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rjsimper

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Best use of ONE tree
« on: June 12, 2006, 10:18:19 AM »
What is the greatest strategic use of a SINGLE tree in architecture, and why?
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tlavin

Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2006, 12:06:08 PM »
A better thread might be:  "Which single tree removal most beneficially helped a great golf hole?"
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rjsimper

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2006, 12:38:55 PM »
Not in my book - I played a course last week where this would apply (and got me thinking about the topic) - the 6th hole at Hunter Ranch in Paso Robles which has a big tree (sorry, not an expert in tree species) right in the center of the fairway about 225 out from the green on the par 5.  This tree, coupled with the funnel nature of the fairway, is pretty darn bad.

Then in reading the Taconic restoration thread, I got to thinking how important the enormous trees protecting the right side of the hole on the par 4 4th were to the strategy of the hole, and how any tree removal program targeting these would be a HUGE mistake.  

So then, in thinking about holes like 18 at Pebble, 17 at Cypress, 17 at ANGC, and others of that ilk, I'm wondering who got the best balance out of a single tree and it's affect on the strategy of a hole, because so often it can easily go wrong.

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PThomas

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2006, 01:05:13 PM »
unter der linden tree at the hole of the same name at Blackwolf Run River....guards the left side of the green BIG time so one must go over or around
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Steve_Lovett

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2006, 01:06:39 PM »
TPC Sawgrass - Hole 16 - Live Oak at left side of fairway short of green.
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Bob_Huntley

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2006, 01:27:43 PM »
I am not sure it is the greatest but Mike Strantz' use of the small cypress at the corner of the dog-leg 15th of the Shore, certainly makes for some interesting shot selections.

Bob
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Mike Benham

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2006, 02:09:36 PM »
The incomparable Leland Stanford Jr. Golf Course, 12th hole ...
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Andy Troeger

Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2006, 08:29:41 PM »
In addition to #16 mentioned previously, the tree on the dogleg of #11 at Blackwolf Run also comes to mind.
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Tommy_Naccarato

Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2006, 08:46:15 PM »
Brian Curley's Goose Creek #13. It just simply works.
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ChipOat

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2006, 10:14:56 AM »
Sorry guys, I can't buy in on this.

Trees that effect the line of play from either the fairway or with 150+ yards of a tee box are like "bunkers in the sky" - I hate them.

I call them Stupid Trees.  The most egregious examples are on the 18th hole at Pebble, I'm afraid.
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mike_malone

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2006, 10:18:59 AM »
 There is lone tree on #15 (?) at Bulle Rock . It gets into your head on the second shot. It sits next to a crossing creek which also makes you fearful that if you hit it you end up in the water.
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Steve Curry

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2006, 10:20:11 AM »
Burning in a clubhouse fireplace on a crisp fall afternoon!

Steve
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Gene Greco

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2006, 10:22:49 AM »
Quote from: chipoat on June 13, 2006, 10:14:56 AM
Sorry guys, I can't buy in on this.

Trees that effect the line of play from either the fairway or with 150+ yards of a tee box are like "bunkers in the sky" - I hate them.

I call them Stupid Trees.  The most egregious examples are on the 18th hole at Pebble, I'm afraid.

I agree wholeheartedly. However, I believe the most egregious example would be at Stanford's par 4 12th(?) which I plyed in April.

If someone on here has a copy of the Stanford scorecard and can post it I'm sure this will ring true for those who haven't seen it.
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PThomas

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2006, 10:26:29 AM »
Quote from: chipoat on June 13, 2006, 10:14:56 AM
Sorry guys, I can't buy in on this.

Trees that effect the line of play from either the fairway or with 150+ yards of a tee box are like "bunkers in the sky" - I hate them.

I call them Stupid Trees.  The most egregious examples are on the 18th hole at Pebble, I'm afraid.

I disagree

hit around them!
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Garland Bayley

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2006, 10:52:41 AM »
Played a new course yesterday that had a large oak guarding the green about 40 yards short. Only way by was over, under, or squeeze your drive to the right near the OB and get by the right side with your approach. When our foursome reached the tee, the topic of conversation immediately became can you get over it. I said I thought I could hit over it and drove to the center of the fairway. Others were not so sure.  My partner went down the right side and hit by it and secured his par. I drove dead center, lofted my gap wedge over it to six feet, and lipped out the putt. I enjoyed the hole very much. It gave me choices, it made me think. A tree is not a hazard in the rules of golf, but it must be dealt with more than those so called, pristinely raked, hazards called bunkers. Take the rakes out, make bunkers a real hazard, and trees will lose part of their bad rap. Of course there are agronomic reasons for removal of trees, but I think a single specimen tree like this one that influences the strategy is a good thing. But then again, I am on record as liking tree gates such as those that appear on Black Forest's 10th.  :)
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Doug Wright

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2006, 11:14:28 AM »
One problem from an architectural standpoint--what happens if/when that one tree dies?
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Kenny Lee Puckett

Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2006, 11:28:58 AM »
Toothpicks?
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Garland Bayley

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2006, 11:31:06 AM »
Quote from: Doug Wright on June 13, 2006, 11:14:28 AM
One problem from an architectural standpoint--what happens if/when that one tree dies?
Have you seen what they do at Pebble?
 :)
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"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Mike Benham

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2006, 11:32:58 AM »
Quote from: Gene Greco on June 13, 2006, 10:22:49 AM

I agree wholeheartedly. However, I believe the most egregious example would be at Stanford's par 4 12th(?) which I plyed in April.

If someone on here has a copy of the Stanford scorecard and can post it I'm sure this will ring true for those who haven't seen it.


Gene - I guess you missed my post above ...



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Tom Huckaby

Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2006, 11:35:26 AM »
But see Mike, it's not ONE tree.  That little one counts also.   ;D

God I love being a persnickety technical wise-ass.

In any case, take away that tree / those trees and #12 Stanford becomes just another golf hole.  With that tree / those trees it is very unique and really tough - the one hole most talked about / revered / loathed on that golf course.

Count me in the positive camp - I really like the hole.

But then again I think the tree by the green on 18 Pebble is a vital part of that golf hole.

TH
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Doug Wright

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2006, 12:17:40 PM »
Quote from: Garland Bayley on June 13, 2006, 11:31:06 AM
Quote from: Doug Wright on June 13, 2006, 11:14:28 AM
One problem from an architectural standpoint--what happens if/when that one tree dies?
Have you seen what they do at Pebble?
 :)

Yeah they spawn and multiply--your greens fees at work!  :) :'(
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Bob Jenkins

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #21 on: June 13, 2006, 12:21:58 PM »

How about the tree just short and right of the green on #2 North (11th tournament hole) at Sahalee from which Vijay got a major break in the 1998 PGA?

Bob Jenkins
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Ryan Crago

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #22 on: June 13, 2006, 01:19:09 PM »
Quote from: chipoat on June 13, 2006, 10:14:56 AM
Sorry guys, I can't buy in on this.

Trees that effect the line of play from either the fairway or with 150+ yards of a tee box are like "bunkers in the sky" - I hate them.


Wasn't the "bunkers in the sky" quote (Mackenzie, if i'm not mistaken) in PRAISE of a well placed, preseved tree?


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Brian_Sleeman

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #23 on: June 13, 2006, 02:01:54 PM »
Isn't the one in the middle of the fairway of the 17th at Cypress Point a single, giant tree?  It seemed like a forest when I was in there, but I thought it was just one.  It plays a large role in the player's mind when choosing the route and club selection for their tee shot.

What do you people think of the one guarding the green of the 18th at Riviera?  Or did they take that one down?
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Gene Greco

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Re:Best use of ONE tree
« Reply #24 on: June 13, 2006, 02:05:08 PM »
Mike:


   You love the hole. I could see how the quirkiness could appeal to some.

However, look at the picture you posted. The larger tree completely blocks the entry way to the green.

Might you not concede that the tree is a bit overgrown and could stand a bit of trimming? At least enough to provide one with a clear avenue of approach from the pseudo split fairway which it creates?
 

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"...I don't believe it is impossible to build a modern course as good as Pine Valley.  To me, Sand Hills is just as good as Pine Valley..."    TOM DOAK  November 6th, 2010
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