Thanks for the pics that refreshed my recollection of my visit to RSR in the summer of 2005. I really enjoyed the course. So far, it's the only Norman course I've played but it is highly regarded. Nothing like hitting a 200y 5iron at my advanced age.Dining alfresco at the clubhouse was a very good experience as well.

Thats my first real look at the course since I toured it while it was under construction. Both the course and I have matured quite a bit since then, and I'm beggining to see things that I couldn't/didn't then.

Mountain golf tend to have a little more gimmicks, but after working on a mountain course this summer, I can see where routing, drainage, detention, and environmental factors play a large part in designing such a course . It seems like working parallel to the hillside makes sense in order to minimize extreme contours, but requires a lot of cut and fill.

I would classify RSR as a second home, golf destination. Its definately not the only one in the area, or the state for that matter. Must be doing pretty well from a development standpoint.

The Vail Valley in general is booming.And ,if you have ever tried to go through the Aspen historical regulations just to add on you appreciate the Vail experience even more.Kind of the Kingsbarns of ski resorts.

Man, I miss Colorado.

Cheers,
Brad

Tommy,
Is there any comparison between this course and the "new" Mountain Course at The Broadmoor? That course also tends to run parallel to the slope with only a couple of exceptions. Just curious if it is just the "look" that is similar or if it goes beyond that.

I played the Mt course a few days before Red Sky Norman.  The vertical rise at Red Sky is much greater.  The first 13 holes at Red Sky inch their way up the slope.  At Broadmoor there are numerous holes that run parallel to the slope but also many that go up or down.  The terrain at the Mt course is much different.  It is more rugged, there are more trees and bushes, and the verical rise, while substantial, is not as great. The routing at the Mt course may have been more difficult because of the many rock outcroppings.  In many ways it is the more interesting site.    

Tommy

Thanks for posting.  The more I get to see of these mountain courses the less appealing they become.  This one is a real shocker with the awful looking bunkering - completely ott.  At some point people have to recognize that these mountainous areas are god's country and treat them accordingly.  

Ciao  

Tommy W:

Good pictures on RKR / Norman.

I have played a good bit in Colorado and have to say the Norman course is one of the really top tier public courses you can play in the state -- the tariff isn't cheap (believe it's $240 during the summer months).

Regarding the bunkering -- many of them do in fact come into play and you need to be aware onjust how deep the bunkers can be in certain spots. To Norman's credit -- the land does breathe a good bit more than the photos would indicate.

There's enough flexibility and playability thrown into the picture so those who are higher handicaps can play the course without any really forced carried of a Herculean sort.

Norman also incorporated plenty of greens where the slopes will carry balls off them if they aim a bit too wide with the approaches. I like this thinking rather than going with the overkill with rough and the like.

No doubt the terrain is challening but the good part is that you don't have the heavy slogs seen at other Colorado courses where you go straight uphill -- see the 18th at Sanctuary as one clear example.

Unfortunately, mountain courses often get panned by the "thumb your noses" types here on GCA who only prefer classic courses set in certain locations. Red Sky Ranch is a very challenging, fun and well crafted course. Those who venture to Wolcott can also easily head over to New Castle and play Lakota Canyon Ranch for a superb double-header indeed.

Sean:

Always enjoy people barking about courses but never having them played. Nothing like really solid analysis from a direct first hand connection.

Tommy,

Were you able to take in Lakota Canyon on your trip as well?  I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on how those two compare...

Tommy W:

No doubt tastes in golf design will vary -- the issue is that certain people have narrow tastes buds and only prefer certain courses designed by certain people.

The work by Norman at Red Sky Ranch and Engh at Lakota Canyon Ranch is quite unique and certainly fun IMHO.

Clearly, mountain golf may not suit people but I will say this --Colorado golf has certainly elevated itself greatly with the two of these designs. Norman's effort at Red Sky Ranch is not awesome in its originality but the playing dimensions and the overall routing and diversity of holes is quite solid.

Most people need to realize that in going to Red Sky Ranch you need to avoid the TF layout and stick to the Norman.

Tim:

I like what Lehman and company did at Raven at Three Peaks -- it's just that Silverthorne has such a short golf season. I think the back nine there is quite good -- very good in fact.

Breckenridge, Keystone Ranch & River are roughly the same in terms of their overall appeal for me. The sad part is that public golf is likely not a viable option for golf in such a high altitude and it's doubtful that many quality layouts will take on such a situation unless they are connected to a ski facility for 365-year-round cash flow.

I like the Palmer Course in Eagle -- can't think of the name off the top of my head but it's no where near the likes of Norman's effort at RSR.

RSR has plenty of design features that Norman has borrowed from his previous works and he's blessed with a site that is clearly an eye-ful from just about any location on the course. As good as I like Lakota Canyon Ranch -- Norman's RSR may be the best available public course off I-70 west of the immediate Denver area.

Since you have a great familiarity with the golf in the state be curious to know how you see things.

...
The tee shot on #4 gives you an idea of the terraced nature of the land.  Most holes run parallel to the slope not up and down.


I think is #7.  It shows the green side bunkering.  


...

Probably overbunkered?  

Looks like an unimaginative mess to Sean Arble.  

EDIT: I posted this before I saw Sean's response. You can now attribute unimaginative mess to me.
 

PS Do I use smileys too much?

Having played a hanful of courses in the Colorado Mountains, my favorite is Grand Elk. There are some pretty good holes out there and exemplifies the valley-style mountain golf. The greens and green surrounds were wonderfully contoured and very firm, without the cranked up speeds that other courses I've played try to achieve (see: Cordillera). A personal favorite was the valley in the back-center portion of the 9th green, creating a "horseshoe" effect. The high aim of the course to create a heathland golf course still confuses me, though. But I've never played a true heathland course so...

And I've heard that the course down the road, even if its still under construction, isn't too shabby either