Football vs. golf architecture

[Dan Kelly]

Ed --

Next time you have an opening at Crystal Downs, just give me a call!

 

[Tom Huckaby]

GC - Ran doesn't participate in here period any more, and hasn't in years.  And are you SURE he doesn't give blessing to way more than you think?

In my discussions with him, he's never had a problem with it... Perhaps you know better.

In the meantime, I remain happy this place is how it is.  A site completely devoted to golf architecture and nothing but would be boring with a capital B.  But that perhaps is just me...

TH

[Geoffrey Childs]

GC - Ran doesn't participate in here period any more, and hasn't in years.  And are you SURE he doesn't give blessing to way more than you think?

In my discussions with him, he's never had a problem with it... Perhaps you know better.

In the meantime, I remain happy this place is how it is.  A site completely devoted to golf architecture and nothing but would be boring with a capital B.  But that perhaps is just me...

TH

And you have made that clear.  Perhaps I do know better having seen Ran recently  

Would you at least admit this is a GOLF site?

[Tom Huckaby]

Perhaps our friend Ran changes his tune depending on the audience.

 

Sure, this is a golf site.  But I've never played a round of golf, or had a post-round drink, at which other subjects haven't come up in the conversation.  I believe I've had plenty WITH YOU both on and off the course... and I treasure those.

Vive' free speech!

 

[Tommy_Naccarato]

I'm the one that is guilty here of carelessly removing Ed's post inviting anyone to join him at Crystal Downs, while letting the off-topic football talk to continue.

The point to this is simple: I remove the football posts and there will be some people that will be upset about this. Ran's policy is to let them go on and then die and then eliminate them when they get to page two or three. So if you don't like football posts, my suggestion is to do the same as you do when you come across the station that Howard Stern is on and you don't like him--don't listen to it or in this case, read it.

As far as Ed has stated, well, frankly speaking and as some of you know recently we have had a rash of access problems on GCA. It has gotten so ridiculous that I hear about it quite often, even from people that don't particpate on this website.

While Ed's invite was generous and more then gracious, there is a downside which Ran explained to all a few weeks ago: A-C-C-E-S-S.

One of the myriad of problems is the bartering or brokering of rounds of golf at other places. This meaning, Hey, If you can get me on Club Z, I'll get you on Club Y. Well play together!

If someone is using Golf Club Atlas as a platform for this, they are in serious jeopardy of losing their Golf Club Atlas posting privileges.

There is another factor which people must take into consideration:

Many of us are not members of private clubs, and in some cases some of us cannot afford to be. While we may have complete knowledge of how to present ourselves at a private club when getting the chance to visit, there is also the element of not really understanding what the purpose of being at a private club is all about.

Here is a point in example. Lets take the character well call Frankie Ouiment who happens to know someone who is a member of the X Club, that classic or much new heralded design of much beloved and famed Austrian golf course designer, Dr. Fritz FazTameo.

Frankie goes on Golf Club Atlas and posts, I'm going to Bumfrick, Timbucktoo to play the FazTameo's X Club, and I have an opening for one if anyone should care to join me!

Yes, it's a nice and generous offer, but meanwhile you have one or more members of the X Club--DUES PAYING MEMBERS WHO PAID AN INITATION FEE OF SOME AMOUNT AND THAT WANT TO UPHOLD THE EXCLUSIVENESS OF THEIR CLUB--A PRIVATE CLUB.......

How do you think they are going to feel that they are seeing this all transpire on an internet website, that their PRIVATE CLUB is accessible by just going on to this website?

The point to all of this is that there probably members that don't care and it's more then likely that there are members that really do. I know that in some cases no harm was ever intended, but the problem is that it devalues the purpose of this website--more then any off-topic posts. In many cases, I have witnessed myself on many occasions that the members of a club that offered access to someone weren't even prepared for the buzzsaw of requests that came afterward, and ultimately, that's my point.

For those of us that are fortunate to have been invited without reservations by members that not only want to get to know you, but share the joy of their special golf courses, I urge all to act accordingly. To others who just love talking about great golf design--then more then anything, enjoy this website.

[Tom Huckaby]

Well then, there you have it.  Thanks for setting this straight, Tommy.

And as I say, I know I'm a bad boy for the football talk... but it will soon die and as you say, those who don't like it can look away.

But the main point is what you just elaborated.

TH

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Thanks for understanding to Tom. It is appreciated.

I don't have a huge problem with off-topic posts, but when they become more numerous or bigger then the subject of the website, then I can understand some people's frustration. However, Ed's frustration is simply as I have stated. It's nothing personal, not at least as much as he thinks it is and to the extent of which he has elaborated here.

[Mike Benham]

... If you can get me on Club Z, I'll get you on Club Y ...

Can you tell me a little about these clubs, Z and Y?

Any chance we can have an outing there?  I'll even start rooting for the Dodgers ...

[ed_getka]

Tommy,
   Thank you for clarifying the situation. I suspected it revolved around an access issue, and I appreciate you letting me know. I tried hard to find someone without using GCA because of the access issues, but then when it was coming down to the wire I didn't want a spot to be wasted.

[Geoffrey Childs]

I don't have a huge problem with off-topic posts, but when they become more numerous or bigger then the subject of the website, then I can understand some people's frustration.

Tommy

As an example- How about when the OT threads push an announcement and discussion of Tony Pioppi's book too rapidly to page 2 or 3? This site is an appropriate avenue for GCA enthusiasts to learn about the book and with Ran's permission a good place to promote it. I just think its a shame for non-golf related banter to be allowed here.  From discussions with Ran I would not go so far as to say he approves OT threads as much as he has stated his great displeasure from the IM's and emails of complaint he has to deal with from the whiners who contribute to those discussions!

[Tom Huckaby]

GC:

Of course you mean the emails and IMs Ran gets are from the whiners and complainers who don't like OT posts, right?  They would have to surpass the volume of those complaining to Ran if an OT post gets deleted...

So OK, of course Tommy can and will answer himself - and as you see the issue here did go FAR beyond OT posts, but what the hell - but here's my take.

Yes, it is a drag if an announcement of a book, or some other vital topic, does get pushed to page 2 or 3 too quickly.  But good lord, how often does that happen?  And how hard is it to click to the 2nd page - especially when you don't like what you see on the first page?

I really find this to be much ado about nothing... it's a comedy, not a tragedy, my friend.

TH

ps - edit - as I post this, the Topic about Tony's book still appears higher than either of the main football-related topics... it's THIS THREAD that seems to be pushing Tony down too quickly...  

[George Pazin]

From discussions with Ran I would not go so far as to say he approves OT threads as much as he has stated his great displeasure from the IM's and emails of complaint he has to deal with from the whiners who contribute to those discussions!

And that's the saddest thing of all to me - I can't believe anyone would contact Ran with anything other than positive praise and thanks.

[Geoffrey Childs]

TH

Good try but NO its the emails and IM's from the whiners who complain when their off topic threads are deleted  

It's not a tragedy surely but you tell that to Tony when he checks out his book sales.  

[Tom Huckaby]

There are two other things one can and should contact Ran about, George:

1.  Reinstatement when someone goes into one's profile and deletes one as a user.  Hopefully you can sympathize; and

2. Giving him crap when you beat him in a match, or giving him crap about the insane number of strokes he demands, if you lose.

Right?

[Tom Huckaby]

Pulling a Mucci....

TH

Good try but NO its the emails and IM's from the whiners who complain when their off topic threads are deleted  

well if that's the case, then we know how the majority feels about this issue...


It's not a tragedy surely but you tell that to Tony when he checks out his book sales.  
if Tony's counting on this place - or anywhere else - to have him actually make any worthwhile money on his book, well... that's the greatest tragedy of all.  

[Joe Hancock]

It's not a tragedy surely but you tell that to Tony when he checks out his book sales.  

And if that is the purpose of posting about the book.....it is far worse than any OT thread ever started on GCA.com. I'm not saying it is, but you are alluding to the importance of it......

There is soooo much marketing on here, overt and covert. Now my suspicions have been raised to another level.

Joe

[ANTHONYPIOPPI]

Tom, Joe:

Both of you are out of the movie. Brad Pitt will play the part of Dr. Geoffrey Childs.

[Tom Huckaby]

Tom, Joe:

Both of you are out of the movie. Brad Pitt will play the part of Dr. Geoffrey Childs.

 

Well said.  And of course Mr. Pitt would do an excellent job... but to really capture Geoffrey, may I suggest Sir Anthony Hopkins?

[Tom Huckaby]

redanman - ahhhh.... it's not that you don't like OT posts, you just don't like football.... got it.  But I'm not only glad you're not a moderator, I am REALLY glad I don't live in a nation in which you make the rules.  I can only imagine the book-burning and idea quashing that would go on, not to mention the intolerance of religious differences.

 

[Geoffrey Childs]

It's not a tragedy surely but you tell that to Tony when he checks out his book sales.  

And if that is the purpose of posting about the book.....it is far worse than any OT thread ever started on GCA.com. I'm not saying it is, but you are alluding to the importance of it......

There is soooo much marketing on here, overt and covert. Now my suspicions have been raised to another level.

Joe

Joe

Read the thread on Tony's book and see if it is suspicious other then my last joking response. These 1500 members and unknown number of lurkers may likely represent a significant fraction of the population that are genuinely interested in a book like Tony's.  It would be a shame (though not a tragedy Huck) if some of them missed an opportunity to learn about the existence of the book AND an interesting discussion of some of the nine holers. If that gets them to purchase the book then all the better. How is that far worse then all the OT discussions.

TH - I like your suggestion - especially the SIR part.   Hopkins is FAR FAR better looking then that pansie Pitt guy anyway.

[Greg Tallman]

September through January...

Football 7 & 6.

[George Pazin]

There are two other things one can and should contact Ran about, George:

1.  Reinstatement when someone goes into one's profile and deletes one as a user.  Hopefully you can sympathize; and

2. Giving him crap when you beat him in a match, or giving him crap about the insane number of strokes he demands, if you lose.

Right?

Re: 1. Of course, anyone can and should contact the powers regarding administrative issues

Re: 2. I don't actually play golf, so I'm not familiar with the term match or demanding strokes.

[James Bennett]

... If you can get me on Club Z, I'll get you on Club Y ...

Can you tell me a little about these clubs, Z and Y?

Any chance we can have an outing there?  I'll even start rooting for the Dodgers ...

What about Club K?

[Tommy_Naccarato]

James,
Very perceptive! Also a very good question by Bend It Like Benham.

The X Club is solid golf architecture, no waterfalls. Only mounds and mounds of sandy glacial till which in the hands of famed Austrian-designer/Euro trash/Nietzsche-influenced poet, Dr. Fritz FazTameo has been masterfully crafted to recrete the pain and the poise of the Golden Age of Steam.

The hazards are brutal. So brutal that one finds himself trying to extricate himself from the inner-circle of fault. There is no Line of Charm which thousands can abuse, misuse and misunderstand. There is however a prescribed Line of Death which anyone who crosses over it, or at the very least remains stagnant on the other side of it are ritually disinegrated into a immoral mass of carbon and salt.

On the famed 14th of the X Club, there is no Elysian Fields. Instead there is the Killing Fields. Hell Bunker is actually a burning pit mixture of cow fat and whale blubber, so do your best to avoid it at all costs.

The X club is a Doak "0" which means to be avoided at all costs, mostly due to the threat of death or insanity.

[James Bennett]

Tommy

I think all access requests should be sent to the X Club.  It might be the last game of golf they ever play, probably losing 5/4 on the 'Killing' fields.

Is there a XXX club as well?

James B