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Mike Hendren

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Golf Is Just......
« on: May 11, 2006, 09:40:15 AM »
In his excellent defense of the relevance of par on the NGLA thread, Bob Crosby writes:  "Otherwise golf is just a walk with a stick and a ball."  

It was with slight trepidation that I recently played two of the great golf courses in America.  Trepidation because my game has deteriorated dramatically over the past two years and frankly is not worthy of display on such courses.  In the cold, wind and rain I did not make a single par the first day, and eked out four or five the next day.  

It was, however a joyful - and I mean joyful in the absolute sense of the word - walk with a stick and a ball, not to mention a fine fellow or two.  

The game is different things to different people.  We must remember and celebrate that.  

Mike
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2006, 09:49:53 AM »
Mike, I also sometimes have felt that a long trip to a great course was sometimes daunting if I don't play up to my best (which isn't all that to begin with) ::)

But, now I just feel that I'll be thrilled to shoot mid 80s at one of these good courses, and if I blow up worse, well it isn't like I'm in a toon-a-mint.  I'm there to explore and experience that particular course.  I may not be able to hit all the shots, but I can see them, try them, and get lucky every once in a while.   Or, my playing companion might make the shot I miss, and you still get the thrill of seeing a particular aspect of the design attacked well.
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Mike_Cirba

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2006, 10:12:51 AM »
Hallelujah to both of those posts.

As I'm able to devote almost no time to practicing these days, my game is like a dodo bird; spotty and irregular and sometimes extinct at best.

I think both summed up why I have more fun these days just seeing a course and attempting (feebly) to hit the required shots than I ever did back in my lower-handicap days grinding out a score.

Tom Huckaby

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2006, 10:26:08 AM »
I shall give a great amen also.

 ;D

I've related my story re the extreme of this before:  Dornoch - playing awful - actually threw the whole bag into the high rough off of the 9th tee after yet another awful shot.  Reality then hit me - what the hell am I doing obsessing over shot quality on one of the world's great courses like that?  It was a valuable lesson and JOY has been my mantra as well at great and not so great courses ever since.

Oh, one does still want to play well... and less than standard golf still does become a chore if it goes on too long... But particularly at the great courses, man if one let's his quality of play determine his joy level, he is really missing the point.

Glad to hear you found that joy out east, Mike.  I had a similar experience a few years ago.

 ;D

TH

ps - Bob's defense of the relevance of par in that NGLA thread is excellent indeed; unfortunately, he's arguing a point that is already conceded and understood.  Hopefully he gets that...
« Last Edit: May 11, 2006, 10:37:33 AM by Tom Huckaby »

Wayne Freeman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2006, 10:36:25 AM »
All you guys-  well said.  Sure you'd like to bring a great golf course to it's knees, and if you can play well it's an added bonus.  Often at these wonderful tracks, you are so into taking it all in and absorbing everything you can that the actual golfing becomes very unimportant and it becomes very difficult to focus on scoring.   If I play good ( and I had my best round at an Open course- Canterbury- even par- last fall) it's awesome, but I never let a bad score diminish the joy of the experience.

John Foley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2006, 10:38:50 AM »
Amen also!!!

I got up at 5:30AM on Monday when I was in Boston earlier this week. To get a first thing in the AM round at a public course that I wanted to see as I had heard very good things about.

They clubhouse was almost an hour late in opening and they we're punching the fairways on a few holes. Along w/ that I played like dog poop. Drove it poorly and putted even poorer.

When I left later that morning I was thrilled to see what I saw, understand a little more about the whole concept of architecture and take a walk w/ a stick & a ball.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2006, 10:39:41 AM by john_foley »
Integrity in the moment of choice

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2006, 10:39:53 AM »
The game is different things to different people.  We must remember and celebrate that.  

Amen, Brother Hendren.

I would add: The game is -- and, at least in my case, needs to be -- different things, on different days, in different places, to the *same* person.

When I am playing a great golf course, it needs to be a walk with a stick.
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Scott Witter

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2006, 10:48:43 AM »
Mike/Bogey

I am by human nature a perfectionist and hard on myself with work and all things for the most part.  For most of my playing time as well as practice, I always want to do the very best I can and many times this has resulted in a great loss of what should have been a peaceful and relaxing occasion.  To a fault, I have been guilty at times of not taking the time to simply enjoy the pure experience and joy of this wonderful game excluding all architectural thoughts which is something I can't seem to get away from.

Thank you for the inspiration.  I have only played two rounds this season...don't ask, but the second was last Sunday where I opened with a 40 not bad for the start of the second round, and closed with a 45, not so good, but in the 45 I had three pars, an eagle and a stellar birdie.  Those moments of greatness, for me anyway, keep me going, but now I shall have to learn how to gracefully accept the two snowmen and "others" as well who accompanied me on my long journey back to the clubhouse.


BCrosby

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Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #8 on: May 11, 2006, 11:30:57 AM »
If I'm supposed to be the bad guy here, please allow me to decline the honor. ;D

How well or badly you play has no relation to enjoying and appreciating a course.  

Playing a course in a competition is not a predicate to enjoying and appreciating a course.

Heck, just walking a course does the trick quite well. Done it myself lots of times.

The pleasures of a golf course are many and can be enjoyed in unlimited ways. (Did I ever tell you about the summer I was sixteen and used to meet a girl under a magnolia next to the 13th green after we got off lifeguarding....?)

"Playing golf" is another way in which you can enjoy a golf course. But if you are going to "play golf", at some level par needs to be a consideration. That doesn't mean you need to play well. Just that par ought to matter to you if you say you are playing golf.

Or am I missing the point of this thread?

Bob



Mike_Cirba

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #9 on: May 11, 2006, 11:44:01 AM »
Bob,

You're never the bad guy here.

We're just trying to explain that we can look at and largely disregard our lowly efforts measured against par and still have fun just looking and seeing the golf course in the interim.

Tom Huckaby

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #10 on: May 11, 2006, 11:48:09 AM »
Bob:

You're not missing the point at all.  I just remain very curious about your seeming devotion to the concept of "par."

Change the terms you use there from "par" to "score" and I'm with you.  That is, say this and I completely agree:


But if you are going to "play golf", at some level score needs to be a consideration. That doesn't mean you need to play well. Just that score ought to matter to you if you say you are playing golf.


Use the word "par" as you did, and questions arise for me.  Did you really mean to use that word to the exclusion of "score"?  Or is par that important to you?

Perhaps this is more appropriate over in the other thread... When I want to focus on score, I think in terms of 73s, not +1s.  Of course par does matter when it's out of whack - that is, a 73 feels better on a par 72 than on a par 68... But still, par is not my guiding light and never has been.

Is it really for you?  Different strokes (pun intended).  ;D
« Last Edit: May 11, 2006, 11:54:45 AM by Tom Huckaby »

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2006, 11:49:55 AM »
(Did I ever tell you about the summer I was sixteen and used to meet a girl under a magnolia next to the 13th green after we got off lifeguarding....?)

Not that I remember. Do tell!

(On that particular "course," what was the "par"?)
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

BCrosby

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2006, 11:57:01 AM »
Dan, Dan, Dan, we don't talk about such things. I will say, however, that my own performance was embarrassingly close to par for a sixteen year old boy.

Bob
« Last Edit: May 11, 2006, 11:58:11 AM by BCrosby »

Mike Hendren

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #13 on: May 11, 2006, 12:04:25 PM »
Bob,

You couldn't be a bad guy if you tried.  Even when the game is just a walk with a stick and a ball, every par is precious and the rare birdie is treasured.  

I'm content with bogey, but satisfied by par.

Mike
« Last Edit: May 11, 2006, 12:05:38 PM by Bogey_Hendren »
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

Tom Huckaby

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2006, 12:10:29 PM »
Mike - well said.  But isn't the key - at least on great courses or when one is inclined to just take a walk with a stick and a ball, if not always outside of competition - not to get pre-occupied with par, bogey, birdie, or any score?

TH

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #15 on: May 11, 2006, 12:23:25 PM »
Bob,

You couldn't be a bad guy if you tried.

Don't tell that to the girl under the magnolia tree!
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Gene Greco

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #16 on: May 11, 2006, 12:55:16 PM »
 
I'm content with bogey....
Mike

Hence, the name.
"...I don't believe it is impossible to build a modern course as good as Pine Valley.  To me, Sand Hills is just as good as Pine Valley..."    TOM DOAK  November 6th, 2010

BCrosby

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #17 on: May 11, 2006, 12:55:47 PM »
Tom -

I accept your use of "score". It is hereby substituted wherever I used the word "par" above.

Dan -

The girl under the magnolia was at least as bad as I was. So it was perfect.

Bob

Tom Huckaby

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #18 on: May 11, 2006, 12:58:50 PM »
Bob - fair enough - and sorry about that, I'm a bit par-obsessed myself these days.

 ;D

Mike_Cirba

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #19 on: May 11, 2006, 12:59:57 PM »
The girl under the magnolia was at least as bad as I was. So it was perfect.



Hopefully you two at least had the courtesy to start at a beginner's course.  After all, poor play is not an excuse for slow play...er...ahhh

I'd better quit.

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #20 on: May 11, 2006, 01:04:09 PM »
The girl under the magnolia was at least as bad as I was. So it was perfect.



Hopefully you two at least had the courtesy to start at a beginner's course.  After all, poor play is not an excuse for slow play...er...ahhh

I'd better quit.

At that age, I'd think poor play would generally be quick play -- particularly among those obsessed with scoring.
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Mike_Cirba

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #21 on: May 11, 2006, 01:21:08 PM »
At that age, I'd think poor play would generally be quick play -- particularly among those obsessed with scoring.

Yeah, Dan...that's where I was going with it...that's why I figured I'd better quit.   ;D

Gene Greco

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #22 on: May 11, 2006, 04:07:41 PM »
The girl under the magnolia was at least as bad as I was. So it was perfect.



Hopefully you two at least had the courtesy to start at a beginner's course.  After all, poor play is not an excuse for slow play...er...ahhh

I'd better quit.

At that age, I'd think poor play would generally be quick play -- particularly among those obsessed with scoring.

Dan,

    THAT WAS POST OF THE YEAR!!!!
"...I don't believe it is impossible to build a modern course as good as Pine Valley.  To me, Sand Hills is just as good as Pine Valley..."    TOM DOAK  November 6th, 2010

Tom Huckaby

Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #23 on: May 11, 2006, 04:10:44 PM »
Why does reading this make me want to get up two groups at some great course, then get in the group AHEAD of BillV, and spend the whole round regaling my partners with stories, being regaled by them, trying all sorts of practice shots, taking 200 pictures, and generally having a grand ole time taking 6 hours to finish?

I never have seen a fit of apoplexy.

 ;D

George Pazin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Golf Is Just......
« Reply #24 on: May 11, 2006, 05:26:05 PM »
I never have seen a fit of apoplexy.

Only because you weren't witnessing me reading your posts about Big Ben.... :)

As for Mike's thesis, a great course does make for a wonderful walk with a stick and a ball. A cartball course doesn't.
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04