Ross course at French Lick - my first post

[John Mayhugh]

I've enjoyed this board for quite some time.  I'm not sure how useful my contributions will be, but it's nice to be a part of it.

I live in Louisville, KY and on Sunday finally got around to playing the recently restored Donald Ross course at French Lick.  Even though temperatures were in the upper 60s all weekend, I couldn't get anyone else to play on Sunday so I thought to call French Lick.

The off-season fee was only $50 for all of the golf you wanted to play, including cart.  I drove over and ended up playing 54 holes.  the person in the golf shop said that there were only 18 players there all day.  That's hard to believe, because this was one great experience.

The greens had been aerated fairly recently and were rather slow, so that made the putting far less interesting than I remembered.  But I had so much fun with the tee shots and approach shots I hardly minded.  I especially enjoyed playing from various tees and seeing what an impact the fairway bunkering had on the tee shots when I played from the right tees.  

Ordinarily, I would prefer to walk when playing (especially this time of year), but the chance to play so many holes made riding worth it.  

The staff told me that they intend to remain open all year as long as weather permits.  I would encourage anyone in the area who hasn't played the course do so as soon as they get a chance.  And if you need a fourth let me know.  I haven't had so much fun in a long time.

[Glenn Spencer]

Welcome and nice post!! I am in Cincinnati and if the weather cooperates, I see no reason not to check this out. I have always wanted to go over there. When would you guess the greens were aerated?

[John Mayhugh]

I would guess three or four weeks ago.  They mostly rolled OK, just slow.  The speed of the greens deprived me of the joy of trying putts from all sort of crazy locations.

[Jay Flemma]

Really nice post about an unsung area of the country htat has some sweet designs.

Welcome to the treehouse, John.  Help yourself to the fridge

[Nick Pozaric]

Looks like we missed you by a day.  We went up Monday and played.  Great job on the restoration.  We were a bit upset the didnt say anything about the greens to us when we made our time.  Par 3s from the back tees are brutal, 3 of them are 250 and it was windy  We did like it so much we are planning a return trip for next year

[RJ_Daley]

John, it is always good to have a new voice on GCA.com.  With the good weather, I wonder if you have the same thing going on with low golfer turn out on Sundays as we do when NFL football is in progress.

Have you played many Ross courses, and how does the remodel stack up to your experiences with other Ross courses?  What are the greens and surrounds like at F.L.?

[Mark_Rowlinson]

Nick, You say that three of the par 3s are 250.  Hooray!  Far too long for me, but don't we need thenm 270-300 yards from the back tees to equate to the longer short holes of the past?

[Gary Daughters]

John,

Sounds like you hit the lottery there.

Nice post, and informative.  Fear not the fear factor, just go for it.

Gary

[John Mayhugh]

RJ
The only other Ross course that I have played was Pinehurst #2, so it's hard to make much of a comparison.  The land at French Lick is considerably more hilly than Pinehurst and a good number of the holes play to a somewhat elevated green.  FL also has very few trees except for the boundaries of the course.

The fairway bunkering requires accurate or at least thoughtful tee shots when you play from the proper tees.  But things are their most interesting from about 50 yards and in.  You don't have much of a chance to bounce the ball up due to the way the greens are elevated and bunkering about 20 yards short of the green on many of the holes.  

Nick
Doesn't it say a lot for the course that you're looking forward to returning even though the greens (probably the best feature of the course) were sub-par?  I know that I am.  

[Nick Pozaric]

RJ
The only other Ross course that I have played was Pinehurst #2, so it's hard to make much of a comparison.  The land at French Lick is considerably more hilly than Pinehurst and a good number of the holes play to a somewhat elevated green.  FL also has very few trees except for the boundaries of the course.

The fairway bunkering requires accurate or at least thoughtful tee shots when you play from the proper tees.  But things are their most interesting from about 50 yards and in.  You don't have much of a chance to bounce the ball up due to the way the greens are elevated and bunkering about 20 yards short of the green on many of the holes.  

Nick
Doesn't it say a lot for the course that you're looking forward to returning even though the greens (probably the best feature of the course) were sub-par?  I know that I am.  

Great course and not many around like it.  The routing is fantastic.  How about #15 from the back tees, think it was around 660 into the wind!

[Dan Moore]

Welcome John.  Thanks for the report.  

I am very interested in checking out French Lick once the greens grow back in.  

Maybe a spring date can be arranged.  

[John Kavanaugh]

I played three weeks ago and didn't feel the aerated greens detracted from the ability to see what is there in the least.  As a matter of fact the slowness gives you a better feel of the original intent of the design.

Not asking if greens have been aerated when going to play a course that is serving up winter rates is no ones fault but your own.  I would suggest to anyone interested in architecture to go play the course now at this reduced rate, introduce yourself to the pro and ask as kindly as possible for a tour of the new Dye course being built down the road.  The hospitality extended to me was of the most generous nature I have ever experienced as a paying customer.  I even spent one day just touring the two courses on a scouting mission and came back with seven friends the next day to play.

[Dan Moore]

I wonder why they didn't aerate until so late in the growing season that they didn't have time to grow back-in.  

[John Kavanaugh]

You could guess that they did not want to aerate until after the grand opening of Sept 8th...but it is not all that uncommon to aerate in these parts late in the year.  Remember this was a full renovation on a very tight time schedule with additional tough weather not helping matters.  They also did a deep core aeration that takes time to heal.  The best part was that they cut their rates with a bunch of 60 deg days left to play..Today may have been the last.

[Dan Moore]

Makes sense they wanted to get some play in after opening before doing the work.  I wonder if they then can avoid aerating in the Spring which if they allow play during the non growing season I assume they would have to do normally.  

[Nick Pozaric]

Considering they didnt charge our group to play we werent too upset about it, just happy to enjoy the course with nice weather.  Then we topped it off with a trip to the casino where we all walked away with the house's money

[John Kavanaugh]

Considering they didnt charge our group to play we werent too upset about it, just happy to enjoy the course with nice weather.  Then we topped it off with a trip to the casino where we all walked away with the house's money

The golf pro has been at French Lick for 29 years now...I hope we at GCA don't convince him to find another profession as the opening of the new world class Dye course will test his patience with those who do not pay yet don't get too upset when conditions are not only perfect but not perfectly outlined before the patron steps onto the property.

So where was the pin on number eight...It was a far back pin for me.  What did you think of the composition of the sand...is Valhalla using anything similar or will they be going with a more fluffy gradation.

[Nick Pozaric]

Considering they didnt charge our group to play we werent too upset about it, just happy to enjoy the course with nice weather.  Then we topped it off with a trip to the casino where we all walked away with the house's money

The golf pro has been at French Lick for 29 years now...I hope we at GCA don't convince him to find another profession as the opening of the new world class Dye course will test his patience with those who do not pay yet don't get too upset when conditions are not only perfect but not perfectly outlined before the patron steps onto the property.

So where was the pin on number eight...It was a far back pin for me.  What did you think of the composition of the sand...is Valhalla using anything similar or will they be going with a more fluffy gradation.

 We drove an hour and a half and we get there and realize they did work on the greens and didnt tell us they had done it, whether we paid or not does not matter.  The first time I called about playing when they re-opened he told me about every condition on the course and how I should wait 2-3 weeks to play because it was rough around the edges.  Like I mentioned earlier it didnt bother us too much considering we are already planning a return trip.
8 was front middle so it was pretty tame.  Last time I played it was back middle left.  I wasnt in any bunkers so I cant compare the consistency of them.  

[John Mayhugh]

I played #8 with the hole cut in the back of the green.  The tee shot on that hole is one that I never could get right.

I'm glad John K mentioned the sand.  I loved the texture of it.  Probably the best sand I've played out of all year.  It would be great if Valhalla used this, but I'm betting on the fluffier stuff.

[Nick Pozaric]

I played #8 with the hole cut in the back of the green.  The tee shot on that hole is one that I never could get right.

I'm glad John K mentioned the sand.  I loved the texture of it.  Probably the best sand I've played out of all year.  It would be great if Valhalla used this, but I'm betting on the fluffier stuff.

Where did you hit your t shot?  We all bit off too much and had downhill lies in the rough through the fairway.  One guy in our group bombed it and was 40 yards out.  I had 90 to the flag.

[John Mayhugh]

First time through, I pulled my tee shot and ended up in the left rough somewhere.  Never found the ball.  Second time I did the same as you guys and ended up with a downhill lie in the rough.  Third time I just played out into the fairway but had about 190 in.  Interesting hole.

And thanks to everyone that's being so welcoming to me.  

[ed_getka]

John M,
   Welcome to the site. Bringing up French Lick is a good way to introduce yourself here. I played a couple of rounds there on a cross-country post-graduation golf trip in 1991 and just loved the greens with the buried pachyderms.

John K,
   How far into the process is the new course? Anything interesting jump out at you at this point?

[John Kavanaugh]

Ed,

The Dye course has been routed with most dirt moved and greens and tees all roughed in.  The thing that jumps out is the elevation of the site as it reminds me of close to being on Lookout Mountain.  The tree removal program may be unprecedented.  I was shocked by the quality of the entire project and believe it will be a huge success.  The course will be ready for play in 2008.

[Nick Pozaric]

Ed,

The Dye course has been routed with most dirt moved and greens and tees all roughed in.  The thing that jumps out is the elevation of the site as it reminds me of close to being on Lookout Mountain.  The tree removal program may be unprecedented.  I was shocked by the quality of the entire project and believe it will be a huge success.  The course will be ready for play in 2008.

One other thing they told us was that they need to bring a bunch of topsoil in.

[ed_getka]

John,
   Thanks for the info. I look forward to getting back there some day to see both courses.