[Sean_A]

In an effort to save money our club is toying with the idea of staff raking bunkers only once a week come rain or shine.  Leaving the job of keeping bunkers tidy up to the members.  If they are a mess, well look in the mirror.  Some are even advocating no raking during play.  Their reasoning is that bunkers are meant to be nasty and it would speed up play.  I spose some time could be shaved off a game if this were done, but not much.  Though I tend to think things would balance out because people would take more goes to get out of bunkers.  The other reason is the one which intrigues me.  I know there has been talk of it on this site.  I am not sure how I feel about it.  

I used to think leave the bunkers be. What happens is life.  After playing Conwy this past week I am not so sure.  Wet, packed bunkers with footprints and "divots" torn out of the sand made recovery for par very difficult.  I was caught in one wet, hard bunker where my ball was sitting in an old explosion patch.  My first thought was to take a penalty drop and still give myself a chance for a point with an up and down.  I tried playing the shot, but unsuccessfully.  If I am honest, I was a bit peeved because I didn't think trying to hit a ball from this position was fun.  Perhaps life has gotten too cushy for me.  I spose beginers face these type of shots (for them given relative skill) all the time.  We just say buck up.  

Is this what would start happening if bunkers were not maintained like we are used to?  Would players just pick their ball up and drop?  Would there be a new club developed to deal with these nasty bunkers?  Is it feasible that some courses should go no rake while others rake?  What do you all think?

PS How much money can be saved by raking 50 bunkers (which must be done by hand) once a week compared to 3 times a week on a 52 week schedule?

Ciao

Sean

[James Bennett]

Sean

our club will rake once a week, and less frequently if rain is forecast.  This works OK, unless you have a trade day in one of the weeks.  As poorly as the members rake the bunkers, trade days are worse.

If I was trying to lift the perceived quality of the course, I would rake the bunkers on a regular weekly (minimum) basis, and after major visitor/trade day events. I would also be careful with the rakes supplied to the members - no rakes could probably be better than toothed rakes.  A foot scrape is adequate for so many bunker shots, but members like to dig deep and reaerate the bunker with the teeth of the bunker rake, even where there is minimal damage to repair.

I like the unkept bunker look, but it is a very mature membership that will accept it.

James B

[ForkaB]

PS How much money can be saved by raking 50 bunkers (which must be done by hand) once a week compared to 3 times a week on a 52 week schedule?

I'd like to know this, too, Sean!

At an AGM at my local club, the Captain Presumptive of the time proposed to eliminate about 10 bunkers on the course, and justified it by saying that it would save ~£15K/year, due to less raking required.  Now, given that our club had about 60 bunkers at that time, and the annual total wages of the green staff was about £100k, I was about to pipe up and recommend that we eliminate all of the bunkers, which would cut our green staff wages to £10K.  However, as I knew that the CP was going down shortly in a palace coup, I kept my mouth shut, out of courtesy........

[ForkaB]

Sean

Yes.  He was the Vice-Captain, and this proposal was put forward at the AGM at which he (thought he) was going to be annointed as Captain. However, in the Night of the Long Knives, both he and the Secretary were sacked, and the first woman ever in the UK chosen to become so, became our new Captain.

[TEPaul]

If I looked around in my files I probably could quantify the cost savings by raking bunkers less often per week. We did that last year. The effect on play seemed minimal to non-existant to me. We also dropped sand-proing and went to hand raking only and the cost was a wash.

On your point, Sean, it's a whole lot easier to talk the talk about unmaintained bunkers than it is to deal with unmaintained bunkers when your ball regularly sits in huge footprints and such. If you can't handle it well enough don't expect any of your members to.  

If any golf club anywhere really wants to go down this route of not raking the sand in their bunkers I suggest the thing that must be done to prevent a complete revolution and rabid criticism is to display very prominently a sign in the club for all to see that says;

"We do not rake our bunkers on purpose! If you have a problem with that our suggestion is to do the very best you can to avoid going in one."

The only way to forestall real criticism is to make the unmaintained condition of your bunkering KNOWN to every golfer BEFORE he puts his ball on the tee on the first hole.

[cary lichtenstein]

I think part of the part lies with the soft white sand fetish so many clubs have.

 Give us some ugly rock hard sand, a 60 wedge with a sharp cutting edge, unkept raggy edges and 6 inch narly grass around the edges,  and maybe the game would be more fun and hazards would be harzards.

[Stuart Hallett]

Quote from Sean Arble  Posted on: Today at 04:56:04am

 After playing Conwy this past week I am not so sure.  Wet, packed bunkers with footprints and "divots" torn out of the sand made recovery for par very difficult.  I was caught in one wet, hard bunker where my ball was sitting in an old explosion patch.Quoted text

When was the sand last changed ?
Sounds like polluted sand, insufficient drainage, or both.

At my club, we faced a similar dilemma, where heavily polluted sand became too compact after rain and a hard crust in the summer heat. We have always raked once a week on a Friday and decided in favour of a renovation project rather than extra labour for temporary improvement. Last autumn we completed the 56 greenside bunkers, drainage where needed, new sand, and the correction of obvious discrepancies of shape and size.

We selected 3 sands for analysis and considering the once a week raking, the new sand has minimal crusting potential, resists ball plugging, and holds reasonably well on the sand flashed faces.

I have facts and figures of the initial study and actual works. If you are interested, send an IM.

Raking 3 times a week would certainly take something away from our principal activity, presenting good greens. We prefer to put up with some moans and groans about infrequent raking, and have good greens.

[TEPaul]

Sean:

I very much doubt golfers taking penalty drops out of lies in bunkers would ever become a problem or even remotely prevalent.

The reason I say that is what I know from the years I played golf at PVGC before their bunkers had their sand regularly maintained.

The way the bunkering and the sand was at PVGC was as unmaintained and rugged and potentially penal due both to lie and the architecture of some of those bunkers as I've ever seen anywhere and the fact is that most all golfers, no matter their level of play found some way to hit their shots out of bunkers even if it was sideways or backwards or even a few feet out somehow.

This is the reality because I saw it for years. This is what everyone knew before they went out to play there. It was completely expected and everyone accepted it. I never heard anyone complain---it was just the way it was and always had been----and that is my point here.

And don't forget, all that time, and during all those years Pine Valley was ranked the #1 golf course in the world.

[jeffwarne]

the entire problem with bunkers and bunker maintenance on the typical,modern American course is there are generally way too many highly maintained bunkers in an area where one with more severity and randomness would do nicely.

 Less acreage used  is less to maintain, particularly if raked less frequently-plus a smaller bunkered area (as opposed to a complex of 3-6 bunkers on on  side ) leaves more room to execute the shot to the presumably preferred angle into the green. (assuming the bunker was placed strategically in the first place)
 Players get the idea of challenging the bunker and the improved angle without a half acre of maintained sand-which doesn't scare the better player anyway-and is murder on the cart ball hack. The smaller, meaner,randomly maintained bunker catches less balls and scares more good players- a double bonus.

Although I know this could be the death knell of the 30 man maintenance crew.

[Jon Wiggett]

Originally sand hazards were not regularly raked. I could imagine that this would be an easy, low cost way of making courses harder for the PGA tour. They could also think about setting a maximum width for the sole of a club, say 1/4 inch.

[Doug Siebert]

Sean,

I can tell you exactly what would happen if your club went no rake.  Those members not in favor of it, and many guests and visitors, would think it is a terrible idea and very unfair, and would be very loud and annoying about it.  Those members in favor of it would grow tired of defending it and not wish to discuss it anymore.  You'd save some money, I'm not qualified to say how much.

But one thing everyone would have in common would be that they would be far more careful about hitting into bunkers to the point that it would alter their strategy on some shots.  On most courses, players treating the bunkers with more respect only enhances the strategy and challenge, and brings more of the "unrealistic" options (i.e., layups, playing away from the pin or even the green, etc.) into consideration for better players.  That sounds like a pretty good argument in favor of dealing with all the whiners, at least for a season to see how it works out.

[Tommy Williamsen]

Maybe the club could designate the bunkers as waste areas.   They are normally raked infrequently but the player is allowed to ground the club or even take a practice swing.  It doesn't solve the problem of old explosion areas or footprints but it does allow you to test the sand.

[A_Clay_Man]

bump for Scott Coan

[Patrick_Mucci]

Sean,

Read Robert Randquist's white paper on bunkers.

I believe that Ran published it.

[Mark_Fine]

Tom Paul,
Forrest and I interviewed numerous Superinentent's around the country about their hazard maintenance budgets and the differences between hand raking and using ride-ons or mechanical bunker rakes.  It is a fairly detailed section and we've gotten lots of nice compliments about it.  

Maybe you should finally breakdown and get a copy of our book.  I know it is expensive but you can afford it (if not borrow Pat Mucci's copy)  

[Jim Thompson]

A better contemplation may be to consider maintaining greenside bunkers once or twice a week and fairway bunkers  needed.

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