Billy Bell research

[Troy Alderson]

Tom,

Gene "Bunny" Mason is a Head Golf Professional from Black Butte Ranch in Sisters, OR.  He was there back in the early 1970s at least.  I do not know what he is currently doing for work.  His last job that I know of is Roseburg CC redesign of 4 holes which he did an overall good job of.  The superintendent there did say that Bunny has some pretty off the wall ideas though.  I do not know what they are.

Troy

[Jim Nugent]

Me, As we posted here earlier this year or late last, I would rather place my head on a Funicular track and push the button then play there. Forrest has offered to push the button for me!

Weren't the City of Industry courses Bob May's home courses?  Also, which hole is number nine on the Babe?  

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Troy,
Bunny is the Forrest Richardson of the Oregon Territory. Both of them are older then Louis & Clark combined....

Jim "Ted" Nugent,
Bobby May played at a lot of places around here. Practiced at the infamous Big Tee a lot as well. I used to see him there all the time and even played once with him and former Am Champ, Eric Meeks once at Friendly Hills once, many eons ago. I can't remember, but Patrick Burke may have been in that foursome as well. (Patrick maybe reading this as well, as I know he surfs GCA sometimes.)

I'm sure he played a lot of his high school matches at Industry Hills given that he lived in La Habra Heights. I also know he was given access to play and practice at Yorba Linda CC.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Jim, also, regarding the 9th.....

The hole is like an after-thought. It simply is a disaster of a golf hole from the tee, further worsened by the loss of the upper green which used to make the hole somewhat more interesting, although most who played there would always come up way short of it, roll back down the hill and be faced with another shot at it, only from the lower alternate green. (sounds like this has happened to me lots of times doesn't it?!?! Well it has, as well as everyone else that has played there!)

You can't see where the upper green was at anymore, as they have planted lots of trees there and its grown quite fervently. But the upper green was the better of the two in terms of interest on the second shot. Both greens were dead flat.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

[rjsimper]

Didn't know there was ever an upper green there...but the hole in it's current form is an abomination.

Not to mention trying to walk the course and walking 150 yards downhill and back to the tee, playing a 300 yard hole, and then walking 150 yards back uphill to the 10th tee and halfway house.

(at least the 10th is an okay hole...giving you a break before the ridiculous 11th)

[Joe Perches]

The hole is like an after-thought.

It is all too familiar and similar to holes on "De Bell" in Burbank, as well as the short 9 holer Roosevelt in Griffith Park.  Don't know if I would call them after thoughts so much as under thoughts.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Ryan,
I'm not even sure why they even got rid of the upper green, as I had said, and in my opinion it was a much better greensite, making the hole a lot more quirky, but it also made it even more tough. because of the length of the second shot. Unless you really wanted to try a running cut, driver around the side of a hill and have a better shot at it--but wait! You can't do that on the hole simply because of the ridiculous tree planting that blocks any shot like that out from acheiving that difficult shot. What you ended up with is both low and high handicappers having to play one dead-on-balls-accurate shot straight out to the center landing area everytime. You then had to carry the hill for the upper green which was like a 175+ yard shot uphill.

I seem to remember that if the green was down below, I was pissed-off it wasn't up on top and if it was up on top, I was pissed-off that it wasn't down below because I would be lying 4 somewhere near the cart path after pushing the approach out of bounds.

Yes, I guess I'm hard to please!

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Joe,
First off, Merry Xmas!

Both Dumbell and Teddy R. are William Johnson designed courses. He was an associate of Billy Bell Sr. as well as the superintendent of Royal Palms, Griffith Park and later would serve as the head of the City of LA Parks & Recreation.

Roosevelt, as I have said before is quite a fun course to play, and I'm also pretty much convinced that it was also quite strategic for as short of a course that it really is. DeBell isn't much different, your right there! Perfecting that 5 wood off of the tee is a must, but the thing about DeBell is that the stuff on and around the greens is unique. Something was/is going on there. In truth, I have never had a bad time playing Dumbell. At least not as much as I have walking Griffith Park with tears coming down eyes seeing just how good of a golf course it was at one time.

[peter_p]

Tony,
  I played Kahneeta about ten years ago. Only considering the course, remodel rather than renovate is the way to go. This all depends on what happens to Kahneeta if the tribe gets the go-ahead on the casino in the gorge. What is that going to do to the Kahneeta operation? You may be wasting money. Is the course going to remain a draw?
  The only two features I remember on the course are the extremely narrow green on one nine, and the dogleg across the river on the other side.

[Joe Perches]

First off, Merry Xmas!

And of course to you.  I'm looking forward to June and the Coachella KP too.

Both Dumbell and Teddy R. are William Johnson designed courses.

I thought that DeBell was a joint Bell/Johnson design.  Roosevelt I had no idea but the time frame was more or less right and it does look/feel similar.

Griffith Park with tears

I don't see City of LA doing a significant renovation to Griffith Park.  But with Ventura redoing San Buenaventura and now Olivas Park, and San Francisco redoing Harding Park, maybe there could be an opportunity.  Who would you suggest be lead architect on a renovation?  Which course would you work on first and why?  There are still some very interesting holes on the LA's Harding course.  I haven't played Wilson since the 70's and my memory doesn't recall anything outstanding there.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Joe,
My mistake, it was in fact Billy Bell Jr. AND William Johnson that did DeBell. (Johnson oversaw construction)

I do have my favorites for a GP restoration/remodel, unfortunately, I don't ever seeing it ever get done. The City of Los Angeles has such a magnificent track record of tripping over itself, doing so many times throughout its cityhood, I don't doubt for one minute that this would meet some heavy opposition. which would kill it before it even got started.

Point of example:

Look how bad we tripped over ourselves in the 1960's when Alweg Monorail wanted to give the city a complete monorail system for $1.00. The only thing Alweg wanted out of the deal was like 7 years to pay the equipment off, which would have required getting the people interested in riding a monorail to and from and in Downtown Los Angeles, and at that time it was a city that was feeling the need and desperately missing the Red Car that once took Southern Californians everywhere around the Southland.

When the City council vetoed all of it in a City Council meeting, the famed SciFi author Ray Bradbury, who was in attendance, supposedly scoffed so loud that he was quieted by the head councilman. He was eventually removed from the room when he abruptly started laughing during the rest of the preceedings.

My own attempts at trying to get some interest going where with famed LA Attorney, Neil Papilliano, who happens to be a family friend of my best friend. Mr. Papilliano is more or less known for a lot of LA City phalanthropic activites, (I'm sure David M. will comment on this!) and when discussing Griffith Park with him at one of the family functions he told me that it would probably be an utter waste of time.