[Mark_Fine]

One of the courses I played this week was North Berwick West Links.  When you buy your green fee you get "Visiting Golfers Insurance" included.  You get a small certificate of coverage and a helpline number to call for claims!  

[Gary Daughters]

Interesting story:

Last year I played a dogleg right par-4 where the drive had to carry a vast acreage of fairly tall reeds.  From the tee, the green was clearly visible way off to the right, but in terms of landing area, all I could see above the reeds was a thin ribbon of grass defining the farthest end of the fairway/landing area.

It was one of those holes where you stand at the tee and go "What the..."  Which is something I like.  It also was fun to find that little white thing, Easter egg like, when I made it around to the landing area.

But here's the interesting part.  

When I spoke with the architect later I complimented the way he had laid out that hole in particular. As it turns out, it was done out of necessity.  It was discovered during construction that the property had been a Native American village.  Apparently that occurs quite often, but in this case the village was so extensive, and the inherent delays so numerous that the project was nearly scuttled.

Fortunately, the architect in question is a wonderful guy and was so committed to getting the course done that he hung in there.

But back to that one particular hole.  Beneath those acres of reeds lay not just part of the village... but a burial ground!

[BCrosby]

Peter -

Agreed. There oughtn't be any pre-existing notions of what design to apply to a given piece of property. Don't force a blind shot here one doesn't exist.

It's one of the reasons I am a MacD/Raynor skeptic. Template holes strike me as a bad way to write an design operating manual. Some of their templates are terrific, some are of dubious architectural interest, but all of them have the problem of being imposed on a given piece of property with every course sold. That's a lot of externalities that need to be internalized in a piece of land. MacD and Raynor pull it off often, but not always. I wonder how good their stuff might have been if they had wandered off the reservation now and then. (It might have been better than what we got.) At any rate, it strikes me that to pre-conceive design concepts is to ask for trouble.

On the other hand, where the land offers up interesting blind shots, I wish more modern archies used it. Too many seem to run from it. Those are missed opportunities, I think. In the long run, they are probably also bad for the game.

Bob  

[Gary Daughters]

Bob,

Glad to see you use the word "imposed" regarding Raynor/McDonald.  I got my head handed to me recently for using that term.

[Mike_Sweeney]

Recent article from Mark Fine!

http://www.watervilleresearch.com/images/blindgolf.pdf

[Jim_Kennedy]

Bob, or Gary,

I've only played or wandered around a half dozen CBM/SR/CB
courses, but I wouldn't use 'impose'  when describing their work.
Yes, they adapted certain concepts and pushed around some fill to construct their greensites but, have you ever felt that one of their holes is 'out of place' or doesn't fit the given terrain when playing (or roaming around) any of their courses?

'Imposing' can be seen on a course near here where it was neccessary (?) to build some fairways up so high you are actually looking into the crowns of 70 year old maple trees, and they run like this for hundreds of yards.

Disclaimer: You may have noticed my 'signature' at the bottom of this post. Come up/over/down anytime, play a round, and if you feel these nine holes are 'imposed' upon the property there will be no charge. If not, it'll be $13.00 @  

[Mark_Fine]

Mike,
Thanks for posting that column.  Maybe it will help some golfers to think a little differently about these kinds of things like "blindness".
Mark

[David_Madison]

A varient of the blind tee shot is one where just a part of the fairway is visible, but another portion, usually the most desirable from which to approach the green is obstructed from view. The first tee on the newer Forest Creek course is designed that way. Definitely adds interest and excitement right from the start of the round, and does so without the legal liability of a purely blind shot.

[Bob Jenkins]

I agree with a lot of the comments above but also:
   
1)  The "what you see is what you get" theory, ie. that hidden landing areas leave you guessing, that you should be able to see the challenge in front of you, not guess at it.

2)  Periscopes needed for you to determine if the group in front have cleared the landing area are very out of place.

3)  I agree with the liability concern. It must be much more common that groups are targets in hidden landing areas, it almost invites a claim against the club.

Hidden greens are something else. The Himilayas and the Alps at Prestwick still blow me away.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Bob,

I think you and others are laboring under a false impression.

The golfers ahead of you are clearly visible, hence liability issues parallel those of a "normal" hole.

The only thing not visible is the ground at the DZ, which is obscured by low features such as grass, mounds, bunkers and the rising or falling terrain.

[TEPaul]

I always post this on threads about blindness.

In the old days (as we can clearly see on many of the old golf courses) blindness was once a "prized" commodity in golf.

And then, very ironically, it went the other way and became a hated aspect of architecture and virtually taboo to do.

Where Nature produced blindness on the land architects and golfers of yore simply accepted it as part of the natural aspects of golf and dealt with it. Blindness was actually supposed to put added pressure on a golfer's ability to trust his swing and his inclinations---and that was precisely why it was once considered "prized".

On the subject of blindness you can't do much better than Max Behr's article entitled "Blindness".

[Patrick_Mucci]

TEPaul,

In this case I think nature presented the "opportunity" for blindness or semi-blindness and the hand of man took advantage of that opportunity and created an additional, interesting challenge for the golfer.

[TEPaul]

TEPaul,
In this case I think nature presented the "opportunity" for blindness or semi-blindness and the hand of man took advantage of that opportunity and created an additional, interesting challenge for the golfer."

Patrick:

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by that.

[JESII]

Tom,

I've always thought Merion did a tremendous job in keeping the player off-balance by just hiding the landing area from the players eye. In other wrods, you can see a player standing in the landing area (or DZ as Pat calls it) but you cannot see the actual ground to be 100% certain where the fairway/rough line is. I think this is what Pat means as opposed to pure blindness such as hitting over a hill or dune of some kind. #'s 4, 7, 8, 16 at Merion are semi-blind while #'s 11 and 18 are blind. That is, except from the back tee on 18 because we can all see our balls land in the face of the quarry there so it's not so difficult.

[Jason Mandel]

Jim,

Could Radley Run have had any more blind tee shots today That 18th hole is really something.  

Looks like your dad and you played ok, we played ok also(minus are miscues on 7,8,9).  but it was a fun day.

jason

[Patrick_Mucci]

JES II,

You're correct.

TEPaul,

It's unfortunate that you didn't play at GCGC with us.

A perfect example is the drive on the 7th hole.

Two features obscure the fairway and its boundaries, but not the golfers on the hole.

Tall grass and a low crossing berm.

Golfers on the tee just see a vast expanse of grass, golfers and two flags in the distance, the 10th hole flag, which is one color, and the 7th hole flag, which is another color.

They can't see the fairway/rough boundaries.
They can't see the contoured or angled fairway lines.

Golfers familiar with the hole tell members of their foursome unfamiliar with the hole to aim at the ball washer on # 8 or the yellowish house vaguely visible through the foilage in the distance.

On # 4, one of your most unfavorite features exists, a checkered flag in the fairway warning of a deep fairway bunker on the left.  On that hole, the tall grass combined with a fairway that begins sloping down, away from the golfer hides the DZ to short and long hitters alike.

On the 4th tee, again, a sea of grass is all the golfer sees.
He can see golfers in the fairway, and, the tall smoke stack in the distance, which is a great aiming mark for those familiar with the hole.

With wide fairways, this feature still creates a sense of uncertainty in the golfers mind.

[JESII]

Jason,

I don't think there were any more than 10 or 11 blind tee shots, is that a problem?

We did play OK, a couple of miscues ourselves, but that is bound to happen. Strange course, no question about it. 9 and 18 are definately awkward. Where do you hit it on either hole?

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