George:

I'm getting worse How do my views fit in?

I think my first offical handicap was 12, but I was pretty wild then, left/right/left. So I was probably a 16 from tee to green, but always good around the greens except for sand traps.

One summer, I grabbed Gary Players book and stayed in the sand trap for about 30 days, maybe an hour or more a day. To this day, it is the very best part of my game and I love sand traps in every shape, size and form.

I perferred courses with some forgiveness off the tee and hated tree lined courses, my dislike for Medinah #3 comes from not being able to play it.

As I got older, I learnt to hit the ball right to left and now I have no trouble hitting fairways except for the ones that have trees overhanging the right side of the fairway.

I could never really bomb it, my drives go 235 in the air+ whatever bounce I get on the ground, so par 5's for me are really mostly lay up holes to 100 yards and I sand wedge in.

Also as I got older, I learnt to move the ball high, low, cuts, draws, or I have a whole repitoire of shots.

My experience of going to Scotland/Ireland 3 times game me a new understanding for the ground game and I use it where appropriate if I find the ground hard enuf.

My sand game also improved when I learnt to hit from all types of sand and lies, and not just the perfect ones. I always walk into a trap with 2 wedges, 56 and 60 and make my decisions after I feel the sand with my feet.

I must have 5 or 8 different variations of sand shots and sand wedge shots around the green, so I am pretty creative.

My preference in golf courses comes in all different varieties, from the Old Course at St. Andrews to the mountain courses with lots of evelation changes and eye candy.

I don't care for the very subtle, I like bigger movements in the land forms and I don't like repetition, something I see alot today by Rees Jones and others.

If I'm bored on the back 9, it because I saw all those same traps and stuff on the front 9.

I've lost 1 club in length with my irons, so I've gone to hybrids, they are so easy to hit, ditto with todays drivers, I'm longer and much more accurate today than probably anytime.

I'm always around a 5 handicap and most of my scores are in a pretty tight range.

George,

Anyone who has played with me the past year or two can readily attest to the fact that if I'm not a high-handicapper already, I'm certainly headed that way.    

The funny thing is that I have way more fun playing golf these days than I did when I was a 2.3 index around age 32.

George - neat question.
I'm still not very good, but my very high-handicap days are not that far behind me, as I took up golf with any kind of intent only about 7 years ago. I can only speak for myself, of course, but my experience as a HH is that - whether I was playing an old course or a new one - I only interfaced with the architecture in the barest/most minimal way, and didn't even realize that that was what I was doing.

I do remember, however, how excited I got when I saw that a green was open in front, so that a topped shot might still have a chance to dribble up there and give me a chance at one-putting for a double bogie.

Peter  

By Gary Player's logic Tiger should be a great architect too since he was a high handicapper when he started grade school!

 
Hi George.. how's the family life?  Thought your Oakmont stuff was great!  When are you returning to Black Mesa, we're looking at this Sept..?

HH Life:
Locations: Ohio (NW & SW)

Occupations: kid, college student, young professional

Amount of play: kid = 2-3 x/wk during summer 1/mo rest of year, UC student (1/3wks), YUP (1/wk Apr-Oct) with one week of 2-3x/d blitz in southern Pines,NC, since 1980)

Clubs: first were mom's, used when 9-13 years old, first own set Chick Hebert McGregors age 13,.. college - heavy Haig Ultras found in garage sale for $25.. mostly homemade since 1979 in some fashion,

HH to LH to HH Life?
Older professional (..40 yrs old).. Move to TX.. play 130 x/yr from 17 index to a 5 by 41 yrs old..

clubs :first  graphite shafts in irons 1992, first custom fit in 1994 (used titleist dci's), through the TM Burner series woods.. back to steel in irons with rifle shafts 2002, cavity and forged mixed bag 2003,  everything custom fitted, always.. back to tinkering..with shaft puller 2004, fully on the dark side of tech, first mizunos 2005 ,.. confirmed techie with purchase of freq.monitor in 2006.. what's your cpm??  don't you have a spine?

last 3 years.. i don't keep score anymore, officially now a TX12 index.. all strokes are negotiable, the wind is not.. broke 80 twice last month.. but, i normally have too much fun to grind anymore.. or is it the curse of gca vs course management

so I'm coming full circle, eating my tail.. if i could just loose 75 lbs.. i.e., the belly, I could make a full turn again.. and wouldn't be a HH for another 10 yrs with current tech stuff..

The thing I miss about being a high handicapper are the early tee times on Sunday during tournaments and worrying about getting a stiffy when called to the black board.  This having to wait to tee off until three o'clock on a Sunday afternoon with nothing to play with is almost enough to make me give up tournament golf.

I have a simple definition. High 20+, mid 10-20, low under 10.

I really don't understand Player's comment. Jack Nicklaus was routinely breaking par at age 12, and qualified for his first U.S. Amateur at age 14. What the hell would he know -- or remember-- about being a high handicapper?

Garland's definition is about what I generally think.

Based on that, I can't say that I have ever been a high handicapper. I'm currently a 15 at age 59, and that's about as high as I ever was.

From my teens to late 30s I was in the 9 to 12 range, and then had a run from age 40 to 57 where I was a 5 to 10.

But lately I've played with a bunch of guys who are nearly all 20+.

It's been interesting to watch them negotiate, or not negotiate, the course.

About half of them hit the ball better than I do, and then throw away strokes around the green like crazy.

Sat. morning, on four separate occasions someone with a realtively simple pitch from 10 yards off the green dumped it in a bunker.

The way they "interface with the architecture" is SO different from the way good players do, I cannot imagine how an elitre level player could understand it without lots of study.

One thing that stand out, however. The thick rough we currently have due to a wet summer is death to the 20 handicapper. The problem is that when he hits a drive into it, he's faced with a really long shot, and cannot bring himself to hit a short iron.

So he pulls out a wood or long iron and hits it 50 yards.

And greenside bunkers are almost an automatic dropped shot, sometimes 2 or 3.

K

I don't care if a golf course archie/designer is a low handi or high or ever has been high.  I care about how much effort they make to play with and observe all levels of players.

Sure, JWN plays or has played as many pro-ams during tournament weeks as anyone, and more than his share of corporate outtings.  But, the question for me becomes; is he really interested and observing the playing characteristics of the higher handicappers, or disinterested and just focused on what he has to do as an obligation?  

Without question, many of us on GCA.com have formed friendships with archies around the country who participate here, AND PLAY WITH US.  This says much about their interest and ability to observe and participate in the game from all levels.  Some archies are so busy with their business, they don't really take time to know their customers, IMHO.  

Huck, one of my buddies started playing 1 month before me, and while he may have technically been a high handicapper, he was shooting in the 80s within a couple months, not playing all that frequently. I'd guess Jack wasn't much different.

-----

Everyone -

Let's set aside beginners, and compare golfers who generally shoot around 100 to those who shoot 85 or better.

Where do you think most strokes are lost for the 100 guy (call him George if you'd like )?

Where do you think most enjoyment is lost? Found?

George,

I played with two friends this weekend and neither one broke 100.  I can't say I noticed a general pattern to where they lost strokes.  They were just generally inconsitent with every shot.  They would par one hole and take a triple bogey on thier next 3-4.

Tee shots, iron shots, chips, and putts all just very erratic.  I don't really think they thought about "interfacing" with the architecture.  Most of the time they were just trying to keep it in play and out of trouble.  That being said it was interesting to observe as they didnt make any club adjustments for the wind which was about a 1-1.5 club wind all day long.