Heathland golf experience on this side of the pond?

[Chris Parker]

I admittedly spend way too much of my time on the internet looking at far away courses and dreaming that I was there.  Just ask my wife.  
Lately I've been checking out photos of the great heathland courses SW of London.  It's an aesthetically beautiful area, and arguably the birthplace of modern golf course architecture.  Hopefully one day I will get there.
My question is this:
There are a couple of courses I can think of right off the top of my head that, for marketing reasons or whatever, are called Heathlands (Tom Doak's Heathlands in Myrtle Beach and Doug Carrick's Osprey Valley Heathlands north of Toronto), but are obviously meant to emulate the links experience.  Since I'm not well-travelled (the understatement of the year, so far), I'm wondering if anyone knows of any special courses on this side of the Atlantic that succeed in to any degree in emulating a true "Heathland" experience?

[Michael Dugger]

seems hidden creek would have to be on that list

some fancy portions of Bandon trails

[Jeff_Mingay]

Chris,

I've read that the earliest versions of Colt's Toronto and Hamilton courses were heathland-like, in style and appearance. Colt had just laid out Swinley Forest when he came to Canada to design Toronto and Hamilton. Antique photos of those courses definitely show a Swinley-, Sunningdale-esque look.  

Sadly, both courses are relatively "cleaned up" these days. And, the bunker styling has changed dramatically, away from an resemblence of Colt's bunkers found in the heathlands.

The principle reason there aren't many heathland experiences in North America though, is: there aren't many (if any) heaths. Simple.

[Dan Boerger]

Chris - I recommend you start saving! I fell in love with the Heathland courses a few years back when I was in London over a  business week and was invited to play Walton Heath. Nothing like the real thing. I think it's really difficult to replicate the soil conditions not to mention the heather in bloom. - Dan

[Tom_Doak]

Do you guys all know what heather is?  It's a beautiful plant and an amazing golf hazard.  Some people now actually think it is just long grass, because the word has been bastardized as a marketing term, and that just makes me cringe.

To me, you can't have a "heathland" course without heather, and I have only seen small bits of heather on any course in the USA or Canada.

The original back nine at High Pointe had ferns out in the rough between holes, which was close to that feel, but it wasn't heather.  We thought about trying to plant some at Pacific Dunes in the beginning, but realized after a little while that it really didn't need anything more than the natural variety of vegetation it had ... heather grows just fine out in Bandon, but unfortunately there isn't much growing on the property for Bandon Dunes Resort.

[Mark Bourgeois]

The person who invents a "heather wedge" will be a rich man,   although isn't global warming threatening it?

In the U.S., the closest analogue I've come across, in terms of "playability," might be the dreaded ice plant. Although the two are quite different and so an "ice plant wedge" would likely need to be different from a "heather wedge!"

[Tom_Doak]

Mark:

There's barely any iceplant left on the courses in Monterey.  It is not a native plant so it has become a victim of environmental political correctness.

[jeffwarne]

Tom Doak,

Since you mentioned it ,any particular reason why your links like course at The Legends is called Heathland instead of Linksland? I don't remember any heather and I doubt it would survive a South Carolina summer.

It's one of my favorite courses in Myrtle Beach and I recommend it often to friends but I often wondered about the name when i played it.

 

[Eric Franzen]

Mark:

There's barely any iceplant left on the courses in Monterey.  It is not a native plant so it has become a victim of environmental political correctness.

There is plenty of nasty iceplant to mess around with during the last nine at Pacific Grove Muni. I encourage you to have a clooser look at the grooves on my clubs if further evidence is needed...

[Dan Boerger]

Tom - Very good point. The first time my ball landed in the heather, the caddy suggested this: unless you can get a 3 wood on it, take an 8 iron. Great advice ... beautiful but trechearous (like some women I've known!).

[Tommy Williamsen]

I keep loking for a heathland experience in the US.  Next to links golf heathland golf is is my favorite.  I agree with someone who said that true heathland is disappearing even in  England with the explosion of trees.  It cannot be true heathland without the heather which gives it it's distinctive flavor and look.  Yet I think there are some couses that do have the "experience" of heathland golf on this side of the pond, albeit sans heather.  NGLA may be one.  It felt like Walton Heath at the holes around the turn.  But even courses that give the experience of heathland playability  are few and far between.

[Scott_Burroughs]

Tom Doak,

Since you mentioned it ,any particular reason why your links like course at The Legends is called Heathland instead of Linksland?

Jeff,

I seem to recall Tom once saying that it was originally to be called Linksland, but the telephone tee-time operators got tongue-tied too often trying to say it many times per day, hence, the purposeful misnomer.

Of course, how many hundreds of courses in the U.S. have 'Links' in their name, when none are true links?  In the U.S., if a few holes are treeless, owners think that qualifies as a links course.  

[Jay Flemma]

Hiawatha Landing is a great choice.  $45.  Its in Binghamton, NY...spend the bext day at scenic Conklin PLayers' Club

[Tony_Muldoon]

[Eric Franzen]

Good stuff, Tony.

Some Swedish heathland golf for you all. This is Ljunghusen - the next door neighbour to Falsterbo.

[wsmorrison]

I've played a few Heathland courses including Swinley Forest and the Addington.  I've been in the heather more than a few times.  For you experienced Heathlanders, what is the best way to play the shot in a lie such as suggested in Eric's first photo?  What club do you use?  What are the ideal club characteristics (loft, bounce etc)?

[Jeff_Mingay]

Mark:

There's barely any iceplant left on the courses in Monterey.  It is not a native plant so it has become a victim of environmental political correctness.

Tom,

Not to get off topic here, but how does the gorse at Bandon relate to your quote above?

[Chris Parker]

Thanks for your replies everyone.  I know that they're aren't any comparable tracts of heather in North America, but I was wondering if there were any golf experiences that came close.  

I've often wondered how the ice plant compared to heather or gorse.  For the botanically-inclined out there, are there any native plants that could be substituted for heather, gorse, or ice plant as hazards or rough on a golf course?

Jeff, I'm glad you posed the question about gorse at Bandon.  I've wondered that myself, since it's considered a noxious weed in the State of Oregon.

[Brad Tufts]

I've always imagined that Essex and Myopia have a look a bit like the London-area heathland courses, but most of the vegetation there is long fescue-like grass.  

I think it comes from the bunker styles, the grass-faced/pot/collapsing edge style often has moss and other non-grass plants growing on them, giving them an "almost-heather" look.

[Tom_Doak]

Jeff:

The fact that gorse was a non-native species was very helpful in getting the permits for Bandon Dunes ... their stated goal on the first course was to remove ALL the gorse, both for environmental reasons and as a firebreak.  But, it is remarkably persistent, and it just keeps coming back.

We did choose to leave some of it at Pacific Dunes.  Fortunately, there was no explicit promise about gorse eradication in the permits, unlike at Spanish Bay in California ... and the California Coastal Commission does not have any power north of the state line.

[Mike Benham]

I'm wondering if anyone knows of any special courses on this side of the Atlantic that succeed in to any degree in emulating a true "Heathland" experience?

Poppy Ridge in Livermore, sister to Poppy Hills in Pebble Beach, claims to be a Scottish Heathland course:  (From the Northern California Golf Association Website):

Poppy Ridge Golf Course is the second NCGA Member Course and opened in 1996. The 27 hole Scottish Heathland Course consists of three nines aptly named Chardonnay, Zinfandel and Merlot and is located in the wine country of Livermore. Rees Jones, 1995 Golf Digest Architect of the Year compares the design and playability to Scottish links courses.[/i]

Poppy Hills / Poppy Ridge

[Jonathan Cummings]

I'll bet Tom D hasn't been to his Myrtle course in years.  He can refute me (he always does!) but I've always gotten the sense that he wasn't that proud of Heathlands.  I have always liked the course and since the first time I played it, soon after it opened, I've always thought it's a refreshing change in a sea of bland Myrtle Beach layouts.

A good US heathlands rendition is Prairie Dunes.  But we don't stick to too strict a policy on this side of the pond in naming our courses,  Case-in-point.  Links at Red Mike in North Dakota.  Only we could name a course "links" that's 1500 miles from any ocean.  

JC

[Paul_Turner]

There's a small patch of heather on the 7th, par 3 hole, at The Orchards in Mass.  It's the real thing.

[Jeff_Mingay]

Tom D.:

Interesting that it sounds like the situation with the gorse changed between Bandon Dunes and Pacific Dunes, in regard to eradication.

Your answer actually rings a bell considering I recently finished "Dream Golf" by Stephen Goodwin: an excellent tale told by an entertaining writer. I'd recommend it to everyone.  

[Jfaspen]

The Gailes at Lakewood Shores Resort in Northern Michigan..

Although the conditioning falls short of "firm and fast", the design is meant to imitate that of a heathland course (imho).

jf