[Chip Gaskins]

After playing all three courses at Bandon several times I think the 13th green at Bandon Trails is the best green on the property (best hole is #7 at Pacific Dunes, but best green is Trials 13th)

Pic #1


Pic#2


Reasons I think its great:

1)  You can run/bounce the ball in from the front left

2)  You have a great chipping area on the back left of the green where you can putt, chip or pitch from

3)  You have a very penal deep bunker for any shot short right (or even a ball landing all the green that spins back) to collect aggressive shots

4)  You have a small shelf on the back that can collect a long shot and potentially funnel the ball back on the green

I personally hit a shot that landed several feet from the front right pin and spun back in the bunker, hit the green with my other two shots and then putted one of them in the bunker that had a tight right pin.  

Just a fun, fair, and hard green!

Thoughts?

[Jeff Doerr]

Chip,

What a tough choice to think of a best green at Bandon. I love 5, 7, 8 at PD, 13, 17 at BD, and 5, 13, 17 at BT. I could probably name another half dozen on each course...

The setting on 13 is really cool. What strikes me is how gentle and wide the approach is, and yet it strikes fear into a mid-iron approach. So often today greens have a couple bunkers in the front that challenge you to make an aerial approach, but the back of the green is pretty easy. The width on the hole is also great in combination with the design of the green. You've got a TON of room off the tee, but an approach from outside the middle is daunting. We only played this hole twice on the last trip, but I remember the strong movement in the green and remembrance of thankfulness that I did not visit the right side bunker. In the end the hole has a cape feel to it.

[Tom_Doak]

I think it's a fine green, but probably wouldn't have listed it among my 3-5 favorites on Bandon Trails ... there's a lot of competition out there.

Do any of you realize that this green is built on several feet of fill?

[Tim Bert]

I like the 13th hole and I really enjoy the approach on the hole.  At the same time, I think you also need to distinguish between green and green complex.  I think the 13th has nice surrounds and most of the features you cited support that.  At the same time, I don't remember the actual green as being one of the more notable ones on the course.

I found the 5th green, as one example, to be more interesting.

[John Kirk]

Do any of you realize that this green is built on several feet of fill?

Yes, I knew that, only because I learned it here...

on GolfClubAtlas.com

I like this green a lot, too.  An enjoyable approach shot into a secluded little corner of the course.  That bunker on the right is deep, maybe 8-10 feet.

I find it a bit hard to pick favorite greens, as I tend to think of greens in complete sets.

[Steve Kline]

Not saying it's the best green there but what I like is that the bunker is extremely scary from the fairway but all of the people I played with in the Mid-Am thought it would be better to miss in the bunker than miss left, which is not nearly as intimidating from the fairway. When you missed left the ball rolled 30 yards from the green down the hill. Everyone I saw who played from there either left their chip and run short, which rolled back down the hole, or hit over the green in the bunker. I think it's good design to be able to fool the player like that.

[Chip Gaskins]

I like the 13th hole and I really enjoy the approach on the hole.  At the same time, I think you also need to distinguish between green and green complex.  I think the 13th has nice surrounds and most of the features you cited support that.  At the same time, I don't remember the actual green as being one of the more notable ones on the course.

I found the 5th green, as one example, to be more interesting.

ok, i will agree with that.  
the 13th green at Trails itself is probably not the best green on the property.  

maybe it is the green complex i like, however it is probably the approach shot and setting i like best (see you guys have already taught me something)  

the best green complex has to be pacific dunes #7


and the best actual green bandon trail #17

[JC Jones]

Stick with your guns, Chip.  I think you made a great case for why you think it is the best green.  You are entitled to your opinion and just because Doak says that he likes others better and that the green was created from several feet of fill, doesnt mean it cant be the best green, in your opinion.

[Jeff_Mingay]

Tom D.,

I've heard - from pretty good sources - the 13th green was built on more than several feet of fill... closer to perhaps 20 ft.

[Chip Gaskins]

Tom D.,

I've heard - from pretty good sources - the 13th green was built on more than several feet of fill... closer to perhaps 20 ft.

two things:

1) honest question, does it matter if the green was built on 0, 2, or 20ft of fill?

2) i did want to clarify the three different aspects of "green" as i understand them:
- green itself (internal contours)
- green complex (inclusion of run offs, bunkers, false fronts, etc)
- approach shot (the way the green complex fits into the surroundings and strategy needed to get a ball close to the hole).  

what i started the thread to discuss was actually the approach shot and therefore i should not probably have named the thread "bandon trails 13th green".

[Joel_Stewart]

Do any of you realize that this green is built on several feet of fill?

More than that, I think Bill told me it was raised about 10 feet.

[Bill_McBride]

I think it's a fine green, but probably wouldn't have listed it among my 3-5 favorites on Bandon Trails ... there's a lot of competition out there.

Do any of you realize that this green is built on several feet of fill?

I'd love to know where that fill came from!

The lake on 11?

[Tom Huckaby]

I do think 13 BT is one hell of a green, green site, golf hole.  Love it.

BUT... I have the same question Chip does - why does it matter how much fill was used to build it?

Uh oh... this goes back to my oft-repeated question about how we should assess things.... do we assess the DESIGN of this, or how it plays?

If we are assessing how it plays, then I can't see why it matters that it was built on fill.

And I am pretty sure that's what Chip is assessing, and that's what matters to 99.9% of the people who will ever play it.

TH

[Joel_Stewart]

It doesn't matter how much fill was used but it looks so natural and is so well done that people praise it.    

The 5th green is another which is exactly the way they found it, they just cleaned it up slightly and planted the grass.

[Tim Pitner]

Why does everyone seem to love BT #5, other than it has a wildly undulating green?  Personally, I don't love the goalpost effect of the trees framing the green and thought the hole was a little out of place with the rest of the course.  I like Bandon Trails a lot, but think that #5 is overrated.  

#13 is a cool hole.  I particularly like the feature at the back of the green allowing for a long shot to come back.  

[Norbert P]

I imagine that the green complex had to be raised due to its location next to a bog (perhaps on it as well) and on the bottom of the ancient dune ridge where runoff volume could be immense. I can only assume there is conduit running under the green to keep the bog from becoming a lake on the right side.  Also, it shortens the walk to #14.  The bunker right is a necessity for recovery playability, otherwise balls would go into a lateral water hazard, which is not really a Coore thing, as far as I know*.  I've never seen a Raynor feature in the flesh but the slope from green to the bunker has that sharpness that reminds me of pictures I've seen.

* (The lake on #11 has to be there and is very affecting on the drive and approach shot psyche.)

  Great hole with plenty of fairway to come in at different angles.  Though too far right on drive may force a lay-up, it then puts emphasis on the short game.

 I love the #3 green complex at BT (and tee to green - Australia in Oregon). There's a cool, buried long-necked brontosaurus fronting left center and the right side rear collection bunker sneaks up on long shots.

Also love the 8th complex at PD.

[Norbert P]

Why does everyone seem to love BT #5  

It's suspenseful, requires touch for the proper distance to the proper tier, has a wicked little collection bunker on the right end of the swale, maintains interest throughout the putting, and fits the land wonderfully.

IMHO

[Eric Olsen]

This seems to me to be an exercise in pure subjectivity.  Are there objective elements that would define the "best" green or green complex?

Having said and asked that, and anticipating my upcoming March trip, my personal favorite (today) greens for each course would be BD 17, PD 8, and BT 17.

[Jeff_Lewis]

The big question is how did you guys get CLOUDLESS days at Bandon to play golf and take photographs??

[Chip Gaskins]

The big question is how did you guys get CLOUDLESS days at Bandon to play golf and take photographs??

Jeff-

There are a few clouds in the distance :-)







obviously we were very very lucky.  four days, 75 degrees every day with light wind in early September.

[Phil Benedict]

Chip,

Half the guys will think it was bad luck that the winds were light!  There's quite a few wind-lovers here.  As a trajectory control challenged golfer, I ain't one of them.

[Eric Olsen]

Chip,

Half the guys will think it was bad luck that the winds were light!  There's quite a few wind-lovers here.  As a trajectory control challenged golfer, I ain't one of them.

Indeed, while pleasant, particularly the light and shadows in the early morning and end of the day, monochromatic weather conditions at bandon deprive you of experiencing 4 or 5 weather conditions in one day,  like cold, rain, wind, sun clouds, repeated over the course of 8 hours or so on the courses.  

[Chip Gaskins]

Chip,

Half the guys will think it was bad luck that the winds were light!  There's quite a few wind-lovers here.  As a trajectory control challenged golfer, I ain't one of them.

Indeed, while pleasant, particularly the light and shadows in the early morning and end of the day, monochromatic weather conditions at bandon deprive you of experiencing 4 or 5 weather conditions in one day,  like cold, rain, wind, sun clouds, repeated over the course of 8 hours or so on the courses.  

I throughly enjoyed my trips to Ireland and Scotland in the grey, rainy, windy conditions....I wouldn't trade playing North Berwick in the 35 mph rainy gale force for any experience.....BUT I would be lying if I said I wouldn't rather play in 72 degrees with light wind and bright sunshine.

[Walt_Cutshall]

IMO, that is an outstanding green/green complex. It makes you REALLY think about your approach strategy--where you want the ball to end up, and how you want to get it there.

[Tags:]

Tags:

[Tags:]

Tags:

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()