Cypress Point and playing the ninth....

[Brian_Gracely]

James,

Post some of those pictures!!  Or send them directly to me if you're not sure how to post them.

[James Edwards]

Brian,

I've sent it to your yahoo address, thank you

James

[ForkaB]

Tom

My bad

It's "Spion Kop."

We had a thread on this about a year or so ago.  Spion Kop was the site of a famous battle in the Boer War.  Maybe Sir Bob can give us an eyewitness account....

The golf holes of this ilk, of which there are many, are varied, but have as their defining charactersitic a fortresslike green, set on a hill, usually over some sort of valley.  Of the ones I know best, Canmore is 210 or so, uphill and Muckhart 300.  CPC #9 fits into this lot like a glove.  There is one at Traigh, which is 450.  Maybe Slag (oops, Norbert Painter, Esq.) could tell us about it.  It's not too far from where Dr. MacK summered (Lochinver).  Could he have "found" 9 CPC in his dreams of Traigh?

[THuckaby2]

Rich:

Aha!  That makes sense.  Not a whole hell of a lot different from a redan, or what a redan is supposed to be anyway - just not on a par 3 hole?

And yes, it would seem to me 9CPC fits that definition.

TH

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Sir Bob, I love the hole for the options it brings to the table. I have played a 6 iron(160), 4 iron (180), 5 wood(200), 3 wood(230 to 240) and a driver (the green man the green). The hole is delightful and I love the green complex. Bob is correct, the landing area is larger than it appears and I now feel the best shot, without winds that change general strategy, is a 3 wood to the open area and make a short pitch to the green. The new clubs and balls make the driver or 3 wood to the green much easier and I am close to saying that is the shot in match play. If you miss right you are deader than dead. A miss left is a most difficult long bunker shot. A miss long is dead or a very downhill often down grain bunker shot. The green is to die for and a place to chip and putt all day and into the moonlight. 3 is my best number of strokes here but I have putted for 2 once from 10 feet only to mark a 4 down on the card. Did i say it was fast downhill and downgrain?

[THuckaby2]

I have putted for 2 once from 10 feet only to mark a 4 down on the card. Did i say it was fast downhill and downgrain?

I only wish that Mr. Huntley would have been there for that occurrence, and he was your opponent.  The reaction could only have been:

"what a pity."

Those who have heard this know of what I speak.  

[James Edwards]

Mr Bernhardt,

Hopefully the picture which Mr Gracely will hopefully post, will bring back some memories of your 3 putt  -- --

A great great drive offered up no birdie eh!!

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

James, a 4 putt is always in the cards on that green. I could have made the birdie but not made the eagle with a timid stroke. It was worth the risk to try for the eagle.  lol yes Tom, I am not sure which brings Bob more pleasure, to make a birdie or to win the hole after you miss a short putt to half it. lol His "what a pity" lines are great fun if you are on the same team and somewhat less humorous if you are part of the opposition.

[Brian_Gracely]

Here's James' picture:

[THuckaby2]

That's a front right pin the chaps are playing.. you can see how the waste area stops before the green.. and there is grass the entire width of the picture beyond this waste area.. that's the area I was talking about as being twice as wide as the area one would hit an iron into, to have a 100 yard shot in.  The area closer to the tee than that, just as wide as the area before the green, means a 160 yard shot max off the tee, and thus a shot playing effectively 150 into the green.  I can't see that as a very viable option.

Perhaps I am not insane.  

[James Edwards]

Tom, those chaps you describe are partly an architectural dynasty in the making "the Swan family"  .   Howard Swan (Swan Golf Designs Ltd - Ex president of the European institute - My Boss) on the left with 40 years in the trade and William, his son in the middle and Richard Myers to the right - the star golfer and cricketer!

The group in the distance was the professionals morning tuesday fourball.. who we followed and jumped in front of every now and then...

Tiger,  quick... very quick..  we rolled balls from every conceivable angle for a long time and it didn't get slower even uphill..

Tom,

From here it looks wide doesn't it...  but left looks steep and trouble and right looks dangerous - For a man who studied psychology, I am negativce sometimes!!

[THuckaby2]

James:

Funny how the mind works.  I swear to you I reached that my first time playing the course after many years absence, a few years ago, I walked down 8 and it struck me big time how wide that area is in front of the green... I never even noticed the death right!  Then when reaching 9 tee, it looked as bit as a football pitch to me.  I had absolutely no hesitation pulling out driver.

Of course I do that on damn near every hole I play though... I am rather a positive thinker.  

[Jfaspen]

Great picture (from atop the dune).. After seeing it, there is no doubt in my mind.. I play for the big landing area in front.. if it nut it, I am really close/on the green, if I miss it, I have an easy chip..

If there was a 20 mph wind coming at me, i might just take out the 5-iron and play safe..  

jf

[THuckaby2]

Great picture (from atop the dune).. After seeing it, there is no doubt in my mind.. I play for the big landing area in front.. if it nut it, I am really close/on the green, if I miss it, I have an easy chip..

If there was a 20 mph wind coming at me, i might just take out the 5-iron and play safe..  

jf

That's exactly my thinking, Jeffrey.  And hell yes, wind changes everything.  All of this talk to this point assumes no big wind.

TH

[TEPaul]

"You just chose a bad example to illustrate it in the discussion of CPC#9, that's all."

TomH:

I did? Do you really think the caddies of CPC hand Mrs Twitchtits a 6 iron off the tee of CPC's 9th everytime she plays it? Has anyone on here ever thought about or written about what might be going through Mrs Wigglyass's mind whenever she plays a golf hole anywhere? Not a single time, in my recollection, in the five or so years I've been on this website. How about Mr Baggypants, the 30 handicapper, and how he looks at and plays any course or hole? Nope, not one time!

[Brian_Gracely]

"You just chose a bad example to illustrate it in the discussion of CPC#9, that's all."

TomH:

I did? Do you really think the caddies of CPC hand Mrs Twitchtits a 6 iron off the tee of CPC's 9th everytime she plays it? Has anyone on here ever thought about or written about what might be going through Mrs Wigglyass's mind whenever she plays a golf hole anywhere? Not a single time, in my recollection, in the five or so years I've been on this website. How about Mr Baggypants, the 30 handicapper, and how he looks at and plays any course or hole? Nope, not one time!

TEPaul,

No some extent, I think it gets discussed quite a bit by the Ross crowds, but then those discussions always decompose into "it's all in the greens".  And since CBM or Dr.McK only designed a few courses, most of which are inaccesible to more than the priveledged few, you're not going to see that discussion on a daily basis.  That you have this many people on the list that have seen and played CPC all in one place definitely falls into the 0.0001% of American society.

And considering that not alot of GCA.com posters are 60yr. women with blue hair and menapause, it's tough to give that viewpoint when you haven't walked a mile in their support hose.

[James Edwards]

Tom, why you being so aggressive?

Im sure, Mr and Mrs Havisham... would chime in if they were reading the thread and more importantly wanting to contribute...  After all it is a forum to discuss architecture and it's merits isn't it?...  I have learnt the thoughts and feelings of Tiger, Bob, Tom, Jeffrey and how they would play a classic golf hole at a classic course etc etc.  It just so happens, It is one of my favourite holes because of the options...  When, I finally have the courtesy to play it, I will be richer in my knowledge of the course and it's surroundings --  I'm learning a great deal through this thread, Sorry for disapointing you - and even more still when the 30 handicapper puts their respective points in too.  

James Edwards

[ForkaB]

James

More importantly, how are you planning to play the 1st at Painwick.  225 yards uphill and nobody yet has admitted to being able to reach that green.  As a scratch player who will lead off the competition, we are expecting big things from you.  No pressure, of course.......

[James Edwards]

Richard, of course you are expecting big things of me and the team..  We are world beaters..... (?)

I have the capacity to do all sorts of things with the golf ball, low fade, high draw, lob, bump and run, fat, shank, deep pull hook, wide slice!!  whatever you want.  I just can't tell you when they are going to happen thats all...

[THuckaby2]

My God I wish I could witness James at Painswick... that name evokes the feeling I get every time I read about the upcoming event.  Oh cursed timing!

But TEP:  in this thread, sure there are a few comments to the effect you mention, but overall the thread to me is full of people trying to see all different ways of playing the golf hole.  I myself said at one point I actively DISCOUNT how the pros play it, because they make up such a low percentage of players that they really matter only as a curiousity.  What more do you want from us?

TH

[Jfaspen]

Sounds like a flushed 2-iron!
jf

James

More importantly, how are you planning to play the 1st at Painwick.  225 yards uphill and nobody yet has admitted to being able to reach that green.  As a scratch player who will lead off the competition, we are expecting big things from you.  No pressure, of course.......

[James Edwards]

Jeffrey,

Memories................

[Marty Bonnar]

Illustrating TEP's point re MINIMAL sand movement....







maybe one day I may judge in person.......

Photos by Julian Graham
Bancroft Library, UCB & The Cypress Point Club

[James Edwards]

That puts a whole new perspective on playing the hole now Tom doesn't it..... Still hit driver??

Thanks Martin for the pictures..

[THuckaby2]

James - oh hell yeah:  in the sand is in the sand... why not get closer?  

Great pictures Martin/FBD - and when your day comes to see this in person, man I want to witness.  

TH