[Frank Pasquale]

Some friends and I are taking a ride from New York to Maryland to play Bulle Rock.

Any comments/advice from those who have played it?

[Matt_Ward]

Frank:

In my opinion, it's a quality Pete Dye design. The first couple of holes are rather timid and anyone who thinks that will remain the pattern is in for a major league surprise.

The land is quite rolling and Dye has included a few long par-4's that actually play uphill in order to bring back the long iron or even wood approach to long par-4's.

The par-4 9th is one of the most demanding holes you can play and I'm sure there are many people who believe it's just an unfair hole. Played generally into the prevailing wind the hole is an absolute tiger -- no pun intended.

The back nine, I believe, has more character than the front and many of the Dye design aspects are there. When the pins are tucked at Bulle Rock tell your golfing friends to always play safe or simply add their score with a Texas Instruments calculator.

The finishing hole is also controversial in the mind of many. I think it's a hard hole and not memorable in the grand scheme of things. One thing when playing Bulle Rock -- you must be hitting your tee shot consistently to get into any position to score reasonably.

Bulle Rock certainly has its following -- on both sides -- some love and others hate it. I think it's arguably the 1st or 2nd best course in Maryland and if prepared properly could host a Tour event or even higher.

Tell your buddies NOT to play the back tees unless they have real ammo coming out of their golf sticks. On the Doak scale I give the course a solid 7.5.

P.S. There's talk of a second 18 but I understand the club is waiting to see if a major hotel operator comes on board to assist with the financial development for the total project.

[Bob_Farrell]

Frank:

Unless your group are scratch players, don't even contemplate the back tees. Bulle Rock is a very demanding and difficult golf course. Matt's comments are real good.

I hope you enjoy it. Let us know.

BF

[Mike_Cirba]

Frank;

Hmmmm...Bulle Rock, eh?

What can I say?  It's a really good property, which makes me wonder why Dye moved so much earth.

I'm a big fan of Pete Dye, yet in most cases at Bulle, I had that feeling of deja vu all over again (i.e. didn't I see this hole at Blackwolf Run, or Mystic Rock?)

It finishes with the stereotypical Pete Dye 5-3-4 finish, with the 18th being a copy of 18 at TPC Sawgrass/TPC Stadium/Prestwick (SC)/and others with the long right to left cape over/along water, only this one on steroids at 485 yards.

It has large boulders guarding many of the water hazards, which look ungainly in rolling northern Maryland horse property.

All of the longest par fours play steeply uphill, with the shorter 4's descending, making the course play exceptionally difficult.

The greensites tend towards severity,and it's not uncommon to watch a high-handicap game of "ping pong" around the greens.  

The split fairway 9th hole doesn't work in concept or execution...

It's lovely, and a number of holes are really very good.

If you're travelling all the way down from NY to get beat up (my biggest complaint with Bulle Rock is that it's humorless and unrelenting), you should at least stop 5 miles further down the road and have some FUN at Beechtree, which is also a challenge, but with more brains than brawn.

[Dave_Miller]

Frank:

Played it once about a year ago.  It was with a group of guys who don't play very often.

We still had a great day.

It is a good Pete Dye course and from the back tees it is very challenging.

Personally, I think you will enjoy it.

Best
Dave

[Frank Pasquale]

Ok, so we are not all scratch golfers!  But, if a 3, a 13 and a 21 want to play from the same tees, should we play the blues or the whites (black is out of the question).

Thanks,
Frank

[Matt_Ward]

Frank:

Depends on the type of game the 21 plays. Does he hit the ball long, but has no short game? Ditto the other players. If the 21 has a pop gun tee game then you'd better have cotton swabs for your ears when playing the blue tees -- I'm assuming your the 3.

All I can say for sure is this: score early because after the 4th hole the screws begin to turn.

Enjoy ...

[TEPaul]

Mike Cirba:

That's why I think you're probably the absolute best architectural analyst on this website!

I think you nailed in a quick sketch both Bulle Rock and Pete generally on that short post of yours.

Pete's a great architect, probably go down as real world class at the end of the day, a very good natural conceptualist but he's so often been prone to moving too much earth when he really didn't have to or need to. The reason for that could be that Pete just loves machinery, loved to run it himself! P.B. inherited that from him obviously. In that way Pete is probably a real modern method architect with earth moving with a real understanding and feel for what came before the modern age!

Pete has such a good knowledge, appreciation, foundation and conceptual ability to translate classic and old world principles into much of his archtiecture too, although some think he became super fascinated by the wrong parts of old world architecture (like the rudimentary things that the early architects built instead of what they used naturally and left as is).

As good as Pete is and has been, personally, I think he would have been even better if he did what he did conceptually and otherwise and then spent the last 1/4 of his time and effort just toning down what he'd done in the first 3/4s of his time and effort.

If you ask me he should have done more holes at Bulle Rock that felt more like #10! Probably no one thinks much about that hole (as I recall it) but it works just fine and it looks like what it is--basically a good enough natural landform hole that didn't need all that much enhancing with D-8s or whatever! It didn't get it and many of the holes at Bulle Rock should have been treated the same way!

[Matt Kardash]

pete dye and earth moving is a funny issue...on one hand i agree there should be no reason to move earth if no earth needs to be moved....however, i also think it's nice that pete does it his way, and he does it very well, one of the best of all time. I mean if all we saw were minimalist designs it would get very old very fast.. Pete is there to throw us a curve ball every once and a while, and i think that it's nice....All i have to say is that if there is one architect who can handle earth moving well it would be pete dye...

[TEPaul]

Matt Kardash:

You probably have a good point there. One of the beauties of architecture generally is in the differences in it, particularly if in those differences there's still lots of good stuff.

[Frank Pasquale]

Question... How does someone improve 16 shots (90-74) from their morning round to their afternoon round at Bulle Rock?

Answers... a) move up from the blues to the whites and 2) play better!

Kidding aside, I think Mike Cirba hit the nail on the head in his assessment of Bulle Rock, by saying it's humorless and unrelenting.  I felt under constant pressure, and felt like I had to thread the ball through a needle on every full shot.  This is due in large part to how visually intimidating each hole appears.  After you say "wow" on the tee, then you realize you must hit a perfect shot.

Overall, I noticed that Dye allows you to run the ball onto the greens, as there are not many forced carries.  However, you will pay a price for going right OR left.  I cannot recall seeing any bailout areas on sides of greens.  I take it the more you play the course, the more you get a feel for where to put the ball (evidenced by my play), and where to avoid at all costs.  Basically, deciding which side of the hole presents the lesser of two evils.

Something quirky about the course was that there was no intermediate cut of rough.  You were either in the fairway, or in four inches of rough!

Overall, I was glad I went, and would play there again.

Any other opinions on whether or not this course could host a PGA event?

[Matt_Ward]

Frank:

That's why they call them the "championship" tees! Of course, you were under "constant pressure" when played from those markers. What did you expect -- chip'n putt? In addition, you scored better with your second 18 because of two things:

*Less distance to negotiate / full carries / tougher angles, etc.

*You knew the course and therefore could plan better strategy.

Look, Bull(y) Rock is meant to do one thing -- intimidate and throw you off your game. It's not a "mother love" course by any means.

To answer your last question -- yes, I believe it's possible for a PGA Tour event to be held there but doubtful given the nature of the relationship that Kemper has with Avenel and the Tour.

[Tom MacWood (Guest)]

Matt
What's a 'mother love' course?

[Mike_Cirba]

The interesting part is that if I understand Frank correctly, he didn't even play the "championship" tees, which are the "Black" markers.

The course is structured as follows from the back;

Black   7375 yards, 76.4, 147
Blue    6843 yards,  74.0, 139  (which I believe Frank played 1st)
White  6360 yards,  71.5, 136 (Frank's second round)

Yes, 500 yards further back is about as much fun as a lanced boil.  

As far as the "tournament capability" of the course, there is no doubt that it is a tough golf course.  But, is that really the criteria the PGA is looking for, when courses like Indian Wells and EnJoie are in the tour rota?

[Matt_Ward]

Tom MacWood:

To answer you question -- a "mother love" course is one that allows the player a great degree of "freedom" (the wherewithal to get away with plenty of mistakes).

Bulle Rock is one tough and relentless course -- especially from the tips as Mike Cirba correctly identified in his last thread.

The course puts and keeps pressure on your tee game throughout. A "mother love" course is often benign and is rarely so initimidating. Bulle Rock puts the player on notice on a number of holes from the longest tees that on certain holes you WILL HAVE TO HIT YOUR BEST tee shot or ELSE!

Pete Dye has mastered the art of psychological horror. Many of Pete's courses really push the envelope and sometimes it can go over the edge. I understand completely what Mike Cirba believes about the course, but I also know from playing it a few times that if you play solid golf -- shot after shot -- you will be rewarded. Just don't miss or if you do just don't miss by much.

A "mother love" course is one that accepts the player and his mistakes without much fanfare or anger. Like a mother's love it is unconditional -- there are plenty of courses that offer this type of condition -- Bulle Rock is not that type. It's a big bad bully and you better realize that this course is not going to embrace anything you do with such sweet kisses.

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