[Steve Hyden]

I am playing a member guest at the Standard Club in Atlanta next month.  The tournament winds up on Saturday and it's been proposed that Sunday we play Currahee.  I know Cuscowilla has been very well received on this site, so I would appreciate any recommendations regarding the two.  The other usual suspects in Atlanta are probably out due either to expense or not being available on a Sunday.  Thanks, all.

[John Kavanaugh]

As someone who didn't "get" Cuscowilla I have to tell you to run and go play it..If you can the deal of staying on site with golf included is one of the great resort deals in the country in that the golf is free..At few courses will you learn more about the averageness of greatness than at Cuscowilla...but it is one hell of a deal from an intellectual point of view.

[Jason Blasberg]

At few courses will you learn more about the averageness of greatness than at Cuscowilla...but it is one hell of a deal from an intellectual point of view.

JK:

Do you have someone writing this stuff for you?  The "averageness of greatness?"

I hereby dub thee "Oxymoron Jaka B.!"
 
Jason

[John Kavanaugh]

Jason,

Thanks for going easy on me my friend...I know you got more Homer in you than Marge Simpson..

[Jason Blasberg]

That's one of the funniest things you've ever said John.

 

[John_Conley]

Tommy:

I have not seen Currahee.  As for Cuscowilla, I love it.  I drove from Macon to Orlando on the way home thinking, "how do I join this course 7 hours from my house?"  Solid from start to finish on a good site.

Doug Sobieski posts here sporadically.  He called me prior to his trip and asked about Reynolds, Oconee, and the other area courses.  I suggested he shed some of those rounds and play Cusco a multiple of times.  He couldn't, as he wasn't in control of the group's plans.

His e-mail to me after the visit?  "How could anyone not love Cuscowilla!" and he proceeded to list all of its attributes.  It has a nice mix of par 3s, a great variety of par 4s, and defends scoring pretty well by virture of its par 70.  Playable, yet resistant to scoring.

My fondness for Cuscowilla - where I have only played one round - has a lot to do with my interest in joining Sugarloaf Mountain when it opens.  I've seen four C&C courses and liked this a great deal more than Chechessee, and that's a real special place.

You will be underwhelmed by Cusco, as some people have been, if you are expecting glitz.  It is pretty understated.  Just pure, unadulterated, solid golf.

Enjoy it if you get there.

[Anthony_Nysse]

Tommy,
  The following link is my opinion of Cuscowilla along with many comments....enjoy!

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forums2/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=21825;start=0

Tony Nysse
Sr. Asst. Supt.
Long Cove Club
HHI, SC

[A.G._Crockett]

I disagreed with Tony on that thread, though I did not post, and I still do.  I think Cuscowilla is a modern classic, and will be more and more appreciated as the years pass.

However, I know that the merit of Cuscowilla isn't exactly what you are asking.  I haven't played Currahee, but from the standpoint of seeing a course that so many rate so highly for yourself, it is an easy choice.

Go to Cuscowilla and take a pass on Currahee.

[John_Cullum]

I have played Currahee once and Cuscowilla a dozen or so times.

I call golf at Currahee mountain golf without the mountains. At least when I play somewhere in the blue ridge mountains I get cooler temps and rhododendrens and streams to make up for the mediocre golf. At Curahee you'll just get the hills and lost balls if you miss a fairway.

Coscowilla is probably a bit overrated by many on here, but its a very good golf course.

I don't know why you feel these are your only options.

[Tom_Doak]

Sorry to be ignorant but I know little to nothing about Currahee -- and so far no one has really said much about it.  Who built it and when and where?

[Jason Blasberg]

Coscowilla is probably a bit overrated by many on here, but its a very good golf course.

John:

Cuscowilla is the most under-rated course in the Country built in the last 50 years.

Jason, call me "Homer," Simpson

Seriously, it is.    

[Andy Doyle]

Sorry to be ignorant but I know little to nothing about Currahee -- and so far no one has really said much about it.  Who built it and when and where?

http://www.curraheeclub.com/

Jim Fazio
2005 (?)
Toccoa, GA

Named after the mountain training site of the 101st Airborne made famous by the book and movies series "Band of Brothers."

[Tom_Doak]

Andy:

Thanks for the link.  There are so many developers nowadays whose goals are to promote families, instead of to sell lots for way more than they are worth, it's really heartening.

I was particularly interested to see Jim Fazio identify the 17th as the best hole he's ever built ... a par 3 which measures everywhere from 251 yards down to 85!

[JohnV]

Andy,

Do you think anyone proof read those hole descriptions?

He says he thinks #6 will be the best hole, then he says that #17 is the best hole he's ever built.  Much of it must have been written before the course was built as the yardages are different than what is shown.  On top of that, there are lots of tyops.  It looks like Rhic wrote it.

I'm assuming that it isn't a typo that almost every hole goes downhill.

If someone would just build a course where every hole went uphill, it wouldn't have to be 7500 yards long from the tips.

[Gary Daughters]

Having played Cuscowilla but once I came away disappointed.  The opening nine was stellar and the inward nine inexplicably forgettable.  Maybe that's why Cuscowilla provokes so much for and against.  It's almost like two different courses.

Tommy,

If you'd like to try something different let me suggest Crystal Lake, the recent Denis Griffiths design south of Atlanta.  The routing is compromised by the housing, but other than that it is electric.  

[BCrosby]

Cuscowilla is one of the best courses built in the last several decades, in the same league as Sand Hills and the second best course in Georgia.

Currahee is a nice course, reasonably priced and fun to play. If you are in the area, Cateechee may be a better choice.

Bob

[Brad Swanson]

Cuscowilla is one of the best courses built in the last several decades, in the same league as Sand Hills and the second best course in Georgia.

Currahee is a nice course, reasonably priced and fun to play. If you are in the area, Cateechee may be a better choice.

Bob

Bob,
   I wish I had a chance to play with you at the Inagural Dixie Cup so you could've substantiated the Sand Hills vs Cuscowilla comparison to me.  Sand Hills is head and shoulders above Cuscowilla IMHO.  I liked Cuscowilla, don't get me wrong, but it had some significant shortcomings in my opinion compared to the nearly bulletproof Sand Hills.  A couple of my biggest gripes at Cuscowilla is that 1/2 (1 of 2) of the par 5s are sub-standard for C&C (especially compared to the 3 par 5s at Sand Hills) and the overall lackluster back 9 save the fun (but flawed) 11th and the 12th.  Cuscowilla is definitely a very good golf course, but I don't think it compares well with Sand Hills.

Cheers,
Brad Swanson

[BCrosby]

Brad -

I too wish we could have played together.

SH wears a bullet proof jacket around here. It's a great course. But it's not bullet proof. SH was an early course for C&C. Though built on what may be one of the best venues in the world, it's not perfect.

The front nine ends with three straight par 4's with wedge approaches. The 8th and 9th tees have remarkably similar looks and strategies and the holes are of very similar lengths. Very different greens, of course.

The 1st, 16th and 18th tees have remarkably similar looks and driving strategies.

I don't understand the 1st. Is that a green that really tempts people to go for with a fw wood or long iron?

The 13th is more hard than interesting.

The 14th is good par 5, but somewhere this side of world class.

Cuscowilla is not bullet proof either. I will disagree with your views of its par 5's, however. Especially the 2nd, a wonderfully tilted, deceptive, reachable hole. The 14th is, simply, a brute.

The backside has a strong set of par 4's. There are no bunkers on the 13th and it may be the most interesting hole on the course. What's not to like about the 15th? I could play the 12th 18 times and my scores might range from a 2 to a 7, all without any water hazard.

SH does not have a long par 3 as good a the 8th at Cusco. The short 11th at Cusco is no less a full sphincter lockdown than the 17th at SH. Not as pretty, of course, but a very good hole.

Certainly the SH experience is like no other. The venue is transcendental. It is a great course that points architecture in all the right directions. But it is not so good nor is Cusco so lacking that they doesn't belong in the same family.

Bob

[Brad Swanson]

Brad -

I too wish we could have played together.

SH wears a bullet proof jacket around here. It's a great course. But it's not bullet proof. SH was an early course for C&C. Though built on what may be one of the best venues in the world, it's not perfect.

The front nine ends with three straight par 4's with wedge approaches. The 8th and 9th tees have remarkably similar looks and strategies and the holes are of very similar lengths. Very different greens, of course.

Bob, I'm not a short knocker by any stretch, but I hit a knockdown 6 iron approach into 9 at Sand Hills during one of my rounds.  Comparing 7 with 8 and 9 is not apples to apples IMHO with regards to wedge approaches.  Under the wind conditions I experienced, I bounced my tee shot onto (and then off of) the green from the tee with a 3 wood on 7, and hit a knockdown 6 iron approach into 9.  Those holes hardly played the same the day I played

The 1st, 16th and 18th tees have remarkably similar looks and driving strategies.

I can understand this point to some degree (although I would say that 18 is an uphill shot vs the other 2 being significantly downhill).  I have thought that one weakness of SH is the tendance to favor a right to left tee shot.

I don't understand the 1st. Is that a green that really tempts people to go for with a fw wood or long iron?

The 13th is more hard than interesting.
Again, I can agree with this, but is it necessarily a bad thing?

The 14th is good par 5, but somewhere this side of world class.
We disagree here.  A reachable par 5 with the tiny green that requires precision no matter your angle of approach, although a pitch from the left is favored.  I think its placement in the routing is genious considering its the first par 5 since the first hole, and a player trying to make up a shot may try to press a little too hard to get one back (speaking from experience).

Cuscowilla is not bullet proof either. I will disagree with your views of its par 5's, however. Especially the 2nd, a wonderfully tilted, deceptive, reachable hole.
Agreed!
The 14th is, simply, a brute.
The 14th is really not up to the quality of the other C&C par 5s I've played.  It features a similar routing flow/benefit in that its the first par 5 since 2, but its too tough to offer an exciting eagle attempt like #14 at SH.
 
The backside has a strong set of par 4's. There are no bunkers on the 13th and it may be the most interesting hole on the course. What's not to like about the 15th? I could play the 12th 18 times and my scores might range from a 2 to a 7, all without any water hazard.

To me the 10th is a carbon copy of the 4th.  The 11th is fun, but could be improved with a chainsaw to the pines behind the green.  The 12th is a fun short par 4.  From there, I don't find anything terrifically memorable (in a positive way, I really don't like 14).

SH does not have a long par 3 as good a the 8th at Cusco.

The 13th at SH is a monster from the diamond tees, and the equal or more than the 8th at Cuscowilla in a different way.

The short 11th at Cusco is no less a full sphincter lockdown than the 17th at SH.  Not as pretty, of course, but a very good hole.
Agreed!

Certainly the SH experience is like no other. The venue is transcendental. It is a great course that points architecture in all the right directions. But it is not so good nor is Cusco so lacking that they doesn't belong in the same family.

Bob

Glad to have this discussion Bob.


Cheers,
Brad

[Mike Hendren]

Bob,

I would be in the camp that believes Cuscowilla is ever-so-slightly overrated.  That said, your post #17 above is exemplary and should serve as a model for all of us.  It made me think.

Thanks,

Mike

[BCrosby]

Bogey -

I'm of the opinion that Cusco is under-rated. I think it represents a more mature design from C&C, coming as it did about 5 years after SH. It's a less spectacular setting than SH, doesn't have the ambience (the brats, the majestic dunes for as far as the eye can see, the intimate bar and the spendid isolation). Like Mozart operas, Cusco is an acquired taste. It doesn't grab you by the lapels and say look at me.

The bones of Cusco, may I be so bold, are every bit as good as SH's. Both have their reptitive features, both have other issues, but the best holes at Cusco (1,4,5,8,12,13, 15) hold up well against the best holes at SH.

Brad -

Good comments. I would love to fuss with you over a beer at either course.  

Bob

[Derek_Duncan]

Count me in the "I Heart Cuscowilla" camp. I'm in love with the opening six holes and the arena of 15-17 is one of my favorite three-hole settings anywhere. I can't imagine a better balance of short (1, 5, 12) and long (6, 9, 13, 18) par-fours, and just about every hole demands that you really try to work your tee ball one way or another.

That said, it's not quite in Sand Hills's league, although I wouldn't call the latter bulletproof (too many uphill approach shots to blind putting surfaces?). A more interesting debate to me is Cuscowilla vs. Wild Horse.

Currahee looks like fun, one-time golf. I hope to try it out soon.

[Doug Sobieski]

SH wears a bullet proof jacket around here. It's a great course. But it's not bullet proof. SH was an early course for C&C. Though built on what may be one of the best venues in the world, it's not perfect.

The front nine ends with three straight par 4's with wedge approaches. The 8th and 9th tees have remarkably similar looks and strategies and the holes are of very similar lengths. Very different greens, of course.



Certainly the SH experience is like no other. The venue is transcendental. It is a great course that points architecture in all the right directions. But it is not so good nor is Cusco so lacking that they doesn't belong in the same family.

Bob

Bob:

Count me as firmly in your camp!! I wholeheartedly agree that SH is not bulletproof for many of your reasons. I am also regularly amazed when people tell me they don't "get" Cuscowilla. When Cuscowilla was #9 on Golfweek's Modern list, I didn't think it was that out of place at all.

Regarding the finish on the front at SH, one of my buddies drove them all in the same round, with the same wind.... 7 with the hole playing as long as the tees, wind and flagstick would allow (hit it 10 feet past the hole, into a couple club wind, with the pin 15 feet from the back edge), 8 (with a 3-wood), and 9. All three of them were from the back tees.

While typing this I saw Derek's post. Very similar views to mine. But I'd rather play Wild Horse again before Sand Hills.

[Tim Copeland]

I live in a town across the lake from Currahee....is it worth a look the next time I am home??(I build courses and am on the road a bunch)

[Jason Blasberg]

A couple of my biggest gripes at Cuscowilla is that 1/2 (1 of 2) of the par 5s are sub-standard for C&C (especially compared to the 3 par 5s at Sand Hills) and the overall lackluster back 9 save the fun (but flawed) 11th and the 12th.  

brad

what are the shortcomings of 11?  and what wants luster on the back ?  

cheers,

jason

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