[David Stamm]

Seeing John Vander Borght's photo's reminded me of a gentleman I knew a few years ago who used to be member at Oakmont. He also was a member at PFC and he said he loved it. I also knew a couple of guys that qualified for the Amateur there and part of the tourney was played at PFC as well and they raved about it. Does anyone know much about the club and the course? I hear nothing but good things about it.

[TEPaul]

David:

Sure, I know it pretty well. What would you like to know?

The thing that is generally first mentioned about it is it has about the highest first tee anybody has ever seen and to get from the 17th green to the par 3 18th you have to take an industrial elevator.

It's a beautiful golf couse and right across the street from Fox Chapel, the only Raynor in Pa.

(Well, other than perhaps Merion West if you believe Whigam's eulogy for Raynor ).

[David Stamm]

Thanks Tom. I knew you'd know.

Who is the original arch? Who has worked on it since? How does the course play?

I've heard the par 4 12th is really good.

[Tom Roewer]

Thanks Tom. I knew you'd know.

Who is the original arch? Who has worked on it since? How does the course play?

I've heard the par 4 12th is really good.

Club founded 1882.  Don't know when course was finished.  Alex Findlay original architect.

[TEPaul]

David:

I remember once when I was out there for a few days (State Amateur Championship, I think) trying to figure out the entire design evolution of Pittsburgh Field Club. It's pretty complicated, particularly in the beginning.

And when I did a design evolution report of my own course which has a ton of architectural attribution in Cornish and Whitten, I checked the book to see who had more than my course and Pittsburgh Field Club was one. (That kind of thing can be a bit misleading, though, and basically a function of good club records).

The 12th is a big long straight-away par 4.

If somebody asked me to describe Pittsburgh Field Club course I might be inclined to say what Jim Finegan did about Philadelphia Country Club (his home course)----it doesn't exactly have any GREAT holes, just a whole lot of very good ones.

Pittsburgh Field Club is a very pretty golf course and I don't mean that in an over-immaculate way, it's just a very lovely place as are the golf holes.

And again, the first tee is one anyone teeing off from it will absolutely never forget.

[Jonathan Cummings]

PFC features an up hill par 3 finisher that can (oddly) be played as a par 5 for certain 'events'.

(Like the traditional gag played on newbies of turning PVGC's 15th tees so they face 16's green, PFC's version is to start 18 from inside the elevator.  The 'player' putts along the tressle hopefully arriving at the ball washer.  Next a little chip to the tee boxes and you play the hole conventionally from there.  God heal you if you putt off the tressle!)

PFC is a very nice course but FC, across the street, is a great one.

JC

[JohnV]

The Field Club is a very good club.  Many architects have worked on it over the years including the much maligned Xenophen Hassenplug (3 times I believe) and Arthur Hills.

The course is very good although a couple of par 3s seem out of character.  The 16th is a par 3 over a couple of lakes which doesn't seem to fit.  The 18th is a strange par 3 on the hill above the rest of the course with a green that is wild.  In some ways it is reminiscent of #9 at Crystal Downs.

The finish is unusual in that it ends 3-5-3-4-3 with the 4 being a relatively short one.

The elevator is a trip, although a group at the Pennsylvania Open got stuck in it for an hour a couple of years ago so I'm not sure I want to take it anymore.

[TEPaul]

JohnV;

The 18th is sort of weird but in something like a state amateur it is pretty cool hole. If you come to the tee tied for the lead or maybe with a shot lead it's pretty hard to not get your composure on that hole. Right is terrible and left is not bed of roses either, and that green isn't very wide.

When Warren Choate won it there he was so nervous it took him some time to even tee it up.

And here's some Pittsburgh Field Club trivia for you. Buddy Marucci won the state am there after hooking his tee shot on #1 on the first day and making a triple. He spotted Rocco Mediate a five shot lead with nine holes to go in the final round and he ran him down and won it.

So obviously there some danger out there on some of those Pittsburgh Field Club holes.

"The elevator is a trip, although a group at the Pennsylvania Open got stuck in it for an hour a couple of years ago so I'm not sure I want to take it anymore."

I was there for that and I saw exactly what caused it. I was on #3 and lightening hit a power line up by the green----BAABOOOOM, FSSSST!! and it took out all the power in the entire Fox Chapel community for an hour or more. Those guys and their caddies after hanging up in that elevator in the heat and minimal air and no light for over an hour were pretty quiet coming out.

[Tom Roewer]

The Field Club is a very good club.  Many architects have worked on it over the years including the much maligned Xenophen Hassenplug (3 times I believe) and Arthur Hills.

The course is very good although a couple of par 3s seem out of character.  The 16th is a par 3 over a couple of lakes which doesn't seem to fit.  The 18th is a strange par 3 on the hill above the rest of the course with a green that is wild.  In some ways it is reminiscent of #9 at Crystal Downs.


The finish is unusual in that it ends 3-5-3-4-3 with the 4 being a relatively short one.

The elevator is a trip, although a group at the Pennsylvania Open got stuck in it for an hour a couple of years ago so I'm not sure I want to take it anymore.

John:  Were they put on the clock???

[JohnV]

Tom,

You'd have to ask Tom Paul.  Pennsylvania Golf runs that, not us.

[TEPaul]

"John:  Were they put on the clock???"

TomR:

Over an hour delay between the 17th green and the 18th tee? Are you kidding me? That doesn't need to be clocked. As soon as they emerged from the elevator pale and shaken I told them that kind of delay was totally unacceptable and I DQed them all immediately! In the Pennsylvania Golf Association we take Rule 6-7 seriously. No pussy-footing around in elevators will ever be condoned.

[Tom Roewer]

Thanks, and god bless the Penna. Golf Association for that attitude!!!!!!

[Craig Disher]

About the only similarity of the current course to the one that existed in 1938 is the routing. The differences are extraordinary.

C&W list Tillinghast as having revised the course but don't offer a date. The older photo was taken in 1938 so it's possible that the bunkers are his.

Current view of NE corner:



1938:

[TEPaul]

Craig:

The original course's routing compared to the 1938 routing is probably pretty different.

I just can't remember where I was when I looked into it but the last few holes are all very different I believe. For instance, initially the 18th was a par 4 somehow coming up that hill to a green somewhere near the practice putting green.

[George Pazin]

Damn, Craig beat me to it - no surprise there. I think I noted in Tillinghast's book The Course Beautiful that he said he worked on PFC. I think Silva might have also worked on the course - the list is almost endless.

I didn't take any photos of PFC during the stroke play portion of the Am, and the course map I had was a casualty of a pipe burst just the other day. I only walked the first couple holes, and then the last half dozen, but I was very impressed, especially with the latter. 13-16 looked like a really interesting, unique use of some tough land.

[JohnV]

According to the letter he sent to the PGA, Tillie visited Pittsburgh Field Club in 1935.

He says he recommended moving the 2nd green back 40 yards and contoured the 10th green while adding some grassed hollows on the right of that hole.

It is possible that the holes were renumbered at some point, but picture above show the current 11th green and 12th tee.

See:
http://www.tillinghast.net/cms/node/194

and scroll down to the October 11th letter for more details.

[Pat Howard]

Here's a photo of that 1st tee with golf course superintendent Mike Zedreck.

[TEPaul]

Shivas:

That's not a cart path, it's a road that goes through the course. It wasn't all that long ago that they actually closed it to traffic. That hole from the tips is probably about 475 yards but it wasn't until fairly recently that the long hitting set could get a drive out that far.

[Tim_Cronin]

The Western Open was played at PFC in 1959. Mike Souchak scored 8-under-par 272 to edge Arnold Palmer by a stroke in a battle of Pennsylvania natives. Palmer missed a two-foot putt to save par on the 72nd hole after Souchak had parred the last.
Stats showed the course played easy, with Joe Campbell setting a competitive course record with 65 in the opening round, and E.J. "Dutch" Harrison lowering that to 63 in the third round. The field averaged 72.76 for the four rounds.
Have any other big national tournaments been played there?

[JohnV]

It was the second course for the US Amateur in 2003.

I believe the scoring average was around 72, about 7 shots lower than Oakmont.

[TEPaul]

"and E.J. "Dutch" Harrison lowering that to 63 in the third round."

Dutch Harrison!! What a guy he was.

One time years ago I met this pro who was apparently the head pro at GCGC---Mike Long. Man could that guy play---one of the best looking swings I ever saw anywhere.

We were playing down at Gulf Stream in Florida, a course Mike Long had never seen before. I think he shot a 65, and he drove the 15th green after I dared him to, telling him to my knowledge only one other person had ever done that.

Anyway, he was telling me how much he hated all the technical classes and stuff that club pros had to take through the PGA of America to become pros.

He said he thought it was a complete waste of time except for the commencement address given to the class by one E.J "Dutch" Harrison.

Mike Long said when Dutch Harrison got up to the microphone he was expecting some long technical boring commencement address out of him but Dutch just went to the mike and said:

"Boys, I'll tell you everything you need to know about playing golf. Don't try to hook the ball because if you do you'll be under a F.... tree and out of play!"

And Dutch sat down.

Mike Long said it was the greatest commencement address imaginable.

What a guy that E.J "Dutch" Harrison.

[Tom Roewer]

I'm sorry, but I didn't think much of the start of this course.  Just look at that first hole with a cart path cutting right across the fairway.  Is there any doubt that Art Hills was there?  Any at all?

Also, aside from aesthetics, I thought the first 7 holes were nothing special at all.  It wasn't until the 8th that the course started getting interesting.  I thought it was dynamite after that.

Cheez Shivas!  I know it's not an El Track or hitting over a police car, but come on, you (of anyone) has got to appreciate the elevator.

[Kyle Harris]

Here's a photo of that 1st tee with golf course superintendent Mike Zedreck.

How does that drop relate to the first tee at Manufacturers'?

[Jim Nugent]

That picture of the 1st reminds me of a narrower version of the 1st at Riviera.  Are the two holes par 5s of around the same length?  Do they play at all similar?  Am I completely full of it?  

[George Pazin]

I haven't played Manufacturers or Riviera, but I can tell you that picture - as nice as it is - doesn't do the drop justice. It's the highest tee I've ever seen, including a couple a mountain top tees at Paa Ko Ridge. Actually, the top tee at Paa Ko on #17 (I think) might be higher - I think they have an oxygen assist machine up there.

And Tom R, Shiv complained about the early holes, not the later holes, which include the elevator at 18!

 

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