[David Stamm]

Ed- I haven't heard any mention of Poppy. I played it a few years ago and I liked it. Do you think there is any reason why it isn't mentioned ?

[Tom Huckaby]

Ed- I haven't heard any mention of Poppy. I played it a few years ago and I liked it. Do you think there is any reason why it isn't mentioned ?

In case you want views other than from Maserati/Caviar Getka....

 

Poppy Hills is a damn good course and gets way too much flack, methinks.  I've always enjoyed playing it.  BUT... we locals get NCGA member rates, which are a great deal.  For non-members it is WAY overpriced... its in the Pasa league and maybe it's worth that for one play, but likely not.

Here are the Poppy Hills rates:

2006 Rates

Monday - Thursday
NCGA Member $52
NCGA Guest $80
SCGA $80
Public $195 (effective October 1)


Friday - Sunday and Holidays
NCGA Member $66
NCGA Guest $95
SCGA $95
Public $195 (effective October 1)


Golf Cars
Monday - Sunday & Holidays $32
(2006 golf car rate $16 per person)

I assume you're SCGA member, David?  If so that's not THAT bad... but still pretty damn pricey.  I'd say that's worth it to do once anyway.  The "public" price is a joke.

TH

[David Stamm]

Sorry, Tom. I'm interested in all views.

Seriously, i like Poppy too. NCGA also gives a discount to SCGA members as well. And I agree, w/ that price, it's a bargain. That course has some of the biggest greens I've ever seen!

[Tim Leahy]

Tom/ David, the "stars don't have to aline" to use the Duke's card, I have purchased one myself twice and saved a bunch of money, check out the web site, it lists any limitations clearly and from my personal usage I always found the personnel at all courses treated my like a member when I mentioned the card. I had no problem with making reservations or getting the discounts and it saved me a bunch of money, which seems to be a consideration.

[Tom Huckaby]

Sorry, Tom. I'm interested in all views.

Seriously, i like Poppy too. NCGA also gives a discount to SCGA members as well. And I agree, w/ that price, it's a bargain. That course has some of the biggest greens I've ever seen!

David - no hassles - Ed is a friend and you know how friends treat each other sometimes.  

SCGA rate is pretty decent at Poppy - our NCGA rate remains a steal.  We're lucky to have that course.  But you can see why we'd be reticent to recommend it to paying visitors....

TH

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom/ David, the "stars don't have to aline" to use the Duke's card, I have purchased one myself twice and saved a bunch of money, check out the web site, it lists any limitations clearly and from my personal usage I always found the personnel at all courses treated my like a member when I mentioned the card. I had no problem with making reservations or getting the discounts and it saved me a bunch of money, which seems to be a consideration.

Tim, I thought I asked if we had to "discuss" this again?  

Suffice to say I disagree with Tim on this.  But we've hashed it out way too many times already.

TH

[David Stamm]

As a side note, I was given a discount from Pas. good for my next visit becuase when I played, Doak I guess had just started  his work there. It didn't ruin the experience, but I thought how refreshing a place of that caliber would step to the plate like that. I'm really looking forward to seeing what Doak has done there. It looks great in the photos.

[Tim Leahy]

Tom/David, they have advertised the Duke's card in the annual NCGA blue book for the last ten years, you'd think someone would have put a stop to that if it wasn't a good deal and I personally have never heard anyone but Tom say anything bad about it.

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom/David, they have advertised the Duke's card in the annual NCGA blue book for the last ten years, you'd think someone would have put a stop to that if it wasn't a good deal and I personally have never heard anyone but Tom say anything bad about it.

What the heck does advertising in NCGA magazine have to do with anything?

I guess we really travel in different circles, Tim.  I'm not kidding - everyone I talked to who got it wished they had not.  I don't know a single person who's ever bought it twice.

My take remains it's a great deal if you want to play Del Monte a lot, but not worth the trouble if you are trying to save money playing Spyglass or Spanish Bay... that is unless you are VERY flexible.  The key restriction is you get 14 day advance times, the general public gets way more than that... Such that unless you want to cheat the system, you won't get any decent tee-times.

I know it worked for you Tim, and that's great.  We shall just have to agree to disagree, yet again.

David in case you are interested, here's the deal - from Pebble Beach resorts website:


Del Monte Golf Course provides value that is unmatched by any other local course for an annual fee of just $255. You save money, enjoy reduced green fees and much more on one of California's favorite golf courses.

For one annual fee, you'll receive all of these benefits:


Discounted greens fees on Del Monte Golf Course: Only $39 Monday though Friday, $55 Saturday and Sunday, (regularly $105)
$30 in Grill Bucks for the Del Monte Grill
Free golf cart December - February; only $17 per person thereafter
One free round after every ten rounds
60 day advance booking, Monday - Friday
30 day advance booking Saturday and Sunday
25% merchandise discount
Receive a discounted rate for up to three of your guests each visit to Del Monte Golf Course
Membership good for one full year from date of purchase
Play The Links at Spanish Bay for only $125 (a $240 value) or play Spyglass Hill for only $175 (a $300 value). These discounts are on a space available basis with 14 day advance notice. And, as a Duke's Club member, you can bring up to three guests at this special rate.
Additional cards for spouse $80 or children $55 each.


TH

[Tom Huckaby]

As a side note, I was given a discount from Pas. good for my next visit becuase when I played, Doak I guess had just started  his work there. It didn't ruin the experience, but I thought how refreshing a place of that caliber would step to the plate like that. I'm really looking forward to seeing what Doak has done there. It looks great in the photos.

Concur there - they are good people at Pasa.  But the normal prices are still not any sort of value!

TH

[David Stamm]

The rates for SB and SH would be great,   but I don't know anyone that's been able to get on those courses w/ that short of time table. Good info.

[ed_getka]

Tom,
    Value in my world is what am I getting for the money. For our purposes here it is the intersection of golf architecture with cost. Thus I feel Pasa gives me the most architecture for my money. For my money Pasa is the gold standard when it comes to public access golf in NorCal.

David,
     I forgot Poppy Hills. I have played it twice. It is a good value if you have the NCGA membership, but it just isn't a course that I care for that much. It is a good test of golf, but I just don't find it very interesting. I also hate the par 5 (on the back nine ?) that wraps around a lake, that is just awkward beyond all get out for my game. I love the challenge of the first hole and there are some other holes out there that I like, but overall there are courses I like better, and since I don't play that many rounds/year, I don't play courses I don't care for.

[Tom Huckaby]

The rates for SB and SH would be great,   but I don't know anyone that's been able to get on those courses w/ that short of time table. Good info.

My take exactly.  One can cheat the system - that is, make a teetime normally, cancel it 14 days prior, re-book it then... but that just doesn't seem right to me.  And it is the experience of those I've talked to expect perhaps Tim that that is the only way to get a decent tee time and get the Duke's card discount... That is unless you have a full 14 day block and are very very very flexible.

TH

[ed_getka]

Tom,
   You are making me out to be a rich snob. You know darn well I'm just a poor snob.
    Are you getting much sleep these days?

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom,
    Value in my world is what am I getting for the money. For our purposes here it is the intersection of golf architecture with cost. Thus I feel Pasa gives me the most architecture for my money. For my money Pasa is the gold standard when it comes to public access golf in NorCal.

I understand that, Ed.

I still think you're crazy if Pasa is a value.  But then again, "architecture" means a hell of a lot more to you than it does to me.  I will agree that Pasa is the gold standard for public golf in our area... I just wish it didn't cost one's weight in that substance to play there.

TH

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom,
   You are making me out to be a rich snob. You know darn well I'm just a poor snob.
    Are you getting much sleep these days?

Those who find Pasa a value at $150-$175 per round can label themselves.

 

And for such a poor snob, you sure do get around a lot....

In any case, tell me, how many times have you paid full fare and played Pasa?  If it were such a great value, wouldn't yoiu be playing it quite often?  And if you don't, well then why don't you?

TH

[David Stamm]

It is expensive, but if that course was in So Cal., it would get $200.00 t0 $250.00 all day long.

[Tom Huckaby]

It is expensive, but if that course was in So Cal., it would get $200.00 t0 $250.00 all day long.

Hmmm... I'm not sure that I agree your prices/standards are higher than ours.  Oh you have your share of overpriced courses also... but methinks this is a statewide thing.

And don't get me wrong - Pasa is FAR from suffering for play.  It's constantly packed - just generally by members and Ed Getka and his jet-set friends.

 

[rjsimper]

It is expensive, but if that course was in So Cal., it would get $200.00 t0 $250.00 all day long.

If that course was in So Cal, it'd be private

[John Kavanaugh]

Discussion of price and affordability has no place on this site.  Anybody who knows Huck knows the Duke card is not for him...but it may be for others.  Full disclosure on where you play and what you pay or just leave it out all together.

[David Stamm]

What I mean by that is, because it's a Mack. course, and a pretty darn good one at that, and because San Diego has such a dearth of truly historic courses, it would probably get it.Pelican Hill was getting $250.00 before they blew it up. It's funny, because there is so little in reagrds to historic courses here, guys are willing to go to TJ all the time to play TJ CC just because Mack did one of the nines there. Not saying we have different standards, we just don't have any standards to compare to done here. Out of the major cities in Cal., we have the slimmest pickings, public or private, in terms of quality in all the state. To quote Doaks Confidential Guide "Rancho Santa fe is probably the best course in San Diego, and that's not saying very much.'' That's all I meant by that price guess.

[Tom Huckaby]

Discussion of price and affordability has no place on this site.  Anybody who knows Huck knows the Duke card is not for him...but it may be for others.  Full disclosure on where you play and what you pay or just leave it out all together.

JK:  not sure what you mean by that, but I'm guessing this is another poorly-veiled rater attack.  Once again, I only very very rarely get any tee-times or comps locally via magazine ratings.  I am general public all the way.   But correct me if your cryptic message had other meanings.

For me, it's not worth $255 for a card that I won't be able to use for what I want, and that would be to save money playing Spyglass or Spanish.  I do get some chances to play Spyglass through NCGA course rating, but that too has massive limitations and thus I am lucky to avail myself of it every other year or so.  I do love Spyglass however, so I looked into this card long ago... and I just found the tee-time restriction to make it not worth buying.


So yes, the Duke's card may be fine for some - I believe I've given cogent arguments as to why I don't think it will work very well for most.  It surely doesn't work for me.

In any event, outside of this, why in general should discussions of price and affordability be verboten?

Seems to me that has great relevance, even inside this very insular site.

TH

 

[Tom Huckaby]

What I mean by that is, because it's a Mack. course, and a pretty darn good one at that, and because San Diego has such a dearth of truly historic courses, it would probably get it.Pelican Hill was getting $250.00 before they blew it up. It's funny, because there is so little in reagrds to historic courses here, guys are willing to go to TJ all the time to play TJ CC just because Mack did one of the nines there. Not saying we have different standards, we just don't have any standards to compare to done here. Out of the major cities in Cal., we have the slimmest pickings, public or private, in terms of quality in all the state. To quote Doaks Confidential Guide "Rancho Santa fe is probably the best course in San Diego, and that's not saying very much.'' That's all I meant by that price guess.

That makes good sense.  You do have little if any MacKenzie down there.  But....

1. How many golfers really care who the architect is of any course? and

2.  You have plenty of Thomas to keep you busy.

 

Pelican Hill sure as hell isn't $250+ because of the architect....

[ed_getka]

Tom,
   Other than the King's Putter and last month's round I have always payed full freight. I have an annual budget that comes out of our tax return and that pays for all golf and travel. So I usually try to play Pasa once a year (when a GCA'er comes to town, which adds even more value to my mind ).
    Golf above and beyond my budget, like Australia next year means I sell off part of my golf library which I will be doing this winter. I make an obscene amount of money to change diapers for a living, but not so obscene that cost isn't an issue.

[David Stamm]

There is a few who do care. But not many. It's like my dad says "they don't know what they don't know". Unfortunately, all of Thomas's work is in LA, not down here. And I agree, Pelican Hill is not worth that price tag. I played for $90.00 and that was probably right.

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