Ed,
for me it is also a '17th'.
The Road Hole - which I have parred EVERY time I've played it. What's the fuss?

FBD.

10 at Muirfield Village- I didn't think there was anything wrong with necessarily, but I certainly wasn't wowed, any of the times I was playing it. I did like it better than the 9th though, that is for sure.

I'm not sure anyone's called it a great hole, but television announcers talk about it a lot ("great risk/reward hole," site of Stadler's towel incident, etc.)--the 18th at Torrey Pines.  I found it dull and competely uninspiring.

Stadler's towel incident was on 15 I believe. 18 is a good risk reward hole depending on the tee placement, but not a great hole. My biggest disappointment on a great course was #3 at Olympic. At the time I played, it was considered one of the best 18 holes in the US and it just didn't wow me. 16 or 17 at Lincoln Park have better views of the Golden Gate.

I used to have trouble figuring out what all the fuss was on #8 at Crystal Downs (uphill par 5). After multiple plays I have come to see the genius. Same with #13 at Pacific Dunes.
   Sometimes it just takes time to comprehend the brilliance.

Tim and Tim;
Just for accuracy's sake, the Towel Incident occurred on the right side of #14.  Some kind of non native tree that ate alot of errant shots when I played Torrey way back in high school.

Tom

Don't really know that this qualifies as "great," but the downhill par-3 at Atlanta Country Club (#13) once had quite a rep.  After that, maybe before, there was this outbreak of par-3's with dramatic drops.

For the most part they're bad holes.  Fillers.

Although.. #13 at ACC is the best one of the genre I have played.

Tim;

My many rounds at Torrey and #18 were all pre-water hazard.  Back then I always looked forward to the sometimes reachable 5 par and the chance to gain a stroke back.  The green then was as it is now, raised and tilted back to front, with the only bunker in the right front.

By the way, the green complexes at Torrey have been rebuilt at least two times.  Original in '56 (I believe), then rebuilt, three greens on each course at a time, in '66'67, or so, then maybe again in the 80s.  So the greens I played growing up at Torrey were a far cry from the current ones.  Those original ones nearly uniformly raised slightly off the approach,had relatively steep front portions that were moist and thatchy, and plateaus for the rear two-thirds that were really firm.  So they were tough to play into....the fronts keeping balls from running in, the back rejecting almost all decent shots.

I don't mind the water hazard on #18, as it adds to the shot into the green....but wish it somehow was more natural than the simple, dug-in-the-ground hole that it seems to be.  In my mind the only real way to have it appear natural would be as part of a barranca type feature that crossed in front of the green, and flowed from there, past 7 tee, and into the real barranca right of 6 and 7.  I certainly don't see that occurring, but that concept at least would have integrity with the natural landscape.

Cool and showery here at Bandon.

Tom

Tom J,

Perfect description of the water hazard on Torrey #18--a dug-in-the-ground hole.  That was the turn-off for me.  The big question is, how does the weather look for Bandon on June 15-18?

Mark,

I haven't played Macrihanish, but I've wondered about the greatness of that hole too.  After the tee shot, what else is there?  But, of course, that may be like saying of Scarlett Johansson--after her breasts, what else is there?  Well, perhaps, but about the first thing . . .

Tim,
You won't have a good feel for the weather until 3-5 days out. Chances are good because our summer usually starts as the Rose Festival closes.

Klondike at Lahinch. No wind, birdie. At a disadvantage because most of my great courses have been played in near perfect conditions.

FDB -

You play it from the staid Brit missionary position, huh?  My last effort there recalled a line from a Beatles song - can you name it?

JG

BINGO!

(I don't think there's a line about doing it in the Old Course Hotel Patio, but if so that would apply too. . . )

I hate to say it but 16 at Pasatiempo.