equitable to the individual players.

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

Garland,

Mike is a superintendent. He hears those comments all the time. I'm sure if he trimmed branches to a level you and others found just and fair there would be complaints.

Anthony

[Garland Bayley]

Garland,

Mike is a superintendent. He hears those comments all the time. I'm sure if he trimmed branches to a level you and others found just and fair there would be complaints.

Anthony

Anthony,

You know there are always complaints. Trim the branches up. "Oh no, now I can see the city dump from the 8th tee." Etc.

Not exactly analogous complaints and I suspect you know it.

[Garland Bayley]

Why does everyone take their poor game and blame it on maintenance?  Shouldn't people be blaming it on their teachers (if they are going to blame it on themselves)?  shouldn't they demand better lessons so that they are not under the trees getting discriminated against?

Mike,

Anthony didn't like my first answer. I am not blaming my poor game on maintenance. I am blaming the advantage my short buddy gets with his poor game on maintenance.

You see it is entirely different. It is my buddy's poor game I am complaining about.