Huck, this guy is the poster child for what's bad about "Looks hard, plays easy."

 

Huck, I completely agree about it being good for a course to be fun for lesser golfers, but tough for a 1.6. I was simply pointing out that his handicap was likely built on a course that looks hard and plays easy, and not being able to cope with something different.

It is very easy to tell from reading this site that he is not a member of Shinnecock! No 1.6 from Shinney would shoot 3 rounds in the 80s anywhere unless there was serious wind to contend with, and if there were, he'd understand the difference.

In all seriousness, I don't care what this guy thinks, other than its influence on other people. I think this sort of thinking is what causes the types of courses I prefer to be passed over in favor of the latest dumb blond. As long as my favorites keep building courses that I prefer, I'll be happy. In fact, the dumb blonds might keep things less crowded, so maybe I should try to spread reviews like this....  

P.S. I get annoyed when very good golfers tell me that a course like this is unplayable for 85% of all golfers. Maybe that's just me, though.

Pittsburgh and San Fran are incredibly similar, btw, if you ignore the fact that they are nothing at all alike. They're both hilly.

I've heard enough from good to very-good golfers who seem to feel that if you hit the green, you have to be able to two putt without too much difficulty and therefore think that Biarittz style greens or greens with humps in them or whatever are "unfair".  

I haven't seen the Trails yet, but I've certainly heard very similar comments from good players about the 13th and 17th greens at Bandon Dunes.  13 at BD gets similar comments to his about 10 and 17 gets the same kind of comments as his on 5.  Sorry, but those don't wash with me.  I'm surprised he like them, but he must have hit it to the right spot on the green so that he didn't have too much trouble putting them.

Ryan - thanks - yes I meant the other two courses.

 

But yes it would be interesting to see his exact take on those two - only because he's so wildly off on BT from not only my own take, but damn near everyone else I've ever read...

Except re #14 at BT, that is.  Lots of people hate that golf hole, as you see on this thread.  But re the overall course, man this is the first I've heard that it's too severe.

TH

John:

Well said.  I agree with you.  If you read my back and forth with George, you'll see I am trying very hard to give the guy the benefit of the doubt.

And his take INTERESTS me, that's all.  I don't want to read what he said about the other two courses with any intent to rip the guy; far from it.  He just sees BT so wildly different from anyone else, it would just help to put it all into a better context.

I love opposing views -I learn from them.  That's why I want to hear more from this guy!

TH

John - well said.  Yes the guy did do relatively poorly at all three... so my guess that his take on BT is clouded by poor play likely doesn't hold water... which has me even more intrigued!

Quote from: Tom Huckaby on November 07, 2005, 12:14:24 PM

But yes it would be interesting to see his exact take on those two -

His original post did not get into much detail on the other two courses, other than a general "I really enjoyed the other two courses" kind of one-sentence summation. He also made favorable comments on the lodging, food, service, caddies, etc, etc. He had a (relatively, in terms of his whole experience) minor bone to pick about one of three courses, and found pretty much everything else about the trip excellent. How's about we all lighten up on judging him and his playing ability? None of us know him. If you're so insecure in your own opinion of the course that you can't tolerate an opposing view, then that relfects more poorly on you than him, IMHO.

So we should just shrug our shoulders and say, well, that's one guy's opinion?

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Who's the insecure one? Who can't tolerate someone else's opinion? Disagreeing with someone's opinion, and even specualting as to why he has said opinion, is not being intolerant of that opinion. It's discussion, pure and simple. No one is suggesting he be tarred and feathered, or banned from playing at Bandon, or anything like that. People simply disagree with his view of the course, and several have speculated as to why he didn't seem to enjoy BT. If anything, his statement that 85% of golfers would find BT unplayable is the intolerant statement.

We're just shooting the bull over a golf course. Nothing wrong with that.

 

Tom Huckaby writes:
but neither is "unplayable" - hell the approach is a wedge or something close to that in each case.

I still have no clue what unplayable means in this context. If I were to describe something as unplayable in would be more along the lines of John Updike:

"Dream golf is simply golf played on another course. We chip from glass tables onto moving stairways; we swing in a straightjacket, through masses of cobweb, and awaken not with any sense of unjust hazard but only with a regret that the round can never be completed, and that one of our phantasmal companions has kept the scorecard."
 --John Updike

And even Mr. Updike finds something appealing in his dream golf.

So what does unplayable mean?

he did say he made three GOOD shots, not mediocre.

Here is what our phantom poster said:
If you are right as I was on this hole you are dead.

Perhaps for some reason he was aiming for the right from the tee. Standing on the tee it seems reasonably obvious that if you want to score well on this hole you better keep it to the left, but then perhaps this shot was just poor judgment rather than poor execution.

I had to flip a lob wedge over the bunker and stop the ball on about eight feet of green. I didn’t and it goes over into a swale.

Seems here he knew the target and missed it. I assume he is saying is eight feet of green is too small a target for a 1.6 handicapper with a lob wedge, but hard not to argue that he missed his target. Shouldn't lob wedges face some degree of difficulty?

My guess is here he was trying to hit too small a target for his ability and he is upset when he failed. I'm betting if you told him he had to make no worse than par on that hole he could have hit the green, two putted and went on. Heck, I could and I'm betting if I had a handicap I wouldn't be called a 1.6. You think any 1.6 in the world couldn't put it somewhere on that green with a lob wedge in his hand? 14 is a small green, but it a heck of a lot bigger than eight feet.

He hit a poor drive (or maybe poor judgement) tried to hit a small target, failed, and then is upset he couldn't still make par.

He wants his aggression on 14 to only be rewarded, never punished. I applaud Coore and Crenshaw even more for not conceding to this guys desires.

And remember this is guy who says that their is 30 feet from top to bottom at 5 is saying he only had an eight foot target on 14. Excuse me if I doubt his ability to judge measurements.

and then missed the next one for a five.

We don't know how long or how much break on the putt. But hard to call his missed putt a good shot from what he said. Far as I can tell the only GOOD shot he might have hit was his chip and his (guessing) tap-in. If his chip was good, wouldn't that have made the missed putt poor?

 
Dan King

My favourite shots are the practice swing and the conceded putt. The rest can never be mastered.
  --Lord Robertson

Aldous Huxley

Tom Huckaby writes:
You're preaching to the choir here.  Down, boy.

Hey, I read what you wrote. The only thing I took exception to was you saying that he thought he hit three good shots. He didn't. He got on the tee, expected to make birdie or par no matter how he hit the ball. He got overly aggressive with his flop shot despite hitting a poor tee shot and he whinned that he couldn't make par after his poorly executed or poorly judged flop shot.  

I like that in a hole. Ain't no guarantees in life and no matter how good you are No. 14 isn't a guaranteed birdie or par if you play it poorly or stupidly.

Otherwise I could have quoted the rest of your stuff and replied "I agree." If I don't, just imagine it is there.

Dan King

I can sympathize with people's pain, but not with their pleasures. There is something curiously boring about somebody else's happiness.
 --Aldous Huxley

Quote

Tom Huckaby writes:
I love #14.

I agree.

I think I can become a YaBB God in no time with these sorts of posts.

Dan King

If two men on the same job agree all the time, then one is useless. If they disagree all the time, then both are useless.
 --Darryl F. Zanuck