US Am at Olympic

[Matt_Cohn]

Thanks for the message Joel - that will help. He's decent length but not super-long by today's standards.

I'll try to sneak off and say hello on Sunday.

[Paul Jones]

Friday, August 17

I have a player.

George Cestia, Lake Charles LA

7:10 Lake #10 Monday
12:25 Ocean #1 Tuesday

The players didn't have privileges at Olympic today so we went up to Stonetree. (He and a friend from Louisiana played, I didn't.) I can understand most of what he says, which is a better result than I've had with most people I've met from Louisiana.  

Showing off San Francisco to people from Louisiana is a blast. Accepting my role as a caddy for the week is a torturous but worthwhile process.

We'll be out there very early this weekend - 7:10 on the Lake Saturday, and I believe 7:10 on the Ocean Sunday. Come say hello if you're around.

Matt,

I grew up playing golf with George Cestia, he is orignally from New Iberia and grew up at Squirrel Run.

Tell him I said hi and hope you all do well.

[ed_getka]

Matt,
   Have a great week. Hopefully you guys will still be out there on Friday so we can stop by and say hi. I might make it out on Monday with my youngest, if we do we'll look for you on th e Lake course. Have fun, as much as it must pain you not to be playing yourself.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Matt, I do not really know George like Paul does. He is a good player. I watched him at our mid am a few weeks back and he seems to be a good ball striker. Please say Hi to Michael when you two visit with him.

[Matt_Cohn]

Saturday, August 18

George played the Lake early this morning. Crap, it's hard.

Most notably, the greens are really fast already. Their target was 11.5 and they're at least that. The trickle effect on those slopey greens is unbelievable. Guys will have a lot of 4 and 5 footers this week.

The rough is not completely consistent but generally speaking you can advance it about 150, almost never more, sometimes less. It's long but only moderately thick - maybe the hardest kind of rough because the ball can fall to the bottom, but there's still a lot of resistance when you swing through. It's playable around the greens though. It's generally not thick enough to make short shots impossible.

The one aspect of the course presentation that I don't understand is the fescue collars around the bunkers. They're mowed to the same height as the surrounding rough; and although it's thicker grass, it's certainly not the "bearded bunker" look we all expected.

I'm not sure if the USGA nixed the bearded look at the last minute, or if the grass just didn't grow tall enough to make the it work.

The new grass outlines each bunker in a darker shade of green. It's a unique look - which you can see if you use Live Maps and look at Olympic facing south, I think - but honestly, it doesn't really impact anything. Unless I'm totally missing the point, I don't think that the effort invested in these bunker collars has really amounted to something worthwhile for this week.

I can't comment much on the firmness of the course as it we played very early. It wasn't soft, though.

The condition of the tees, fairways, greens, and bunkers is as good as you could ask for. Hopefully the greens will still be reasonably smooth when that 315th guy comes around.

Speaking of 315 guys, it's a zoo out there. The practice range was full from one end to the other; another 50 guys on the practice green, and another dozen on the chipping green. And this was at high noon with another 150 guys out on the courses.

I have to pass along my self-serving story of the day. On the 14th hole, one guy in my group missed the green by about 4 feet and drew a particularly bad lie in the long rough, which he pointed out to a couple of us. I said, "OK, let's have a contest, closest to the hole", from about 40 feet.

He hit a pretty good shot to about 12 feet. I borrowed his club, took a couple of practice swings, and chopped out a little flop shot that hit soft, rolled, rolled, hit the pin dead center, and dropped in the cup.

I cheerfully reminded him that he had in fact been beaten by a caddie and jokingly asked him if he saw how I did that - all in good fun of course.

He must have been paying attention, because he chipped one in on the next hole. We both smiled at that one.

And that's my self-serving story of the day.


Blips on the Radar

*Philip Francis, the 2006 US Junior Champion, was exempt but didn't know he still had to send in an application. The unfortunate result is that he's not in the field this week.

*The most common guess for the cut is 148, +8.

*Everyone in my guy's group today hit a fairway wood into the 491 yard, par "4" 17th hole.


We're playing the Ocean Sunday at 7:10 a.m. I'll report back tomorrow night.

[ed_getka]

Matt,
   Thanks for the report. Fun story about the chip-in. How many strokes harder do you think the course is playing since we played it together?

[Mike Benham]

The new grass outlines each bunker in a darker shade of green. It's a unique look - which you can see if you use Live Maps and look at Olympic facing south, I think - but honestly, it doesn't really impact anything. Unless I'm totally missing the point, I don't think that the effort invested in these bunker collars has really amounted to something worthwhile for this week.

[Matt_Cohn]

For US Am leveo player, maybe five shots harder? It's hard. Surely it's at least 1.5 shots each for fairway rough, greenside rough, and fast/firm greens with tough pins. Maybe more?

George and I both agreed that a 10 handicapper, playing by the rules, had basically no chance to break 100.

[igrowgrass]

Thats fescue around the bunkers?  Anyone know what kind?  

[Mike Benham]

Thats fescue around the bunkers?  Anyone know what kind?  

I do not know the actual variety of tall fescue or producer but it is a very wide blade and stiff.

[igrowgrass]

Its just extremely green for Tall Fescue.

[Mike Benham]

Its just extremely green for Tall Fescue.

And not very tall  

[igrowgrass]

Why didn't the sod out the whole surround and the rough on either side of the fairway?
At the course I work at we sprayed roundup in the rough on one of the holes to eliminate the Poa annua and over-seeded ryegrass to maintain the look of a monostand of rough.

[Joel_Stewart]

I was out at the course this morning acting as the starter for the groups between 7am and 9am on the Lake course.  Very fun, was able to meet many of the players and Matt.  After the players were off I walked around the course.  It seems the rough is fairly high but not US Open type length.  Around the greens seemed shorter than the fairway rough.  The fairways and greens are in great condition, weather in the high 60's.

The players as expected are raving about both of the courses.  The Ocean's 1st hole is playing as a par 4 and the tee is pretty far up and surprisingly they are playing #17 on the Lake as a par 4.

I picked up a few programs if anyone is interested please message me and I'll send you one.

[Matt_Cohn]

Sunday, August 19

Let's see. It's 7:10 in the morning, cool, and foggy. George hasn't warmed up and is standing on the tee of the first hole - a sloping, wet, 498 yard par-4 with a narrow fairway, elevated green and 4 inch rough on both sides.

Yeah. Good times.

Today was George's practice round on the Ocean Course, and my first time seeing the course as well. It seems like the same set of requirements as the Lake Course (or the "Lakeside" Course as the USGA has taken to calling it), but with a different, more modernish kind of look. It has to play easier than the Lake, because it's easier to keep the ball in the fairway, but it's absolutely still a tough course. The rough is comparable although today the greens were slightly slower on the Ocean side.

Thanks to all the guys who sent me some help with the Ocean Course. It was very useful and hopefully an advantage to know what we were doing the first time around.

Two thoughts on the rough. First, I want to revise my statement from yesterday. It's not 150 rough. It's 100-yard rough. Looking back, I don't think George any of them 150, and very few of them went 100 in the air. (He's an average length hitter for this field.)

Second, the rough is mostly poa annua. I was surprised; there isn't much rye in the rough at all. Tall poa annua rough is softer than rye. You can see the effect around the greens because guys are finding short game shots from the high rough very manageable. But the flip side is that because poa annua is softer and less dense, the ball falls to the bottom almost every time, somewhat like bermuda - especially early in the week, because all of the grass is standing straight up.

Every time you see a ball in the rough, you feel like a ball in that precise spot could not have found a worse lie.


Blips on the Radar:

*Jamie Lovemark seems to have learned something from Tiger Woods (or Ben Hogan, maybe). He scheduled a tee time for the Ocean Course at 1:35...and played the Lake course at 7:30, leaving a number of spectators disappointed. I don't know whether he did that purposefully or not.

*One of George's playing partners tomorrow, Tripp Kuhlke (no, not Kuehne) got into the tournament via the strangest set of circumstances I have ever heard.  Read this, it's unbelievable.

*I remain undefeated at chipping contests this week. I rule.

*Two USGA guys have been measuring everyone's launch stats on #17 Lake during the practice rounds with a very fancy machine. I walked by today and asked to see the numbers. Ball speeds varied from the mid 140's to 181.

The next group after I arrived included a guy named John Hurley. I nearly soiled myself when he registered a 191 mph ball speed and 129 mph swing speed. The ball hissed for about 100 yards off the clubface and carried 300 yards, uphill, into the wind.

That was the fastest the two USGA guys had seen all summer, including the US Open. Just for comparison, that's 8-10 mph of ball speed faster than Tiger and Bubba Watson.

This was after he'd reportedly hit driver, 3-wood over the green on #16, which is 609 yards. Go watch this guy hit a driver somewhere if you can.

*One of these USGA guys - I neglected to get his name - is one of the main researchers on the groove issue. He kindly spent about 10 minutes talking with me about the research and what they're trying to do, and specifically the finding that balls can actually spin more out of light rough.

Apparently the mechanism is that the ball winds into itself as it's struck by the clubface. When grooves grab and hold the ball, the ball can actually unwind a bit before it releases, thereby losing some of its spin. But light rough can create slippage so that the ball releases from the club fully wound into itself; and as a result, with a higher spin rate.

Lower-lofted clubs, not wedges, show increased spin out of short rough. For most good players the crossover point is around a 7 or 8-iron. For a more lofted club, the ball will spin more from short grass.

....I think.

*I have yardage books for Mike, Andrew, and Kevin. If anyone else wants one, let me know.


George tees off #10 of the Lake tomorrow at 7:30.

[ed_getka]

Matt,
   Thanks for the report. That USGA stuff sounds interesting.

Joel,
   When will you be out on the course again? I'm definitely out there on Friday, and may come out tomorrow.

[John Keenan]

Matt

Thanks for the great write up.

My son and I will be there Saturday. If Hurley is still in the mix I will make of point of following him

I have never played or been on the Ocean course is there a snack shack where the O club will be selling their superb hamburgers.  I have alerted my son and he is quite interested in trying them. Ditto for me.

Hopefully we will see you out there

John

[JSlonis]

If any of you guys will be out there for the qualifying rounds and want to root on a great Mid-Am player, look out for my very good friend Bill McGuinness.  Bill has been an excellent amateur player in the Philly area for many years and after some time spent busy raising his young children has really returned to his great play this year.  He won the NJ Amateur, was runner up at the Golf Assoc of Phila Am, and made it to the US AM again....a pretty great summer.

Bill is also the Green Chairman at our home course, Tavistock CC, and was the main person responsible for getting our Master Plan into motion and completed.

[Matt_Cohn]

Hamburgers are on sale at all of O Club's snack shacks - at the end of the range; near #10 and 15 Lake; and near #8 and 9 Ocean - for the special US Amateur price of only $6. I hear they're normally $4.50.  

[John Keenan]

Thanks Matt.

A bit on the high side but well worth it.

John

[Kevin_Reilly]

Thanks Matt...I'll look for you tomorrow.  

TEPaul has been raving about John Hurley's ball speed for a couple of years.  I'm looking forward to watching him play.

[Joel_Stewart]

*Jamie Lovemark seems to have learned something from Tiger Woods (or Ben Hogan, maybe). He scheduled a tee time for the Ocean Course at 1:35...and played the Lake course at 7:30, leaving a number of spectators disappointed. I don't know whether he did that purposefully or not.

Ouch.  He came to me at about 7am and asked if I could make room for him so I sloted him in a group of 3. Being a fellow Trojan I was happy to do it and we had a nice chat.  I didn't know he had a following, maybe he was trying to escape them???

Later I went out on the course and followed him on 14 and 15 and talked with him a little more.  Of course he is only 19 and thought the course was great.

I was surprised that he had never played the course.  In fact 80% of the players I sent off had never played the course.  Its amazing to me that a player in the biggest Amateur tournament in the US could prepare by only playing each course 1 day?   I asked a few, like Lovemark why they hadn't played it before and they said it was hard to get on which is BS since we have a liberal guest policy.   Getting on for free might be fair and most only qualified a few weeks ago but there is no way any of these players can be comfortable playing the course with 1 practice round.

Ed:
The only day I will be out is Thursday which is 36 holes match play.  Let me know if you want to hook up or any one else.  

[AndrewB]

*One of these USGA guys - I neglected to get his name - is one of the main researchers on the groove issue. He kindly spent about 10 minutes talking with me about the research and what they're trying to do, and specifically the finding that balls can actually spin more out of light rough.

Apparently the mechanism is that the ball winds into itself as it's struck by the clubface. When grooves grab and hold the ball, the ball can actually unwind a bit before it releases, thereby losing some of its spin. But light rough can create slippage so that the ball releases from the club fully wound into itself; and as a result, with a higher spin rate.

Lower-lofted clubs, not wedges, show increased spin out of short rough. For most good players the crossover point is around a 7 or 8-iron. For a more lofted club, the ball will spin more from short grass.

....I think.

I spent a while speaking with those USGA guys too and they were very friendly and willing to answer all of my questions.  I believe the person who answered your question about the spin out of rough is Jim Hubbell, who various sources on the web say is a Senior Research Engineer with the USGA.

I didn't ask them about this.  Can you expand a bit on what you (or he) mean(s) when you say "wind into itself"?  Maybe I should just go read the report.

[David_Tepper]

I would like to know which tee is being using in the qualifier at #11 (uphill par-5) on the Ocean Course - the Black (furthest back) or Blue tee?

[Mike Benham]

I would like to know which tee is being using in the qualifier at #11 (uphill par-5) on the Ocean Course - the Black (furthest back) or Blue tee?

Black - these are big boys ...