Shivas -

As I read your many posts, I am reminding of a running joke I have with a friend of mine from college - and it's definitely one of those, you had to be there kind of things:

I would always reference something from my childhood and say that someone say I could be "one of the best". Then I'd say "ONE of the best? ONE OF? Screw it." So I quit.

Like I said, it's definitely one of those, had to be there kind of things.

Lou, even with your addendum, I still dont get it.   Whether stroke play, match play, or relative to the competition, choosing the optimal strategy will not always result in the lowest score.   For two reasons:  less than perfect execution,  chance.   Plus even if you shoot a career score, you can never be sure whether you might have gone lower if you'd tried something else.  . .

As for CPC 16, I think you did make the correct decision.  It just didnt work out.   Had you chosen the other route, it might not have worked out either.  That is the way it goes with golf.  That is my point.  

shivas,

Much of what I stated on this thread was a bit exagerated.  
The bit about pronating was farcical.  I am happy that you have your priorities in good form.  Are you quoting Ed Getka at the end of your post?  Was he running in high altitude or playing a strange oriental instrument when he came up with it?  Alternatively, was it Mike Cirba, or maybe Max Behr?

As to the SATs, never took them, never will.  I get feedback as to my mental acuity often enough on this site that I don't need further confirmation.  I don't need a kid with a 1500 to remind me of my weaknesses.  And nowdays, everybody is whooping my ass!

Quote from: Lou_Duran on January 07, 2005, 06:02:18 PM

The bottom line to me is that thinking is only useful within the context on one's abilities.  If I can't hit it over 200 yards in the air with a high probability, going for the green on CPC #16 is not a strategic option.  Ceteris paribus, the higher the handicap, the lesser ability to control the flight of the ball (?), the fewer the options, the less thinking required.  What do you think?      

Sometimes it takes willpower (not sure if that is thinking or not) to avoid trying unrealistic options.  

I think we overestimate the lesser golfer's wildness.   Generally, higher handicappers mistakes are distance related more than direction related.  In fact here is one to chew on . . .

The average bogey golfer hits his/her drive straighter [less yards off line] than the average scratch golfer, by a substantial margin.

So, while options requiring forced carries make things very difficult, unpredictable, and/or impossible for them, bogey golfers are generally as capable (more capable?) of following alternate horizontal routes to the hole.  

Therefore they still have plenty to think about provided that the course provides for it.  

DaveM,

How much of the above stated is factual vs. opinion?

Joe

I have just spent the past 20 minutes reading all the threads, with some great opinions, from some very knowledgeable people.

At the very begining the question was  asked regarding the ability of the bogey golfer to make opinions on golf course strategy...I certainly hope so as they make up the majority of those playing the game, they are just as capable of passing judgement as the scratch player..if not more so, as they have to think their way around a golf course even more so than the guy who thinks he knows where the ball is going.

Course management is vital to reach the best score any golfer can attain.
It may be ignored as a learning experience by many club golfers, but it requires practice just as the swing requires practice to reach it's optimum level.
Course strategy is synonomous with course management there is no way you can seperate the two...a good player blends the two to produce the best score he can that day.
When I say good player, to me that means he who is able to get the most out of his game..whether that be a 66 or a 106..both can be good players by managing their respective games.
So what is strategy/course mangement?
For me that starts with managing myself and attempting to manage my mind.
The number one thing is acceptance...acceptance of your bad shots, enjoying the prospect of recovering from those less than desirable shots..and trusting that the next swing/chip or putt will not be anything but optimal.
If you cannot accept or enjoy the prospect of recovering from your bad shots, then you are not a golfer..as the nature of the game is to make mistakes, it is a game that cannot be perfected ans as such is laden with mistakes.

As simple as it sounds, the next important thing is to enjoy the game.....realise how good it is to be out on the golf course surrounded by green grass and friends.

Swing trust is an obvious key in course mangement, having the abiltiy to play with trust, is the single biggest source of on course confidence.
Trust enables you to play your best rather than playing play poorly .It is this trust that enables you to play with a feeling that outcome does not matter.....when you can get to this stage .....you can really start to play!!!!

Now you can look at the golf course and start to plan your way around with a game plan.

This game plan is where I think the better players distances himself from thr club golfer.
Probably through practice, or just because he has any plan at all..but whatever the reason, better players stick to their plan.
This does not mean that the plan is inflexible, quite the opposite, the better prepared the good player is, the more ellaborate his pre game plan will be..with options available to him to cover as many differentials as possible, such as weather conditions or the daily limitations of his own game any given day can provide.

I know that my own pre game preperation has improved drastically since I started to appreciate architecture more fully.
I think if you can think like the architect you can plan accordingly, that is not to say that I consider my knowledge of architecure to be at an architects level,but I have learned to appreciate some of the things the throw at golfers to make the course was it is.
Well now you all know how I think my way around agolf course.
Sorry if it bored the pants off you all.

Since this thread seems to be refining itself into a metaphorical discussion of Lou's tee shot to 16 CPC on THAT day, with a very tacit subtext of Dave M's pusillanimous tee shot then too, all commented on by Dave S, who was there but hardly compos mentis by that time (and whose tee shot probably killed several endangered marine species...), as the 4th of that 4-ball (and only one to hit the green and make par--pardon whilst I pat myself on the back..... ), let me say that all of this is a bunch of CRAP, and furthermore, the title of this thread, echoing Randy Newman's infamous dity of the 70's is VERY offensive to short people, of which I was one until I moved to Scotland, where everybody is subaveragely sized.......

Tommy

We all came out of Africa.  I have known for many years of my descendence from the Fugawee tribe (my ancestors used to wander through that high grass singing "We're the Fugawee!").  Where did the Pauls come from, the Wannabees or the Couddabeens or the Ustabees?

Rich:

Maybe your family came from Africa but mine came from England!  

I just found out about two years ago that the Pauls were orginal Quakers who basically came over here with William Penn and picked up a Penn land grant in and around the area that is now the Philadelphia International Airport! (a pretty poor plot if you ask me!).

In any case, I've checked the land transfers and there are some serious deficiencies. I will shortly be in touch with Philadelphia to inform them that I have a clear right to just take the airport back as my own but since I wouldn't want to be that kind of bother to my fellow Philadelphia brethern all I'll ask for and undenibly will get is a fleet of airplanes to be constantly at my disposal.

I also found out that frankly it was considered way back then a very cowardly thing to do for Quakers to leave England and that they were expected to just stick and take it. My namesake, Thomas Paul, did stick in England and took it. What he took was an axe and he lost his head!

Well, Rich, by this time I'm pretty familiar with the worth of your guesses!



Do you know what Pennsylvania means?

Actually, I'd always heard that young William Penn had become so dedicatedly disrespectful towards the King (things like refusing to get up when he came in the room or to address him properly) that they just decided to ship him off to the colonies to get the rude like urchin out of their hair since Penn's father was one of the King's closest friends and allies.

But I heard last week from an historian that William Penn actually in effect bought Pennsylvania by extinguishing a debt of the Crown's to his father.

When in the presence of that historian last week due to the fact I didn't know that Penn in effect bought Pennsylvania he  said to me; "You say you're from Pennsylvania and you didn't know that?"

So I said; "I didn't say I was FROM Pennsylvania, as actually I'm FROM New York, although I rarely go there anymore because it requires having to travel through that state of mindless houligans that Pat Mucci resides in called New Jersey!"

"I was in the process of competitive goal setting for the upcoming year."

Michael:

As you know, ODDS are everything in life. Now that you've set your goals for 2005 what're your chances of winning the US Open?

In any case, I've checked the land transfers and there are some serious deficiencies. I will shortly be in touch with Philadelphia to inform them that I have a clear right to just take the airport back as my own but since I wouldn't want to be that kind of bother to my fellow Philadelphia brethern all I'll ask for and undenibly will get is a fleet of airplanes to be constantly at my disposal.

A FLEET of airplanes?  Just how much luggage do you have anyway?

Doug:

What are you kidding? Luggage has very little to do with it. How many people are on GOLFCLUBATLAS? It looks to me like about 1500. What if I decide to take the entire population of GOLFCLUBATLAS on a world tour for a month or two free of charge playing courses all over the world? I'd say that would require about a Bakers dozen rather large airplanes, wouldn't you?