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Glenn Spencer

Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« on: May 30, 2006, 09:57:05 AM »
I was wondering what are some of the big cities that have very few great or even good golf courses? What cities don't host major events? The reason that I bring it up is because Cincinnati is a big city and it only has Camargo and on a much lesser level- Coldstream CC. For its size, I am guessing that Cincinnati will be the winner or maybe San Diego- not sure. Albequerque maybe? Also, what city has never hosted anything important on the men's side in a long time? Cincinnati has never hosted anything important to my knowledge. Important- Men's Amateur, Senior Open or a  major? Are there any other big cities in this situation?
« Last Edit: May 30, 2006, 09:57:51 AM by Glenn Spencer »
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Tim Taylor

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2006, 11:13:20 AM »
Interesting question. I'll throw in with my city - Washington, D.C. There are several golden age courses - Congressional, Chevy Chase, Columbia, Washington G&CC, Burning Tree - but most have been heavily modified over the years. Granted, we have a regular TOUR event at a mediocre course (Avenel) and get a major once a decade or so. But for a metro area with this population we only have one course (Congressional Blue) on the Golf Digest list.

A little farther north and Baltimore CC and Bulle Rock get roped in by the GolfWeek lists.

TimT
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Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2006, 11:37:35 AM »
Tim,

WOW!! That is hard to believe about Washington. I would compare it to Cincinnati, except you guys are getting a tour event and majors, none for Cincinnati. Congressional is all that is considered good though by the raters, sounds like there are some nice courses though.
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Jim Sweeney

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2006, 11:41:18 AM »
Glen:

The Cincinnati CC and Kenwood have both hosted USGA championships, though some years ago I believe they were both Women's Opens.

I think you need to think a little more regionally, because I would bet actually very few national championships have been held with a major city's potitical boundary. Go out fifty miles from Cinci and you include NCR South and Shaker Run.
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Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2006, 11:49:42 AM »
Jim,

I think Kenwood hosted an amateur a long time ago also, very questionable on that or maybe it was the women I am thinking of. The Publinx does not count as major in this exercise, so Shaker Run is nothing. Are you really trying to give Cincinnati any credit for NCR, c'mon, that is not even reasonable. That is what the question is about, Dayton has 3 PGAs, a Women's Open, a Western Open, a Senior Open and Cincinnati has nothing besides a Womens Open in 1963? I am talking, when you think of a city and its suburbs, not at City Hall.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2006, 03:58:54 PM by Glenn Spencer »
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George Pazin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2006, 12:27:39 PM »
Houston is pretty huge and I don't think it has had any majors. Aren't most of the well known Texas tracks in the Dallas area?

Glenn, I dare you to say Chicago. :)
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Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2006, 12:30:37 PM »
George,

That is a good one there, Houston. 69 US Open. You are right though, nothing to write home about as far as great courses. This would have to be the winning answer wouldn't it? Yes, George, you are correct, Chicago really doesn't have anything that I would want to play. Not much there at all. San Antonio doesn't have a whole lot going on either, in fact Texas as a whole, falls way short in this department.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2006, 12:32:09 PM by Glenn Spencer »
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Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2006, 02:21:48 PM »
Jim Sweeney,

Kenwood CC, 1933 US Amateur. Does this change anything. I don't see how the West Coast has a right to complain. Texas never hosts anything it seems, recently anyway. Is the 93 Amateur the last national mens championship there. That is hard to believe, I don't think that there is much coming either.
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John Goodman

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2006, 03:24:06 PM »
Glenn - wouldn't you think the bottom five are something like, Houston, Phoenix, Tampa/St. Pete, Miami, Seattle?
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Mike Hendren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2006, 03:25:45 PM »
I must confess we're a little light here in the Music City.

Mike
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Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2006, 03:29:41 PM »
John,

I don't think that I would argue those. I would probably take Seattle Golf Club and Sahalee over Camargo and Coldstream from Cincinnati. San Antonio does not have a lot going on. How close is Indian Creek to Miami? I think I might take Indian Creek and Doral over Camargo and Coldstream. The only thing about your list as far as tournaments is that the weather would be a factor. If it is just great courses, I really can't think of any better examples than what you gave.
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Jordan Wall

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2006, 03:33:05 PM »
Quote from: John Goodman on May 30, 2006, 03:24:06 PM
Glenn - wouldn't you think the bottom five are something like, Houston, Phoenix, Tampa/St. Pete, Miami, Seattle?[/color]

Unfortunately, yes.
 :'(
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Kyle Harris

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #12 on: May 30, 2006, 03:37:30 PM »
John,

Tampa isn't horrible. There is a Ross gem at Sara Bay about an hour south in Sarasota and Mountain Lake (Raynor) is in Lake Wales about an hour east. Tampa itself has a few hidden gems and Brooksville is about 45 minutes north.
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Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #13 on: May 30, 2006, 03:40:53 PM »
Kyle,

Does Old Memorial help Tampa's case at all? I think I am going with Bogey, Nashville is pretty big and hurting for courses.
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John Goodman

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #14 on: May 30, 2006, 03:43:09 PM »
Glenn -

I was going by largest MSAs in terms of population, compared with "great" courses in/near those cities.  Houston is I believe 7, Phoenix 12, Seattle 19, Tampa 20 and Miami 23.

Kyle -

OK - but still pretty slim pickins for a city that size, seems to me.
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mike_malone

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2006, 03:52:13 PM »
 UNBELIEVABLE  !!  Philadelphia is not on  a negative list ;D !!
« Last Edit: May 30, 2006, 03:55:59 PM by mayday_malone »
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AKA Mayday

Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2006, 03:57:47 PM »
John,

You sold me is it Phoenix then. It will never host a major I am guessing and it doesn't have any courses that come to mind. Houston at least has a few decent courses and has hosted a major. I would think Phoenix, what is even good there? Cincinnati is King of the Midwest though. Perfect location and weather, Indy, Dayton, Columbus, Lex, Louisville all close by and it hosts absolutely nothing. It really is hard to imagine. The more I think about it, the more I can't get over it.
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John Goodman

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2006, 03:58:04 PM »
Quote from: Glenn Spencer on May 30, 2006, 03:40:53 PM
Kyle,

Does Old Memorial help Tampa's case at all? I think I am going with Bogey, Nashville is pretty big and hurting for courses.

Hard to go with Nashville; I'm not sure that it is even #1 on this list in the state of Tennessee.  Memphis is about the same size (#55 to #49).  Doesn't Nashville and environs have better golf than Memphis, Bogey?  Surely it can't be much different - or am I forgetting something?

Also, before you even get to Nashville in terms of size you pass the five I mentioned, plus Cincy, Orlando and Indianapolis.

Houston seems to me way out in front.  Or maybe Phoenix.
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John Kavanaugh

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2006, 04:00:29 PM »
Don't even think of including Indianapolis....It could be the best city in the country for cost vs class ratio...
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Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2006, 04:03:22 PM »
John,

 INDY???? I think it has a lot of great clubs and Crooked Stick is constantly hosting something. Wolf Run, CC of Indianapolis, Meridian Hills. I would trade for lowly Cincinnati any time. If you take Camargo from us, and no plays that anyway, this is really a pathetic golf town, especially for Ohio.
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John Goodman

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #20 on: May 30, 2006, 04:04:59 PM »
John - it's been a month since you posted on here - somebody's gotta throw a tomato can at Indy to get your attention?
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Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #21 on: May 30, 2006, 04:05:47 PM »
Orlando? Yes, there is nothing to write home about. But, at least Bay Hill has something going on. There is a lot of golf there as well. Good City for this, but I think I will take Orlando over Cincinnati.
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John Goodman

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2006, 04:09:27 PM »
Glenn - sight unseen, would you trade Cincinnati for Birmingham AL?
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JLahrman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #23 on: May 30, 2006, 04:16:31 PM »
Quote from: Glenn Spencer on May 30, 2006, 04:03:22 PM
John,

 INDY???? I think it has a lot of great clubs and Crooked Stick is constantly hosting something. Wolf Run, CC of Indianapolis, Meridian Hills. I would trade for lowly Cincinnati any time. If you take Camargo from us, and no plays that anyway, this is really a pathetic golf town, especially for Ohio.

Glenn, there are not a lot of truly notable courses in the area, but as a Cincinnati public golfer I find that there are quite a few public courses that I can walk for $25, are challenging, aren't lined with condos, and which aren't that hard to secure a tee time.

True there are not really any major caliber courses around here and the Tour isn't going to be visiting any time soon, but there are a lot of decent places to play.  Depends what you're looking for.  Columbus has some great courses, but when I lived there I found the public course options to be very poor, especially within 270.  Champions was the best option, and I was almost willing to boycott that course because of the 8th hole.  True you can drive way outside of the city and play a Cooks Creek or Darby Creek, but those are the CCFADs that I don't care for.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2006, 04:17:18 PM by JAL »
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Glenn Spencer

Re:Not exactly Columbus, Ohio
« Reply #24 on: May 30, 2006, 04:24:01 PM »
John,

Without a question. CC of Birmingham. Shoal. Mountain Brook. Old Overton and Greystone. That is a great old golf town. What is the with the sight unseen part? I don't follow. Throw in Southern Belles and I would trade just about anything for Birmingham. ;D
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