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John_Cullum

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #50 on: December 02, 2004, 04:07:14 PM »
Most interesting golfer I played with, there are 3 contenders:

1. I played at Black Diamond ranch a few years ago and our group caught up with Tommy Bolt on the last hole, so we finished out with him. I didn't spend enough quality time with him to really appreciate what would be an interesting experience. But it still counts!

2. There is a guy around Tampa named Faxon Bissett. He is somewhat notorious for being one of the great bullshit artists of all time on a golf course. I am told by someone other than him that a magazine wrote an article about him because he was so full of shit. He can tell you anything with a straight face. He's a really good guy, and a helluva player, especially for his age. He's about 60 now, probably scratch from the blue tees.

3. The most fascinating would have to be Lou Rosanova. He was a pretty high ranking member of one of the families. his name is on the organizational chart in Joe Valaci's book. He was a fanatstic player, Tom Paul can tell you more stories than I can about him. He is the only person I ever took lessons from. Unlike me, he lost very few bets.
"We finally beat Medicare. "

wsmorrison

Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #51 on: December 02, 2004, 04:07:32 PM »
Jason,

You do have a point.  Listen, what have the Phillies done throughout their history to give us any hope they can make the right decision.  Once in a while they get it right (Jim Thome and Bobby Abreu) but they have to be the most inept sports organization I can imagine.  

I agree completely that they should move the fences back.  Trouble is, I don't think they can without it costing huge money.  Better off spending it on players.  Unless Mayor Street gives in and makes us pay for it--before he is under his next investigation.

By the way, I've known Bill Giles for some time now.  He is one of the all-time nicest people.  I can forgive him some of his ownership decisions because he is so nice.  The other clueless owners and the inept handling of things by Ed Wade is a recipe for disaster.  Wade must go for the Philllies to have a future.  Too bad Leyland wasn't hired.  He would've told the owners the straight scoop.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2004, 04:15:40 PM by Wayne Morrison »

TEPaul

Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #52 on: December 02, 2004, 04:08:20 PM »
This is just amazing. I started this thread just to see what would happen. It's generating more interest faster than most any I've seen. One of the reasons I started it was to see how much more interest other extraneous subjects on golf have on this site than the subject of serious golf course architecture discussion. It's a lot more interest!

Oh so what? "Golf (and its architecture) is a great big world and there really is room in it for everyone"! How true that is!   :)

Mike Benham

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #53 on: December 02, 2004, 04:25:07 PM »
Dan, you had the same play I did.  You started up by the blue line with the winger, with his stick in front of him and rushed the wing and the center nearly simultaneously with a very quick thrust.  If the opponent cheated over to block the pass, you had the winger shoot, right?  And you had your offside winger set up so that if you missed the shot, he'd get the rebound as it went around the boards?

Exactly. Great minds think alike!

I miss hockey ...  :'(
« Last Edit: December 02, 2004, 04:28:16 PM by Mike Benham »
"... and I liked the guy ..."

THuckaby2

Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #54 on: December 02, 2004, 04:27:15 PM »
Mike - go play NHL 2005 - it's damn near better than the real thing.

Note I say damn near.

 :'( :'(

Dan Kelly

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #55 on: December 02, 2004, 04:28:08 PM »
Dan, wouldn't you agree that the other game I showed, with the squiggly centerman slot SUCKED compared to the 2nd one with the straight centerman slot.

Yes -- and no.

The straight center slot was essential.

But so was room behind the net, for wing-to-wing passes behind the goalie. Your second game doesn't appear to have that. A fatal flaw.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2004, 04:42:39 PM by Dan Kelly »
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Dan Kelly

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #56 on: December 02, 2004, 04:34:14 PM »

I miss hockey ...  :'(

From espn.com: NEW YORK -- The NHL accepted an invitation from the players' association on Thursday to return to the negotiating table in an effort to end the lockout that began nearly three months ago.

In a letter sent to NHL commissioner Gary Bettman on Thursday, players' association executive director Bob Goodenow proposed that the sides meet next week in Toronto and said the union is working on a new proposal.

The session will be held next Thursday and Friday at the players' association offices.

« Last Edit: December 02, 2004, 04:47:26 PM by Dan Kelly »
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Dan Kelly

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #57 on: December 02, 2004, 04:59:05 PM »
Heroes of Philadelphia Sports



Richie Ashburn



Ed Van Impe

"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Mike Benham

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #58 on: December 02, 2004, 07:20:42 PM »

I miss hockey ...  :'(

From espn.com: NEW YORK -- The NHL accepted an invitation from the players' association on Thursday to return to the negotiating table in an effort to end the lockout that began nearly three months ago.

In a letter sent to NHL commissioner Gary Bettman on Thursday, players' association executive director Bob Goodenow proposed that the sides meet next week in Toronto and said the union is working on a new proposal.

The session will be held next Thursday and Friday at the players' association offices.



The local FoxSports affiliate here in the Bay Area has replayed some of the most famous SJ Sharks games over the past few weeks.  

The first one was the 7th game against Detroit, a #1 vs. #8 seed in the 1994 Stanley Cup Playoffs.  A phenomenal game, a watershed game for the Sharks franchise.

The replays are quite interesting as they have in studio a couple of the key players or coaches doing voice overs about key elements of the game and the series.

It has, only momentarily, wetted my appetite for hockey this winter.
"... and I liked the guy ..."

George Pazin

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #59 on: December 02, 2004, 07:29:45 PM »
I can only assume that most of you have not teed it up with Adam Clayman, because he would surely win your vote if you had! The big redhead is as lovable as he is entertaining.

Who is the most interesting golfer I look forward to teeing it up with someday? Greg Ramsey at Barnbougle, of course! Second would be Ran at The Carthage Club; third would be Rich Goodale at Dornoch; fourth would be Brian Phillips somewhere in Norway; and fifth would be Tom P anywhere.

Modification - I forgot Tom D at Sheeps Ranch. He'd probably squeeze in after Greg Ramsay.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2004, 07:31:31 PM by George Pazin »
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

Joe Perches

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #60 on: December 02, 2004, 07:50:02 PM »
Big John Montague.  Sweet man. about 1970 to 72 or so. He was about 70 years old and he used to hit it 270 easy, effortlessly.  Great, great short iron player.  I was an in-awe kid.

http://www.churmpublishing.com/golf/articles/2002/11_02/cover.asp

Steve Lang

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #61 on: December 02, 2004, 07:58:34 PM »
 8)

DAve Schmidt.. You definitely get it,.. on table hockey, that wing-center play used to dominate our games and lives like Hockey Night In Canada.. during the winter.. we called that play "jacking it".. later after college daze we started the JD shot rule after all scores.. the rink commonly raises off the table..

on topic...

DOUG SANDERS IN LIME GREEN VARIATIONS HEAD TO TOE!
Inverness (Toledo, OH) cathedral clock inscription: "God measures men by what they are. Not what they in wealth possess.  That vibrant message chimes afar.
The voice of Inverness"

Bob_Huntley

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #62 on: December 02, 2004, 11:12:14 PM »
John Cullum,

Lou Rosanova played at Riviera from time to time. As you say he lost few wagers.

Bob

Ted Kramer

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #63 on: December 03, 2004, 08:33:00 AM »
This is the one, right here:



The play was to have the winger with the puck in front of him, on the board side (near side in the picture).  Get him all the way up by the blue line.  Have the center with his stick in front of him up by the blue line, too.  Then you'd slowly move the winger forward, always prepared to shoot.  If the goalie cheated to block the shot by the winger, then you'd pass to the center, who then had the goalie dead to rights. If the goalie cheated to stop the deflection by the center, the winger would shoot and score.  The play was to shove the center forward violently at exactly the same time the winger moved forward violently and either passed to get the deflection or shot to the near side. It's unstopppable, especially with the metal blades, which were a bit longer, for more control.

OH, yeah!  And if they defended it by playing both the goalie and the defenseman perfectly, you'd have your winger sling it around the boards real quick and do it from the other side before the opponent could get the goalie and the other defenseman in position!  Totally unstoppable.

Greatest game I had as a kid!
Winger to the center with the center moving hard to the crease was the "the play".

One of the main defensive strategies was to use the in-out motion of the goalie to cut angles . . .once the puck moved from wing to center I would push my goalie out as far as possible while moving him from the post towards the middle of the net, often getting a piece of the incoming shot. *** EDIT*** My game didn't have the goalie on the single line track, he was free to move in and out and around the crease.***

I don't know if it is just a good old days type of memory exageration but I'm pretty sure that I remember my friends and I playing that game lightening fast, without ever looking down at our hands and moving the puck very very quickly . . .

Thanks for the quick trip down memory lane.

-Ted
« Last Edit: December 03, 2004, 08:36:14 AM by Ted Kramer »

Ted Kramer

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #64 on: December 03, 2004, 08:48:05 AM »
You're right!  The goalie could come in and out.  This isn't the game I had either, but it was better than that first picture where the centerman's slot curved....

Yeah, my buddy had the curved center slot version and we all agreed that it was pretty lame. . .

Did you and your friends ever have fist fights over the game, we did ::) :P. The biggest reason was for "shaking the table" . . .we were an intense bunch.

-Ted

Doug Sobieski

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #65 on: December 03, 2004, 08:58:37 AM »
My hands down #1 - Dewey Tomko (former World Series of Poker winner and also written up in Rick Reilley's book Who's Your Caddie). Reilley believes that Dewey has won more money on the golf course than anyone in the history of the game. He was a member at Bay Hill while I worked there, and played regularly in the daily Shootout. A very unusual individual to say the least.....

A few others in no particular order...

Michael Jordan (actually played with him on the day his dad was murdered)
O.J. Simpson (before anyone asks, it was BEFORE)
General George Joulwan (former member of the Joint Chiefs of Staff during the Gulf War. I had to be checked out by the FBI before we teed it up)

Jason Tetterton

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #66 on: December 03, 2004, 08:59:20 AM »
I've had the opportunity to play with a couple of guys from the NBA.   Not a lot of star quality, but Ron Harper and Charles Oakley.  Also, played with Roman Gabriel and Ernie Banks.  All very nice and have left me with great memories.  Oakley was not very good at all, but the stories.  He wasn't afraid to tell anyone what HE really thought about Pat Riley.

SL_Solow

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #67 on: December 03, 2004, 11:14:22 AM »
  The most interesting golfer I met on the course also has a tie in to the hockey focus on this thread.  We met when I was in law school during a spring break vacation to the Bahamas in 1974.  I was paired up by the starter at Shannon(NLE) with a very strong looking man in his 60's or 70's who introduced himself as Eddie.  He was a good player and I learned he was from the Northeast not far from where I was attending school.  I asked him what business he was in and he told me he was in the hockey business.  I replied, You're Eddie Shore."  I think he was shocked that someone in his 20's recognized a player who had been retired for more than 30 years and owned/coached a minor league team.  But here I was with the man who was purported to have been the best defenseman in hockey history up to that time and maybe the meanest.  The rest of the round and sometime thereafter was spent in drawing out stories about the old days including his famous hit on Howie Morenz.  The golf was great too.  A memorable day.  TEP, thanks for bringing it back by starting this thread.

THuckaby2

Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #68 on: December 03, 2004, 11:22:18 AM »
During the glory days when Clorox sponsored a lot of charity golf tourneys, I got to play in quite a few... tough work, I know.  In any case I played with each of:

Jack Tatum (Raider DB, most famous for the hit that paralyzed Darryl Stingley, unfortunately as he was a really great player)... at the start I was on pins and needles trying not to piss him off lest he stick me... but he turned out to be a very nice guy... kinda quiet... good player too.

Bill Russell - yep, Celtics center... didn't say a word to me the entire round, nor I too him after a few early pleasantries were met with grunts... seemed nice enough, was cracking all sorts of jokes with my boss (who knew him) but with people he didn't know, well he didn't care to start knowing....

plus quite a few lesser known ones... all these pro athletes always seemed pretty cool to me... Ben Davidson (former Raider great) was absolutely hilarious... just like the beer commercials....

TH

Dan Kelly

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #69 on: December 03, 2004, 11:55:48 AM »
You're Eddie Shore.

Read all about him, at http://members.tripod.com/cuparcanucks/shorebiography/shorebio.htm.

A most interesting passage:

SPRINGFIELD INDIANS
After a short time with the New York Americans Eddie hung up his skates and took to
coaching his Springfield Indians full-time. Eddie soon became the most unusual
owner hockey has ever seen. Shore was known to open training camps by having his
players tap dance in the lobby of a hotel, to have his players do ballet steps on the ice,
tape players' hands to their sticks if they were in the improper position, and lock a
referee out of his dressing room as punishment for poor officiating (Beddoes, 1973).

The players who served under Shore have many stories to tell about the ex-Bruin.
Don Johns recalled an incident when Shore attempted to tell him why he was not a
better hockey player. Eddie told Johns that he would improve if he parted his hair on
the other side and that it would help him because he would have something else to
think about (Beddoes, 1973). Johns also recalled an incident with a rookie when
Shore wanted him to skate with his legs closer together. To accomplish this Shore took a piece of cord and tied the player's legs together and told him to skate (Beddoes, 1973). Shore had exact ideas about technique in the game of hockey. Eddie believed that a player's hands had to be two feet apart on the stick, the legs had to be 11 inches apart and that skating should be done in a sort of sitting position (Beddoes, 1973). One practice this point was brought home to Guidolin who had just made a perfect pass to another player who scored a goal. Shore called Guidolin over, asking him what he thought he had done wrong. Guidolin, in complete confusion, told Shore he thought it had been a good play. Shore replied, "Mister Guidolin, your legs were two inches too far apart," (Beddoes, 1973). Another such incident occurred when Don Cherry was playing under Shore. Cherry recalls that after goalie Claude Evans once turned in a 5-0 shutout, Shore marched into the dressing room and fined Evans 50 dollars because he did not bend his knees (Cherry, 1982).

However strange Shore's tactics may have appeared, it has now been shown that they
are well-grounded in physiological theory. Kent Douglas once commented that
studying under Shore was like getting your doctorate in hockey science (Beddoes,
1973). Shore also defended his rule that his players take tap dancing lessons. He
explained that dancing improves balance, and balance is the foundation of any athlete's
ability (Beddoes, 1973). Perhaps a down point to Shore's coaching was his
expectations that players would be as tough as he was in their hockey playing style.
One player by the name of Kilrea related a story of Shore's unrealistic expectations.
Kilrea had suffered a double fracture of the jaw in one game. While he was in the
hospital, he received a phone call from Shore telling him to go back to the rink.
Kilrea thought Shore was being a concerned owner, and so went back to the rink. Shore ordered Kilrea and Eagan, the assistant coach at the time, to go and get dressed
in full equipment. Eddie then told the two to go to opposite ends of the rink and skate
"like hell" at each other and butt heads. Shore was trying to find out how much
pain Kilrea could take to decide whether to put him in the next game (Guay, Feb. 5,
1989).

Shore was also known for his antics during games. Once he was so enraged by a
referee's call, he took his entire team off the ice for one play. The goalie was left to
fend for himself and managed to fall on the puck before the other team scored. Shore
then conceded to put his players back on the ice (Beddoes, 1973). Another time Shore directed his anger toward a player on the opposing team. After manhandling a few Springfield players, the Baltimorian was sent to the penalty box which was beside the Indians' bench. Shore walked down the bench and yelled to the player that if he were a few years younger, he would knock the dickens out of him (Beddoes, 1973). That did not satisfy Eddie, however. When Baltimore went on to win the game Eddie ran to the announcer's box and began calling the referee every name he could think of to protest the loss (Beddoes, 1973).

Shore is also remembered as a very frugal coach. Billy McCreary recalled how, when
he played under Shore, that the players were only allowed to tip the cab drivers 15
cents. Eventually it got to the point where the Indians could not get a cab ride
because no driver would pick them up (Beddoes, 1973). Shore also got out of many
bonus contracts with players. If any player was getting close to the 30 goal mark,
at which point they would get a bonus, Shore would bench them so the mark could
not be reached (Beddoes, 1973).

Shore used to keep players who were injured busy, despite their inability to play
hockey. These players became known as Shore's Black Aces. They were forced to do odd jobs such as paint arena seats, sell programs, make popcorn, and blow up balloons (Beddoes, 1973). Shore also got extra work out of his coaches. The coaches were not only required to do the same jobs as the Aces were, one coach reportedly repaired Shore's house (Beddoes, 1973). It was common knowledge, however, that Shore would never give any player or coach a job he would not do himself. In fact, when Shore first owned the Indians, he would sometimes play for them when the team was short. Eddie would be seen out parking cars ten minutes before the game started,making a mad dash to change and make it on the ice for the drop of the puck (Cherry,1982). One day the Black Aces took advantage of Shore's frugalness to repay him for all the work they were required to do. Shore was changing light bulbs in the arena's ceiling. To do this Shore climbed up a platform and the players pushed him from bulb to bulb. At one point Shore was screwing in a light bulb with one hand and holding on to an overhead cable with the other. One of the Aces pushed the platform out from under Shore, leaving him hanging there from the cable. The players did not see Shore scream and yell for help, instead he calmly looked down and asked one of the players to return the platform to its proper place (Cherry, 1982). Eventually theAces pushed it back under him and he went on changing the bulbs (Beddoes, 1973).

Eddie's trading tactics were also questioned at times by the players. Once Shore
traded for a player named Smith. At the first practice Smith came into the dressing
room and was immediately questioned by Shore about the whereabouts of his goalie
pads. Smith, confused, replied he was not a goalie but a forward. Shore had traded for the wrong Smith (McFarlane, 1991). Another time Shore traded player Jake
Milford to Buffalo for a pair of goal nets. He later commented he had gotten a bad
deal stating he had thought the nets were newer (Duff, March 19, 1985).

Due to varying circumstances Shore was moved from the Indians to the Buffalo
Bisons back to Springfield and then to the Syracuse Warriors. Finally in 1954 he
returned to Springfield for good. Over his many years of coaching, managing and
owning professional hockey teams, Shore, with various teams, won the Calder Cup six
times (Saskatchewan Sports Hall of Fame, undated).

Shore's hard-nosed tactics did get him into hot water in 1966-67. The players on his
team went on strike, protesting against his hard-nosed tactics. They were represented
by a lawyer named Alan Eagleson. This development triggered the formation of the
National Hockey League Players Association, of which Eagleson became President
(Duff, March 9, 1985). Shore sold the Springfield players to Los Angeles after the
strike was over. This was one of the few setbacks Shore ever experienced, and his
prestige suffered (Beddoes, 1973).

It was also in 1966 that the Saskatchewan Sports Hall of Fame was opened in Regina.
It is thought that at this time Shore was asked if he would let his name stand to be
considered and he refused (Tiefenbach, May 11, 1985). It may be possible that the
incident with the players' strike had injured Shore to such an extent that he did not
want to be recognized by his home province.

Shore sold the Springfield Indians team in 1976 to George Leary ( Edmonton Sun,
March 18, 1985).  
 
 
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

THuckaby2

Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #70 on: December 03, 2004, 12:01:55 PM »
Of course you all realize that the only reason most people, or at least those in non-hockey-obssessed areas, have heard of Eddie Shore at all is because of the movie SLAPSHOT.

"Eddie Shore, old time hockey....."

 ;D

Mickey Boland

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #71 on: December 03, 2004, 04:20:05 PM »
The club where I grew up playing had an annual member-guest that grew to attract a number of celebrities and athletes.  This was back during the early - mid 70's especially.  Lots of Dallas Cowboys came down to play, as did Willie Nelson (before he was the famous Willie Nelson), and some minor celebrities like Phil Harris and Don Cherry.  I always caddied for one of the Cowboys, and one year in our group were astronauts Gene Cernan and Charlie Duke, both moonwalkers.  I did a lot more listening than talking, but quite a thrill for a young man to have an astronaut (especially at that time), put his arm around your shoulders and ask for advice on the next shot.  Astronauts were great partiers and great guys to be around.  Athletes were a lot of fun too, and my parents had some great stories about the tournament parties.

Casey Wade

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #72 on: December 03, 2004, 05:06:55 PM »
Played golf with a guy named Steve Thomas who I believe played one year on tour.  Extremely nice guy but was know to "stretch" the truth.  We were playing in the Back Acres Invitational in Sardis MS at Back Acres CC(yes, that is the name of the course!)  He told us he convinced a stewardess that he four-spotted for the Masters!  There are other stories he told but that one had me rolling!
Some people are alive simply because it is illegal to shoot them.

Brian_Gracely

Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #73 on: December 03, 2004, 09:35:32 PM »
....and some minor celebrities like Don Cherry.  

Minor celebrity?!?  The voice of a country and an entire sport.  And we used to go drinking in his bars in Canada when we were 19 and living in Detroit.....short drive across the border.

Dan Kelly

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Re:Who was the most interesting golfer....
« Reply #74 on: December 03, 2004, 09:44:20 PM »
I'm guessing that this is the first time in gca.com history that Don Cherry has been mentioned in three separate posts on the same thread.

Four, now!
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016