Golfweek Snubs 9-Hole Course

[Kalen Braley]

Tom,

Its alright, I've been called worse.  And hell if its gonna flood, then i'd rather prefer to be on that ark  

I knew what you meant, I think some people just like to argue for arguments sake.  I think the cyber-term is trolling...

Kalen

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom,

Its alright, I've been called worse.  And hell if its gonna flood, then i'd rather prefer to be on that ark  

I knew what you meant, I think some people just like to argue for arguments sake.  I think the cyber-term is trolling...

Kalen

Kalen:  well said.  I shall cease to enable such.

[John Kavanaugh]

Kalen

Don't let Huck lump you in his camp or you might end up like Jordan.  If it is trolling to call someone out on an golf course architecture site that says a course you have been a member of for 39 years in not a real course or a weird outlier when all the facts prove other wise, so be it.

[John Kavanaugh]

9 holers are almost always an affordable option.  It hurts the future of golf to let people like Huck spread lies and make belief without being challenged.

[Kalen Braley]

I don't think it was a personal attack on you or your course at all.  You go there, you are happy with it, and you like it.  Thats all fine and good.

Tom was just pointing out that most look to play 18 on the weekend.  When we say most, we mean the average golfer.  I'm guessing that most on this site, play a hellavu lot more than the average golfer and so 9 holers are great to add some variety.  For your average weekend warrior, such as myself, playing golf when I'm able to get out means playing 18 and then only playing 9 if I can't get out to a 18 holer.

Sure maybe Tom overstated a bit, but he retracted that part and so its all square in my book.

[John Kavanaugh]

I'll take a huckabian stab and guess that most golfer play at the same course week after week...be it a nine or eighteen holer.  

[Joe Hancock]

At my course in West Michigan, even on weekends we do no more than 10% of our rounds as 18 holes. Yes, we're an 18 hole course, but 90% or more of our rounds occur 9 holes at a time. This isn't uncommon 'round these parts...

Joe

[Kalen Braley]

Perhaps its a west coast/east coast thing then because 18 holes is the default choice out here.

So that would explain a lot of the varying views.

[Joe Hancock]

The club I was at in NC was almost always 18 holers....that was almost 15 years ago, so things may have changed.

Sorry, didn't mean to interupt the love-fest.....

Joe

[Kalen Braley]

lol..no problem Joe,

We needed a nice little diversion.  That raises an interesting question.  Do private 18 hole clubs play more 9 hole rounds as vs a public course?

[Alfie]

Hey ! You guys are getting a wee bit over excited about the 9 holers ?

Tom Huckaby is right in the context of his posts. I too, believe that the average golfer has an "attitude" towards playing 9 holers IMO. (in Scotland, of course)

John is also right in standing up for the 9 holers and their place in the golfing world. The 9 hole course / club will often host a far better class of people than some of the higher class establishments !

And Anthony should come to Scotland and highlight these facts in a new book about 9 hole courses and the people who run them ?

Stay cool boys.

Alfie.

[Forrest Richardson]

Turn my back for a moment and this post has taken off!

The courses I am working on are public (daily fee). One could be private with a pub and fitness center focus...besides the golf.

I am, perhaps, more scared about John K. getting a Blackberry than I am some of the feelings here about the 18-hole fetish. I can hardly believe I am on GCA...let me check...yes, looks like GCA...hummmm....must be a bad connection...

Let us all recall Leith. Let all do some math. 9+9 is 18. Let us all reflect on some of the issues facing golf: water, land, play volume, time constraints of the golfer, environmental impacts, and the cost. A 9-hole course is just about 1/2 the cost of 18, less an annual factor for operations, which is likely slightly more per hole than 18.

Let us all recall the Royal Worlington model:

THEY PLAY FOURSOME MATCHES AS A RULE...THIS PRODUCES 9-HOLE ROUND TIMES OF ABOUT 1.25 HOURS...IN ESSENCE, THIS 9-HOLE WONDER HAS AS MANY MEMBERS AS ANY BRITISH COURSE OF STATURE...AND IT ACCOMMODATES AS MUCH PLAY...ALL ON 1/2 THE LAND

[John Kavanaugh]

5he great thing about a blackberry is that now I can post, poker and drink all at the same time.  Just not very well.

[Tom Huckaby]

Well I believe we now have our explanation for tonight's Kavanaugh posts.

As for me, well all I can say is well said Alfie and well said Forrest.  Just do understand that the reason for the "excitement" from my end was not at all about any golf courses, 9 or 18 or 79 holes... it was about being called the names I've already listed, based on thoughts I neither intended nor stated.  

I love 9 hole courses.

I just know I'm in a small minority in this feeling.

TH

[Forrest Richardson]

Think of them as special places...as an architect, it is critical that more of the holes be truly memorable. With 18 you can allow a few to fall through the cracks and just be "OK".  

[John Kavanaugh]

Well I believe we now have our explanation for tonight's Kavanaugh posts.

As for me, well all I can say is well said Alfie and well said Forrest.  Just do understand that the reason for the "excitement" from my end was not at all about any golf courses, 9 or 18 or 79 holes... it was about being called the names I've already listed, based on thoughts I neither intended nor stated.  

I love 9 hole courses.

I just know I'm in a small minority in this feeling.

TH

If you would't post so often on threads that you know nothing about you wouldn't step on your niblick so often.

[Tom Huckaby]

That's it, John?

Have another drink - that was weak. And can I get some action on the other players in your poker game?  This type of "cleverness" should have them champing at the bit to bet BIG with you involved.

I will say this, though:  you just set a new standard in the pot calling the kettle black category.

Peace and love, brother.

 

[Kevin_Reilly]

Not the type where I'm worried about my car getting broken into, or being approached by strangers, or getting mugged for that matter.  

In my 25+ years playing there, I've never had my car broken into (or seen anyone else suffer that fate) or been mugged or seen anyone get mugged or narrowly miss getting mugged or know someone who got mugged or know someone who knows someone who got mugged.  But, there must be people getting mugged because Lord knows just as there were 10 million people who say they were at Woodstock, there are thousands of people who know someone who got mugged out there.  Must have been a guy with a lot of friends.

As for being approached by strangers, that happens all the time.  I usually refer to them as golfers, though.

[JR Potts]

Well I believe we now have our explanation for tonight's Kavanaugh posts.

As for me, well all I can say is well said Alfie and well said Forrest.  Just do understand that the reason for the "excitement" from my end was not at all about any golf courses, 9 or 18 or 79 holes... it was about being called the names I've already listed, based on thoughts I neither intended nor stated.  

I love 9 hole courses.

I just know I'm in a small minority in this feeling.

TH

I've never played a 9-hole course in my life.  Besides the Dunes Club, I don't know where to find one.  I would reach out to TLavin to experience one but I don't want to use the GCA for access.

[Tom Huckaby]

Kevin:

In my 25+ years of playing there also, I too never got mugged, nor do I know anyone who has either.  Of course I can say the same for working in downtown Oakland for 13 years.

I just never felt completely safe in either place, though, and would continue to advise friends to go to either only if they have to.  Of course playing Gleneagles does constitute a "have to" for a lot of people, including me sometimes.  I just wouldn't send my parents alone there, nor my brother and sister coming from LA.  Likely it's paranoid... you're right, it really isn't THAT bad....

But it is an issue.

TH

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

Ryan,

Where do you live?

Anthony

[Forrest Richardson]

Last year I had my truck broken into in broad daylight in Phoenix. Briefcase and laptop gone...as we had just moved into a new office, back-up was a month behind.

Pass code protect your laptops! Back them up.

[Kalen Braley]

Kevin:

In my 25+ years of playing there also, I too never got mugged, nor do I know anyone who has either.  Of course I can say the same for working in downtown Oakland for 13 years.

I just never felt completely safe in either place, though, and would continue to advise friends to go to either only if they have to.  Of course playing Gleneagles does constitute a "have to" for a lot of people, including me sometimes.  I just wouldn't send my parents alone there, nor my brother and sister coming from LA.  Likely it's paranoid... you're right, it really isn't THAT bad....

But it is an issue.

TH

As someone who has been held up at gunpoint twice in my life, perhaps I'm a bit more wary of getting myself into a situation that is perceived as sketchy...

[Tom Huckaby]

Kalen:

Right on.  And given this is - prepare for blasphemy - pretty frivolous selfish entertainment in the great scheme of things, well... With many other choices, one just does keep this kinda thing in mind.

But Kevin makes a good point that we shouldn't make it sound TOO bad - because it's not.

TH

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

Kalen,

I was only held up at gunpoint once, but I had the good fortune to also get pistol whipped and I would not dissuade people from playing Gleneagles.

Anthony