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Bob Jenkins

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Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« on: February 14, 2007, 12:39:33 AM »

This may be depressing but I am sure many of you have found or seen locations that would be ideal for a golf course you would love to design or have a hand in designing but for one reason or another, that would never happen.

For me, the place that stands out the most are the sand dunes on the north side of Prince Edward Island. These are incredibly wild and open dunes near the town of Cavendish [or is it North Cavendish?], which are now part of a Canadian National Park. Not far away is Green Gables Golf Club which is by Stanley Thompson but it just barely gets into the dunes and has been changed considerably, as I understand it, since the original design.

The Links at Crowbush Cove only touch into those dunes but still result in a good course.

I would think an architect would go to great lengths to work on land like that. I would post photos of it if I knew how. Jordan, if you are out there, please send me an email to tell me how to post photos.

Any other spots?

Anyway, I am sure there are ideal spots where you architects would love to work, but perhaps cannot.

cary lichtenstein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2007, 12:41:18 AM »
We saw great dunes towards the tip of Cape Cod
Live Jupiter, Fl, was  4 handicap, played top 100 US, top 75 World. Great memories, no longer play, 4 back surgeries. I don't miss a lot of things about golf, life is simpler with out it. I miss my 60 degree wedge shots, don't miss nasty weather, icing, back spasms. Last course I played was Augusta

Mark Hissey

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2007, 01:10:44 AM »
Cow Neck for sure.

Probably Gardiners Island.

Michael Robin

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Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2007, 01:37:10 AM »
How about the great seaside dunes at Fort Ord, or the amazing property that was threaded late last year just north of Santa Barbara around Gaviota.

Peter Galea

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2007, 02:03:10 AM »
Gazos Creek, on the coast between Santa Cruz and Half Moon Bay.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2007, 08:51:32 AM by Peter Galea »
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Eric Franzen

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Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2007, 02:58:13 AM »
A colleague/friend of mine who sadly passed away a couple of months ago did this drawing of a fictious hole on the site next to Gullane No. 1.

It looks like a quite decent location.



I also agree with Michael Robin about the dunes at Fort Ord. It is impossible to drive by there without thinking of building a course there.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2007, 02:58:25 AM by Eric Franzen »

Joshua Pettit

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Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2007, 03:38:29 AM »
I can’t remember specifically, as I have only been through the area once, but Mike DeVries pointed out to me a few areas along the eastern shore of Lake Michigan that consisted of very interesting dunes, and could be utilized as great golfing terrain.  I’m not sure what bureaucracy has the jurisdiction over this land, but I would presume there must be something similar to the California Coastal Commission that would prevent any such land from being developed.  This is the same reason that most of these other sites mentioned will never be developed for recreational (golf) use.  
"The greatest and fairest of things are done by nature, and the lesser by art."

Jeff Doerr

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2007, 09:31:32 AM »
You stand on the 17th tee at Bandon Dunes and look south...
"And so," (concluded the Oldest Member), "you see that golf can be of
the greatest practical assistance to a man in Life's struggle.”

David Stamm

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2007, 10:14:08 AM »
How about the great seaside dunes at Fort Ord, or the amazing property that was threaded late last year just north of Santa Barbara around Gaviota.

Michael, you beat me to it! I'm in total agreement on both counts. In addition, every time I drive through the Santa Ynez Valley I see spots here and there that make me imagine what could be. And how about Camp Pendelton? I'm sure there is a reason Shackelford picked that area for a setting in his novel, The Good Doctor Returns. Lots of good spots I've noticed through out the base.
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2007, 10:15:10 AM »
the dunes at balmedie beach near aberdeen... trump is building his development there... whether it will be able to be classed a "golf course" is another matter  ;)

rjsimper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2007, 10:42:22 AM »
Lunada Bay on the Palos Verdes Peninsula - Coastal Cliffs with some character, inlets, bluffs, etc, and a broad expanse of meadow land.

Matt_Cohn

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Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2007, 11:43:53 AM »

Kalen Braley

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Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2007, 12:03:11 PM »
I don't know how available or unavailable this land is, but there is some amazing dunesland along Hwy 1 between Rockport and Point Arena in Northern California.

I'm not sure if its military owned, private, or apart of the park system, but there are some remote stretches of jaw dropping land right on the ocean.

If this land were to become available, how is the permitting in CA?  Is it even in the realm of doable.  As Mike Keiser had a long fight in Bandon, would Nor Cal be any easier or tougher?

« Last Edit: February 14, 2007, 12:04:24 PM by Kalen Braley »

Dan_Callahan

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2007, 12:13:17 PM »
How about this:



You've got more than 800 acres to work with and a few natural water hazards. With a little tree thinning, could be cool. And lots of area accomodations to host a PGA event.

Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2007, 12:18:00 PM »
Even better yet this:

With the natural undulation of the land in Golden Gate park,  the old mature Cypress trees, and a somehwat naturally sandy base, you could build a course to rival Olympic and SFGC.

« Last Edit: February 14, 2007, 12:18:43 PM by Kalen Braley »

Steve Burrows

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Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2007, 12:19:55 PM »
How about this:



You've got more than 800 acres to work with and a few natural water hazards. With a little tree thinning, could be cool. And lots of area accomodations to host a PGA event.

Tiger Woods Golf on the Playstation, XBox, etc., and the game Golden Tee (which you will find at many sports bars), use Central Park as a sight for fictitious courses, and I'd say that both fake games show some intriguing possibilities of golf in the park.
...to admit my mistakes most frankly, or to say simply what I believe to be necessary for the defense of what I have written, without introducing the explanation of any new matter so as to avoid engaging myself in endless discussion from one topic to another.     
               -Rene Descartes

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2007, 12:22:06 PM »
Pete Galea's mention of the dunesland on the San Mateo County (CA) coastline near Gazos Creek is right on. It is part of a state park and not far from the Anjo Nuevo protected wild-life area, so nothing will ever happen there golf course-wise. Still, it is a nice spot to get out of your car, walk around and route your own golf course.

Steve Lapper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2007, 12:31:55 PM »
Downtown East Hampton!
Mar-a-Lago!
USGA Headquarters, Far Hills

Too bad...all would see a major improvement!
« Last Edit: February 14, 2007, 12:33:51 PM by Steve Lapper »
The conventional view serves to protect us from the painful job of thinking."--John Kenneth Galbraith

Daryl David

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2007, 12:45:35 PM »
Almost half of Eastern Washington.  Between the scablands and the palouse.  Not sure what the soil composition is, but it sure looks a lot like the Nebraska and Eastern Colorado as far as hills and dunes.  Probably never see a course due to lack of population and value of land for wheat.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2007, 12:50:07 PM by Daryl David »

Voytek Wilczak

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2007, 12:50:22 PM »
Probably Gardiners Island.

I wouldn't give up on Gardiner's Island.

Times change.

How about Governor's Island though?

A perfect 160 acres that ain't gonna happen...

Mike Benham

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2007, 01:01:22 PM »
What's the place near Vandenburg or Santa Barbara County?  Hollister Ranch ...
"... and I liked the guy ..."

Ulrich Mayring

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2007, 06:18:24 PM »
Anyone willing to put his money into this project?

Ulrich



Golf Course Exposé (300+ courses reviewed), Golf CV (how I keep track of 'em)

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2007, 07:28:26 PM »
Mashomack Wildlife preserve, Shelter Island
2100 acres-10 miles of coastline
Beautiful sandy bluffs,pitch pines, beautiful oaks.
My routing hugs the coast for 17 holes after playing accross on the first
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2007, 08:18:56 PM »
Personally, I'm not giving up on any of them.  Even the one in Iran.

Ulrich:  How much money?  And can I fly there in less than 12 hours from Michigan?

jeffwarne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Great locations that will never see a golf course.
« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2007, 08:55:35 PM »
Does anyone know of a deal where a nature preserve was logically convinced to allow a golf course (as low enviroment impact as possible)under the arguement of providing recreation for thousands of humans while still preserving the 16 piping plovers (or whatever) that are currently in residence?
While still preserving the public's right to hike and enjoy such a property,of course.

In my example you'd be impacting less than 10% of the property (and only about a third of that would be maintained)

Could a land preservation swap be arranged?
10000 acres of upstate New York land for 150?
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey