Jim,

Great to have you aboard. Please try to keep me in line and stay out of trouble.

Because I'm sure he won't, I should tell you a little about young Jim Sullivan Jr and why he will be a wonderful addition to this mad-house that is euphemistically known as the "Discussion Group of GOLFCLUBATLAS.com".

Jim Jr is a fine young man with a fine heritage in golf and architecture. He was weaned on golf at that GOLFCLUBATLAS.com favorite--Huntingdon Valley C.C. in Philadelphia which has always been known around here as a producer of the finest competitive golfers in this town----and young Jim is certainly that. He won the Philadelphia Amateur Championship a few years back and was our Player of the Year.

From there he decided to try the Motel 6 professional circuit and one winter break when he was back in Philly he told me he was not that fond of the roll-up paper sheets in those places and if my memory serves me correctly at that point I slipped an Amateur Status Reinstatement application in his back pocket when he wasn't looking.

At one point Jim did some dedicated caddying at PVGC and so he probably knows all the ins and outs of that great course better than anyone on this website.

But the best part is Jim's father, Jim Sullivan Sr, is the one who was the successor to that great original architectural purist, Linc Roden (who was advocating this restoration/Ideal Maintenance Meld business at HVGC before most of us could hold a putter) and became the Green Chairman who took that course back to what it is architecturally and maintenance-wise before anyone else, including the USGA Green Section had even thought of it. So Jim Jr has a great heritage for most of the things we discuss and argue about.  

I also think it's good to have analysts on here who are great players and have that vantage point for analyzing architecture. I think some of the excellent players and tournament players we have on here now lend a wonderful alternative perspective and they do it very intelligently---the likes of Jamie Slonis, and Tripp Davis, Michael Walton-Palmer, Mike Clayton, sometimes Michael McDermott and some others I don't know that well.

Jim Sullivan Jr should be one of those.

So Jim...or should we call you Just Deuce....what is your favorite course in the country for $30 or less...

Duece,  

Where do you have access other than HV?

Are you a rater?

What is a Redan?

One place I would imagine is in that price range (at the right time of day) is Little Bennett GC. Just off of the corridor connecting Frederick, MD to D.C. the geographic location makes the thought of a $30 round unlikely but it is far enough off the beaten path that there's a chance.

Jim

JD,

Thanks...that is the type of info we need on this site...being that Little Bennett is a Hurdzan without Fry design I don't think it's better than Wild Horse...but it does look like one great value for the area....are the greens really that fast or is it just advertising lingo...

btw...just ignore Gracely and Schmidty...they just can't get over the fact they never one(or won) anything and always take it out on the sticks...

Brian

Sully would be much preferred to Duece, in fact if Duece sticks I might even consider attempting to figure out how to get back into that Profile Page and change it. Oh well.

1)I have no direct access to any course other than HV.

2)I am not a rater.

3)A redan (#3 at HV originally) is a frequently copied hole design for a one-shotter in which the green (raised above the surrounding terrain) slopes severely from front-right to back-left and which typically has a semi obstructed view of the green surrounds by an obstacle well short of the actual green.

Dave

Sounds fine, maybe one day hazing as opposed to a week but whatever. I have time to answer a couple of yours.

Most overrated course---Pebble Beach
Other than 6-7-8 PB was really disappointing.

Most overrated Architect---Jack Nicklaus
Not that he is rearded that on this site, but in the magazine rankings I have a real problem with the credit he receives. Muirfield Village (his Augusta, Pinehurst #2, Pine Valley or Merion) is no better than a private TPC course.

Florida---If I can't hedge at all, vast wasteland. Elevation and firm conditioning are my most important considerations for a sight, and FL has very little of either. There are however a few very good courses that managed to overcome.

Jim

Jim Jr;

Don't bother answering those questions of those wahoos, it isn't necessary. What did I tell you about this place being like a saloon next to the OK Corral?

The best way to get off to a good start on this website is to embrace at least these concepts;

1. 98% of what Pat Mucci says on here is incorrect.
2. Rich Goodale is a lower school existentialist.
3. Tom MacWood lives in and views the world of golf architecture from an ivory tower somewhere in Ohio.
4. TEPaul resides in the sun-lit uplands of golf course architecture and is the Truth and the Light.

The rest is up to you.

Unfortunately my typing is about as slow as you'll find and I overlapped a couple of the other replies while writing mine.

Brian,

I guess I did answer your Pebble question without knowing it was coming. I do believe every course and every hole has "strategic options" for all players, certainly not the same degree, but every shot should start with a decision.

I would probably do pretty well on the caddyshack exam, but no guarantees. You see I could have gone anywhere but I chose Temple.

Little Bennett--played three or four times and the greens were good, but not brekaway speed. I assume Andy is referring to the two similar par 3's in the 150 - 160 range that drop about 80 feet from tee to green. No arguments from me Andy.

Brian Gracely:

Thank you for resurrecting the Caddyshack trival challenge.  It is a fine trip down memory lane.

I continue to maintain, however, that the best acting performance in Caddyshack was done by Terry the stoner.  

I just watch a Law & Order: SVU re-run a couple of nights ago on NBC. This girl had been raped and everyone thought her step father did it, but it turned out to be his boss. Anyway, the stepfather was Danny Noonan.

I just watch a Law & Order: SVU re-run a couple of nights ago on NBC. This girl had been raped and everyone thought her step father did it, but it turned out to be his boss. Anyway, the stepfather was Danny Noonan.

Tony, we were watching as well. My wife thought there was something quite wrong when all of a sudden I said "Noonan"!

Jim:

I have but one question... in 14 parts....

First, name the movie that's from, and

Second, are width and angles and options just code language for "I want to be able to spray the ball anywhere and get away with it"?

Maybe you can help me straighten out my Longfellow . . .

-Ted

Dave,

Back to School?

Width and angles are not (should not) be simply code words for those who want to spray the ball because there should be a penalty for their inaccuracy. I don't believe the penalty should be water or OB. I believe the defense for these wayward shots should be defended at the green in many instances.  

Geoffrey,

Your perception is correct about the C-9 and its demands. I would guess that, outside of outing play, the C-9 is played less than 10% as often as the other two nines. Perhaps because the other two are so strong and match so well people don't want to mix in that one, but it is interesting. As far as TEP's 'maintenence meld', I would be curious to hear a little more about it and specifically what steps some of the other well designed / poorly maintained courses in the Philadelphia area could take.

Jim

Jim -

If you are a member at a public course, a concept that some people on this board have terrible time with, is it correct to refer to that course as your "home course"?