Ban rakes in bunkers for the good of the game

[paul cowley]

...banning rakes from all bunkers would really add such a needed dimension to the game that is overcome with high standards of maintenance and fairness.....and the the sand wedge would be of increased value....I'm beginning to feel like we are playing a game fit for velvet and thongs.

[Paul Payne]

Velvet and thongs!?!?!

You make me blush.

[Sean Leary]

I disagree.  The game doesn't need to be made any harder for the average player.

[Tom_Doak]

Paul:

I did an article for GOLF Magazine on that subject a few years back.  There weren't many takers.

The most interesting discussion I had was with David Eger, who at that time was setting up courses for the Tour [and said he spent more of his attention on perfect bunker conditions than anything else], at the same time he was winning Crump Cups at Pine Valley, sans rakes.  Eger said he couldn't imagine that TV viewers really wanted to see pros in greenside bunkers hitting back out to the fairway, as he sometimes did at PVGC.  He said the greens were so fast on Tour that it would be impossible to hold them out of a bad lie in a greenside bunker ... so one improvement in conditions necessitates another!

PS  I think I know where Scott's picture in the other thread was taken, and if I'm correct, thanks for the compliment.  

[Ryan Crago]

is it really the "raking" that is making bunkers/hazards play easy(ier)??

i think you'd find that the average player still has considerable difficulty playing out of a bunker with a good lie... and not only that, but a lot of public players don't bother to rake, or rake well!!  many bunkers are a crapshoot even with rakes... which really, is how it should be.

i think you'd accomplish the goal by loosening the maintenance on bunkers.  increasing the time between maintenance staff spinning/raking... obviously to a point, so that the structural integrity of the bunker isn't lost.  

[paul cowley]

TomD...something tells me you could sit in an empty stadium and enjoy the scene.....I know I can .

[Paul Payne]

Tom,

You bring up a point that I've heard before and it always bugs me. Especially in regard to bunkers.

Do you really believe that TV viewers would cringe at the sight of a player having simply hit back into the fairway rather than go for the green? I'm not so sure. I have no data to suppot this point, but I would think the ones who would not like to see that are; the players themselves (how humiliating); the commentators (how would Johnny talk about that?); and the advertisers (I thought you said these were pros!)

I really think that with all of their natural advantages over the rest of us, a little dose of reality is not only refreshing but brings their game back a little closer to ours.

I say.... let 'em punt once in a while.

[wsmorrison]

I think that is a great idea, Paul.  Let me sell my stock in Acme Rake Company first, alright?

I play the game wearing velvet thongs, is that what you mean  

[Garland Bayley]

Paul,

I'm with you. Let the pros have a little of my reality.

[paul cowley]

I am with you Paul P...and anyone else who is named Paul or Wayne or Garland........

[Ryan Farrow]

Why don't we just replace those cheap plastic rakes with these?






Was the Furrow rake even successful?

[paul cowley]

...or with anyone named Ryan.

[Yannick Pilon]

I'm with you guys on this one!

Who cares if you are not able to reach a green in regulation from a bunker?  You're just not supposed to be in it!  If you can reach the green in regulation, just thank god, and go on to read your putt!

Something's wrong when most of some maintenance budgets goes on maintaining bunkers!  

I was told or read somewhere this week, that bunkers are the surfaces that are the most expensive to maintain on a golf course, when you compare the prices on a per square feet basis....

I can't tell if this is true or not, but it all sounds pretty sad to me.

There sure is some educating to do!  It's tough, but worth it, if you ask me!  I am slowly working on this....

[Scott Coan]

Yannick,

Do you rake bunkers now after you've dig your feet in and hit your shot?  Why?

[Phil_the_Author]

All of the above are good points except if you are in the second group in a tournament and a player in the group ahead of you plays out of a bunker and leaves a footprint nearly an inch or more in depth that you have the fortune of hitting into next.

Golf is a game of equal fairness as that is behind the reasoning of the rules. Why should one player be allowed to play from clean sand while another isn't? Or should we no longer allow fixing divots on greens. Meanwhile, why not champion the repairing of spike marks using raking bunkers as the deciding principal?

[Ian Andrew]

As Tim Morghan said to the members of the ASGCA at a meeting "if we ignored the top 1% of all players we would all be better off"

[Paul Payne]

Philip,

I consider it fair for everyone if a bunker is never tended. The first player hits footprints left from the day before etc. Nature will keep changing it every day.  

I also DO believe in repairing divots on fairways and greens. Since they are not considered hazards that is just good groundskeeping and common courtesy.

Ryan,

NICE RAKE!

[Ryan Farrow]

Paul, thank the USGA archive for that picture.

Keep up with fixing your ball marks on the green but unless you take a 3 foot long fairway divot you mines well just leave it for the mowers to pick up. When filling in fairway divots in the heart of summer the last thing I want to do is pick up the 100's of dead replacement divots.

[Yannick Pilon]

Scott,

Yes, I do rake the bunkers when I go in them because it is standard practice and I beleive in good playing etiquette.  And I will continue to do so until I can get clubs to change that practice....

That being said.  I would be perfectly happy if the playing etiquette would just require me to "rake" the bunkers with my feet as I get out of them.  It would not do a perfect job, but it would be good enough for me.

As long as you don't leave holes that are three to four inches deep, you shouldn't get lies that would be "unplayable" too often.  And you know what? So what if you did?  God knows, people do it already with rakes lying around everywhere....

Just stay out of bunkers if you don't want trouble.  Bunkers are obstacles and should provide a penalty if you get in them.

[Paul Payne]

Yannick,

I humbly admit that I too rake my bunkers but I do so grudgingly. The day that the golfing world agrees this is frivolous behavior is the day I will quit.

Ryan,

Is it true that replaced divots die? I had always thought if you had one the size of (hmmm...) a standard letter envelope, that you were supposed to replace it and it would survive. Is this just a golfers urban legend?

[Doug Siebert]

I think a better solution is to use a much softer sand that makes the ball much more likely to bury.  This penalizes good players more, since they are more likely to go into bunkers on the fly and more likely be hitting shots with a high trajectory.  The worse the player the more likely his ball is running into the bunker, or if it is landing there it is on a much shallower trajectory and is thus less likely to bury.

Thus the good players get more challenge (and fear) from bunkers, whether in greenside or fairway (thanks to the modern driver/ball combination producing high trajectory tee shots that would allow even a 300 yard drive to bury -- I've actually hit a couple drives that have buried in the last couple years!!)  The poorer players don't see much change from how things are today, and still enjoy the 'benefits' of a well raked bunker.

Sounds like a plan to me, what do you guys think?

[Troy Alderson]

If we are to stop raking bunkers, we should maintain dry sand as much as possible.  Good drainage is a plus.  Sand that is wet and not maintained may be the worst hazard existing and completely unplayable to all golfers.  At my golf course, we hardly maintain bunkers by default of a low budget.  But, the bunkers do not drain well and can even form a crust on top.  I also think that the maintenance staff should mechanically rake the bunkers occassionally in order to keep mother nature at bay somewhat.

Troy

[Ryan Farrow]

Yannick,

I humbly admit that I too rake my bunkers but I do so grudgingly. The day that the golfing world agrees this is frivolous behavior is the day I will quit.

Ryan,

Is it true that replaced divots die? I had always thought if you had one the size of (hmmm...) a standard letter envelope, that you were supposed to replace it and it would survive. Is this just a golfers urban legend?

Paul, an envelope size is a fairly large divot.I would say they have a better chance to survive if the divot is pretty thick. The edges will still brown out and die but the middle of it should recover.

[tonyt]

I disagree.  The game doesn't need to be made any harder for the average player.

Not jumping on the "no rakes", because we've done this to death, but I strongly disagree with this comment. It is rakes in bunkers and sand wedge development that have seen over the years bunkers replaced by water and the like. Bunkers used to be the penalising feature. Now we have more severe elements that both achieve this and more, AND don't return your ball.

My disagreement is that if the bunkers are harder, the other brutal features are less necessary and less prevalent.

[Kevin Pallier]

I for one would love to go back to the old principle of "play it as it lies" and that would obviously extend to bunkers.