[rjsimper]

Senor Naccarato believes it's only worthwhile to see if you want to mourn great architectural tragedy, and certainly one could spend hours doing that here or at any number of other locales around the world.  Others have agreed that it's a graveyard for genius, and I've even seen GCAers point fellow GCAers elsewhere in favor of the OVI.

The problem with talking about the good ol' days with such romance (deserved or not) is that people too often confuse with "not as good as it used to be" or "not true to the original" with "BAD".  

I love GCA, I am thankful for all of the knowledge I gain here and the new things I hear about that I'd never otherwise have known to check out (Wild Horse, Stone Eagle, Sheep Ranch, hell even Bandon to an extent) but I really think if I looked at everything through the goggles of historical context, I might have missed out on some really great places.

Riviera and LACC North come to mind as examples.  While we could (and have) spent hours and pages talking about what used to be and what a tragedy these places are, they are still GREAT GOLF COURSES.

Operating absent the blessing/curse of historical knowledge, I played Ojai Valley Inn for the first time this past Sunday with my girlfriend.  

Below you will find photos of the course, identified with the current hole numbers (to help order the holes for those who have not played the current routing).  I had seen the old photos posted in the "Oh My" thread, and I know what the general opinions that friends I trust hold, but none of this changes the fact that I had a really great day up there, and I think it is an excellent course...one of the best publics in So. Cal, and anyone who recommends that someone in the area pass on playing here (especially with the reasonable twilight rates) is completely wrong.  The old school charm is worth the green fee on its own.

7:30 tee time, and Southern California presents a fine version of the ubiquitous "May Gray" marine layer


Returning in the afternoon for the same photo of the current 1st - probably the worst hole on the course.


2 (interestingly, the plaque identifying it as the one of the best 500 holes in the world (11th at Ojai) on the tee informs everyone that this is a new routing.  Please tell me how this is significantly different than the 13th at Art Hills's Cross Creek - a hole which is ridiculed.  Similar tee shots, similar second shots, similar elevation changes.


3rd Tee - a charming little 110 yarder


Looking back on 3 - notice the two sets of tees - I don't know if they switch between the two sets, but we played from the uppers.


5th tee


6th tee - a very good short par 4, but that tree off the tee blocks almost the entire fairway - I had to aim into the right trees and hook a hybrid just to hit the right side of the fairway.  The tree could be of strategic value at half it's size.


8 - another of the mystical little par 3s on the front


10th tee


12th hole - short par 5


13th hole - tees off from right next to the 10th tee


14 - right around 200 yards


The lightning rod 16th...Can someone please post the "old" photo...I couldn't find it.  Viewing this SOLELY in the context of what is there, I think some of the criticisms are valid...but let me say that my girlfriend hit a DRIVER from the red tees and held the green, 2 putted for a par.  She's played fewer than 10 rounds of golf in her life.  It's not merely hit it and stick it, there is more margin for error than previously reported...but it's a tough tough shot.  This photo makes it look much easier than it really looks from the tee


This is more like it...


The 17th - another of the "Lost Holes" - It's pretty....didn't love the hole, didn't hate it.  The bunker is 285 from the back tee


18th hole - 442 yards of brutality from the back tees.  There is a bell tower type structure in the distance that looks like it should be your aiming line.  On that line it's about 240 through the fairway - in actuality one should be well left of that (even though it's blind).  The uphill second shot is well protected...this is by far the toughest hole on the golf course.  Michael Robin identifies it as one of the 18 best holes in So. Cal.  

[David Stamm]

The problem with talking about the good ol' days with such romance (deserved or not) is that people too often confuse with "not as good as it used to be" or "not true to the original" with "BAD".  

I love GCA, I am thankful for all of the knowledge I gain here and the new things I hear about that I'd never otherwise have known to check out (Wild Horse, Stone Eagle, Sheep Ranch, hell even Bandon to an extent) but I really think if I looked at everything through the goggles of historical context, I might have missed out on some really great places.

Riviera and LACC North come to mind as examples.  While we could (and have) spent hours and pages talking about what used to be and what a tragedy these places are, they are still GREAT GOLF COURSES.

 

Very well said my friend. Thanks for the pics. I have to make it a point to get up there and play it. One of the words you used in describing one of the par 3's I think apllies to the whole course. It looks, overall, charming.

[Tom Huckaby]

I'm in a somewhat combative mood, and this will be an interesting experiment.

Several years ago, Scott Burroughs and I made comments very similar to yours about Yale GC.  That is, maybe it's a shame what's been done to it, but as it stood when we played it, it was still a pretty damn good golf course and we each enjoyed playing it.

We got rather taken to task for this... in fact I recall at least one poster saying our view was the most damaging thing ever stated on GCA.

Will you be similarly taken to task?  Of course I wouldn't wish the treatment Scott and I got on an enemy, and I surely consider you a friend, Ryan.  

But it will be interesting to see if this forum has mellowed over the years.  I'm betting it has.

On point, well hell I haven't played Ojai in at least 20 years.  It looks pretty darn good to me.  Thanks for the pics!

TH

[Bill_McBride]

I strongly disagree with the reversing of the nines.  The course now starts with the guts of it with the dashing series of holes that plays across and along the barranca.  Before it built to that dramatic point once you got to the back nine, nicely warmed up for those demanding if short shots.  Now you have to open up your bag of tricks right away!

It is hard to criticize any course in such a setting, but that 16th (former 7th) hole is pretty gruesome with all those bunkers.  It's a redan with no way to run the draw to the hole.  What fun is that?

[rjsimper]

Bill,

I should have commented on that as well - I agree that reversing the nines is a bad decision.  Were I COMPLETELY oblivious to history, I'd likely still have remarked that the truly "uniquely Ojai" holes, other than the "lost holes" are on the current front nine.  2-8 in the current routing are highlights for the course, and have more of a special feel than the rest of the course.

To answer your "What fun is that?" question...I won't take anyone to task for talking about the playability of the hole, but playing with my girlfriend has forced/allowed me to view things from a different perspective.  16 was her favorite hole on the course.  Why?  Elevated tee, panoramic view, opportunity to be heroic (carry all those bunkers) and normally she hates holes where there is no path to the green other than the aerial one.  As I said before, she hit a driver, flew over the bunkers, and held the green on the back portion.  She had tons of fun.

(I, on the other hand, pulled a 5 iron that was at rest simultaneously 5 feet from being on the green and 5 feet from being a lost ball left.  Can't say it was tons of fun, but 17 at Sawgrass isn't much fun either yet 16 at Ojai gets a lot more hate.

[Bill_McBride]

Agreed on the fun of your girlfriend carrying her tee ball onto the redan, but the true joy of playing a redan is the variety of shots you can hit to it.

For example, a couple of years I played at the recently declared humdrum North Berwick West Links with my wife and we played the Redan there in truly different ways:  she ran a low, bouncing spoon onto the green, avoiding all the bunkers, and the ball ran down to 15'.  Two putt par.  I hit a downwind 6 iron to the front of the green and the ball ran down just outside hers.  Two putt par.

That's not possible with all those bloody bunkers at Ojai and I say that's just not as much fun.  Redans should have a way to run the ball onto the green, and be long enough to make that a viable option.  The 7th at the new Pensacola course is 240 from the tips, 215 from the member tees, with just enough left to right cant to make the Reverse Redan work, and enough length to make a long running shot a viable option.

[Sean Leary]

Bill,


To answer your "What fun is that?" question...I won't take anyone to task for talking about the playability of the hole, but playing with my girlfriend has forced/allowed me to view things from a different perspective.  16 was her favorite hole on the course.  Why?  Elevated tee, panoramic view, opportunity to be heroic (carry all those bunkers) and normally she hates holes where there is no path to the green other than the aerial one.  As I said before, she hit a driver, flew over the bunkers, and held the green on the back portion.  She had tons of fun.

(I, on the other hand, pulled a 5 iron that was at rest simultaneously 5 feet from being on the green and 5 feet from being a lost ball left.

I remember the old Ryan that used to hit everything right and got to play golf with the boys on the weekend.    I miss the old Ryan....

[Sébastien Dhaussy]

The lightning rod 16th...Can someone please post the "old" photo...I couldn't find it.  

Here it is. The old 3rd hole - 1924

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