Which Would You Rather

[Paul_Turner]

John

You might be right, I remember reading about the greens.  Kawana's are certainly still japanese bermuda (k...?).  I still reckon it was more about accessability.


Has anyone played all of Tom's 31?  I'm about half way.  The NAFFER is in the low 20s by my reckoning (22, eh NAF?).  Ran must be close to the 31.

Continental Europe is the obvious area not included.  I wonder if Simpson's Morfontaine should be included, instead of Ballybunion.  Simpson had more to do with the current Ballybunion course than some claim, but it's far from being his alone.

[JakaB]

Paul,

Which courses would you consider "throwaways"...try to go out on a short limb just for arguments sake..

[Paul_Turner]

John

I typed a long reply but it disappeared.  Quickly and with a lot of guessing.

Bin Ballybunion.  Way too busy.  Sandwich is as good or better for the "big dunes" type of links.  Simpson=Morfontaine?

Bin North Berwick and include Brancaster or Prestwick instead.

Bin The Creek.  Too many LI courses.  Take a middle america Raynor...Chicago?

Bin Lancaster.  Too many parkland.  Take Shinnethingy.

Bin Stonewall.  As above...Pacific Dunes.

Bin Woodhall.  Take West Sussex instead.  Garden City can be the "low profile, deep bunker" course.

Bin Crystal Downs.  Have Maxwell's greens at PD.  Need Melbourne for Mack.

Bin Commonwealth.  Knock on from above.

[Chris Kane]

Bin Commonwealth.  Knock on from above.

A knock on from what?  Mackenzie had nothing to do with Commonwealth.

[Paul_Turner]

Knock on from Melbourne being the Sand Belt course.

[cary lichtenstein]

A Doak butt boy? This site is getting a bit risque

[Paul_Turner]

The world top 100 according to Ran and Co at GOLF.

1. Pine Valley (Clementon, NJ)
2. Cypress Point (Pebble Beach, Calif)
3. Pebble Beach (Pebble Beach, Calif)
4. Augusta National (Augusta, Ga)
5. St. Andrews (Old Course) (St. Andrews, Scotland)
6. Shinnecock Hills (Southampton, N.Y)
7. Pinehurst (No. 2) (Pinehurst, N.C)
8 . Royal County Down (Newcastle, N. Ireland)
9. Muirfield (Gullane, Scotland)
10. Royal Melbourne (Composite) (Melbourne, Australia)

[ForkaB]

Wow, I've done roughly 70% of those suckers!

I'll still opt for the ~30% I've missed on the "top 10" over the ~2/3 I've missed on the 31 flavo(u)rs, even if those 3 are the only ones I am able to play.  Hard to not over-equate 7 rounds at Pine Valley and Royal Melbourne and Augusta National with 1 round at Desert Forest Highlands and each of its ilk..........

[Scott_Burroughs]

The world top 100 according to Ran and Co at GOLF.

1. Pine Valley (Clementon, NJ)
2. Cypress Point (Pebble Beach, Calif)
3. Pebble Beach (Pebble Beach, Calif)
4. Augusta National (Augusta, Ga)
5. St. Andrews (Old Course) (St. Andrews, Scotland)
6. Shinnecock Hills (Southampton, N.Y)
7. Pinehurst (No. 2) (Pinehurst, N.C)
8 . Royal County Down (Newcastle, N. Ireland)
9. Muirfield (Gullane, Scotland)
10. Royal Melbourne (Composite) (Melbourne, Australia)

Paul,

That's the 2001 list.  The 2003 list is the same 10 courses, but in a different order:

1. PV
2. Cypress
3. Muirfield
4. Shinny
5. Augusta
6. TOC
7. Pebble
8. Royal Melbourne
9. Pinehurst #2
10. RCD

[Scott_Burroughs]

The Top 10 courses (my guesses) on the Doak List that
aren't on the GM World Top 10 would give the World Top 10 a
run for it's money:

Ballybunion
Casa de Campo
Crystal Downs
Garden City
Merion
NGLA
Prairie Dunes
Royal Dornoch
SFGC
Sand Hills

[Paul_Turner]

I bet Ran was ecstatic about Muirfield jumping to #3.

Could put this in Rich's Michelin Star terminology:

10 *** courses vs (for the sake of argument) 15 *** 10** and 6*

I'd definitely go for the latter.

[THuckaby2]

I'd go for the latter as well - BUT NOT if that means I was prohibited from ever playing the former.

TH

[JakaB]

OK...I'll say it.   I'd rather play one round at ANGC, TOC and Shinnecock than one round at the remaining 30 of Doaks 31 flavors.....

[Paul_Turner]

I'll take a stab at Tom's top 10 from that 31 (which granted, isn't the same as his actual top 10).  It might just be his 10s and 9s, but maybe not?

TOC
NGLA
Ballybunion
Sand Hills
Pine Valley
Pinehurst
Merion
Crystal Downs
Royal Dornoch
Rye?

[Scott_Burroughs]

OK...I'll say it.   I'd rather play one round at ANGC, TOC and Shinnecock than one round at the remaining 30 of Doaks 31 flavors.....

NGLA and Sand Hills don't get your juices flowing any?  Oh, that's right, the first hole at SH doesn't have any strategy to it.   And since they've never held a major and aren't on TV every now and then (and you've admitted to having the golfing desires more like Joe Six-Pack), they're not nearly as desirable.

[Scott_Burroughs]

I'll take a stab at Tom's top 10 from that 31 (which granted, isn't the same as his actual top 10).  It might just be his 10s and 9s, but maybe not?

TOC
NGLA
Ballybunion
Sand Hills
Pine Valley
Pinehurst
Merion
Crystal Downs
Royal Dornoch
Rye?

I'll guess he might replace Rye with Prairie Dunes.

[JakaB]

OK...I'll say it.   I'd rather play one round at ANGC, TOC and Shinnecock than one round at the remaining 30 of Doaks 31 flavors.....

NGLA and Sand Hills don't get your juices flowing any?  Oh, that's right, the first hole at SH doesn't have any strategy to it.   And since they've never held a major and aren't on TV every now and then (and you've admitted to having the golfing desires more like Joe Six-Pack), they're not nearly as desirable.

Scott,

Are you trying to insult me or Joe Six-Pack....In the realm of the best courses in the world...NGLA and Sand Hills are both relics of a time gone by....Sand Hills being a more recent time...they are both fashion statements that while being fun to play are simply courses whose time has come and gone.   Neither is left nut worthy..

[Scott_Burroughs]

Sand Hills' time has come and gone and it's only 9 years old?

NGLA is a fashion statement?  Considered by a handful of folks here to be the most strategic (and best) course in the world?

How are they relics?  SH is nearly 7100 yards and a par 71, so it ain't "short", if that's what you may have been indicating.

I think you've had a couple of six-packs already.

Just tell me the truth that majors and TV (and bragging rights) affect your decision.  I won't pretend I don't really want to play those courses very much as well, but I can live without playing those 3 vs. the other 30.  To each his own.

[JakaB]

Just tell me the truth that majors and TV (and bragging rights) affect your decision.  I won't pretend I don't really want to play those courses very much as well, but I can live without playing those 3 vs. the other 30.  To each his own.

Scott,

I don't know why you care and I don't feel dirty saying it, so here goes...I would want to play ANGC partly because that is where they play the Masters and I have watched everyone of them since I was a little kid....I also think it would be fun watching future Masters after getting a chance to play the course.    The Masters always signals a new season of golf for me.....I just love it.

On Shinnecock and TOC I can not say for absolute sureness if I want to play them because they are the two best courses in the world or if they host Majors because they are the best two courses in the world......I know I would like to play 7 at Shinnecock and the 17th at TOC because of what I have seen on TV.....so maybe you are right or maybe not..

Since it is truth time here.....If I could either play ANGC or the 31 flavors.....given the trouble of travel and time constraints.....I would gladly choose ANGC....it would not even be a choice....it would be a celebration..

[Mike Hendren]

John also known as Barney,

Why do the cognoscenti have such a difficult time admitting they'd trade it all in for one round at Augusta National Golf Club?  

Is is time for the Augusta National Golf Club lovers to come out of the closet?

Mike

[THuckaby2]

I'm here with you, brethren.  I would trade it all for some Augusta time.  Maybe not for ONE ROUND, mind you - that's a lot to trade - but give me one night and two days and as much golf as I can squeeze in whilst there and you can have the 31 flavors, as much as some other personal faves of mine are on that list.

A whacko here once asked about golf's holy grails.  This is the holiest of holy.  

And John hits on why... so much historic golf has been played there... the walk in the footsteps of heroes experience has to be rivaled only by St. Andrews-Old, and those who have played there know how mind-blowing that is.  But equally important is actually playing there would make future Masters-viewing just that much more fun.....

[Mike_Cirba]

Honestly, truthfully...

Of the "drop everything and go" courses I haven't played, Augusta is about 5th on my personal list.

In fact, if given the choice between Oakmont and ANGC tomorrow, it would be no contest at all.  

Less trees too.  

[THuckaby2]

Mike:

Just curious - what are the top 5?

Dave - interesting analogy.  Kinda makes me want to rethink this.  Just do understand that personally I've already nailed a lot of those broads, and I'm also assuming I get the #1 broad SEVERAL times.  

TH

ps - of course you also realize the crux of everything here is this:  Issue #10 - Rita Heywuhth or Ava Gahdnah - who would you rather nail?  I disqualify myself because I've done em both...

will anyone get this reference?  

[Mike_Cirba]

Tom;

My present "drop everything list" would have Oakmont and Seminole ahead of ANGC in this country.

The Country Club in Brookline and The Golf Club in Ohio are close, with probably more interesting golf courses but not the same level of aesthetic and historical ambience.

Others I'm more interested in seeing first include Muirfield, Royal County Down, Royal Portrush, Royal Melbourne, and Dornoch.

[THuckaby2]

Mike:

Very fine list.  Interesting in that none of your US candidates rise to Augusta status for me... Oh yes, I'd love to see each and every one, for various reasons... with maybe Brookline the closest contender... but none of those rise to John's "left-nut" status, and I am quite the golf history buff.  Augusta might be worth both nuts.  I do have a little love for the Masters.  

As for your rest of the world list, I can say done it, done it, done it, would give a half a nut to see it but only if I get to see a bunch of others down there, done it.