Is this the USGAs fault?

[David_Elvins]

Interesting fairway widths!

Photos of Apple City CC, this weeks Korean PGA Tour stop courtesy of www.nathanuebergang.com/







Don't know who would love playing this course.  Does the USGA with their course set up at the US Open set a bad example for developing golfing countries?  Do they have a resopnsibilty to world golf and spreading the game of golf?

or are these photos just good for a laugh  

[Matt_Cohn]

The golfer in the first photo look like he's 70 feet tall.

In the second photo there seem to be "fairway" bunkers about 25 yards right of the fairway. I wonder if the fairway went over there at one point?

[David_Elvins]

The golfer in the first photo look like he's 70 feet tall.

In the second photo there seem to be "fairway" bunkers about 25 yards right of the fairway. I wonder if the fairway went over there at one point?

Not to mention you would have to think the fairway went almost over to the cart path on the left.  It looks to be about a 1/4 of it original width.

[Mark Chaplin]

The golfer in the first picture may look 70' tall but he is pretty straight!

The course looks like a normal resort course made ultra narrow for a competition......member & biggest enemy day?

[Tim_Cronin]

Straight down the middle... it started out straight down the middle... then it started to hook just a wee little bit...
(with apologies to Der Bingle)

[Patrick_Mucci]

David,

It's an alarming trend.

The culprits:

TV
PGA Tour
USGA
Green Chairman, Committees and Boards.

[David_Elvins]

David,

It's an alarming trend.

The culprits:

TV
PGA Tour
USGA
Green Chairman, Committees and Boards.

I think you are right Pat, it can be argued that the US Open set up is a good "once off" test but if it is held up as the world's premiere golf tournament, it is bound to spark immitation, especially as you point out with the growth of worldwide TV golf.  

I wonder also whether USGA obsession with "winning score" and the lack of roll back of equipment is going to lead to tricked up courses as the norm for all tournaments (with a widespread trickle down effect to everyday courses).  Lets hope not.

[Patrick_Mucci]

David,

Agreed.

If preserving par is paramount.

And, equipment continues to improve performance.

How can courses be prepared to defend themselves against the best players in the world ?

It has to be through extreme measures, especially on older courses where additional length isn't available.

The real danger lies in impressionable minds at local clubs

[Patrick_Mucci]

Sean,

The USGA and the PGA are hardly faceless outside organizations.

They're not only highly visible, but, the product they present to the public is highly visible.

If they didn't tout this setup you wouldn't see it duplicated throughout the hitherlands

[David_Elvins]

Just because monkeys sees doesn't mean monkey must do.  

it doesn't "have to" but how do you think the process has happenned that has led to a professional event with fairways narrowed to widths of 8-12 yards if it isn't monkey see, monkey do.  Without wanting to be patronising to the golf community of Korea/China, do they have the money to hire experts/consultants etc?  Do the board members of the tour/golf course have extensive golfing experience?  It is a relatively young golfing culture, is the USGA influence working against the R&A in developing the game in these countries?

Many people have talked about the "Augusta syndrome" with players unreasonably expecting green grass all year around.  Is there not a likelyhood of a legitimit "US Open syndrome" also developing amongst course owners/promoters if a "championship test" is seen to be the pinnacle of golf tournaments?

[JESII]

Just out of curiosity, what authority does the USGA have in Korea? Who is the governing body for Korean golf?

[David_Elvins]

Just out of curiosity, what authority does the USGA have in Korea? Who is the governing body for Korean golf?

As far as I know the USGA is the governing body for American golf and the R&A is the governing body for the rest of the world.

[JESII]

Thanks David,

That's what I thought.

Do you feel the fairways on non-St. Andrews British Open courses appear wide on television?

I think the difference in width between the two Opens is that the rough is USUALLY[/i] more playable in Scotland and England. In the US they always try to make it as thick and lush as possible. Do you disagree?

[David_Elvins]

Thanks David,

That's what I thought.

Do you feel the fairways on non-St. Andrews British Open courses appear wide on television?

I think the difference in width between the two Opens is that the rough is USUALLY[/i] more playable in Scotland and England. In the US they always try to make it as thick and lush as possible. Do you disagree?

I didnt mean to single out the USGA at the expense of the R&A.  I was more thinking along the lines that with USA courses being more photogenic that they influence more viewers.   THe Open looks like it is played in the middle of a brown paddock sometimes, and I don't think the average viewer would be lobbying to have what they see on TV replicated at their course.

Having said that, aside from a few exceptions (Carnastie, 17th St Andrews) I do think the US Open places a far greater emphasis on narrowing fairways for major championships.  

[JESII]

David,

I think it would surprise you to see just how non-narrow most of the fairways are at a US Open. I was shocked to see the width at Shinnecock a few years ago and yet the guys on TV were still commenting on the ribbon's these guys are forced to hit to. I have not been to an Open course during, or even close to, the event but I would wager that the big difference comes from the fact that in The Open you can still smash the ball towards the green from the hay whereas in the US Open you are frequently wedging back out.

I think it's the rough that makes the fairways seem narrower.

Regardless, I thought your post was hanging the USGA for its narrow fairway set up and the worldwide influence of it. I didn't realize you were simply going at the perception of green-ness...where could I have gotten that idea?

[David_Elvins]

I think it would surprise you to see just how non-narrow most of the fairways are at a US Open...The Open you can still smash the ball towards the green from the hay whereas in the US Open you are frequently wedging back out.  I think it's the rough that makes the fairways seem narrower.

Interesting stuff.  I haven't been to either so I can't really comment.

Regardless, I thought your post was hanging the USGA for its narrow fairway set up and the worldwide influence of it.

I am not hanging anyone, I was genuinely amused/amazed at the pictures.  THe thread title probably doesn't match the fact that there is an element of light heartednes in the post.  
Surely you can have a laugh at those pictures?  But also at the same time it does make me wonder what could have led to such a strange set up. Its worth asking questions.

I didn't realize you were simply going at the perception of green-ness...where could I have gotten that idea?

Once again, I do think you are being a little defensive. I am pointing out that the general world view is that American courses and the US Tour and American golf are seen as the pinnacle of golf, what is to be strived for.  British golf and British courses are seen as steeped in tradition but not all that relevant to modern golf.  That is not necessarily a dig at the USGA.  Infact it is acompliment to American golf.  But it is worth asking whether with greater infuence and power, does there come greater responsibility?  

[Patrick_Mucci]

Sean Arble,

In the ultimate, it's always the individual club that decides their policies, but, you can't deny the impact of the influence brought on by the parties previously listed.

[JESII]

David,

You may be right...there is so much anti-USGA bias on this site that I probably draw out of the holster prematurely sometimes. I apologize.

No question though, that the pictures are freakish looking.

All the best,

Jim