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Tim_Weiman

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Renaissance Cup Adventure
« on: December 16, 2004, 08:38:57 PM »
Tom Doak once told me he didn’t want there to be a “Tom Doak golf course”.

Judging by the three courses associated with this year’s Renaissance Cup, including Cape Kidnappers in New Zealand, St. Andrews Beach on the Mornington Peninsula south of Melbourne, Australia and Barnbougle Dunes in Tasmania, Tom has “no worries”. Clearly, these are three very different sites and three very different golf courses. The only consistent theme is how each design seemed to fit the landscape, very well if I may say.

For quite few years a trip “Down Under” has been in my “five year plan”, but time constraints always got in the way, in part because I couldn’t imagine how I’d get to see all I wanted to see just with golf not to mention all the other things one might do on holiday. Having often preached slowing down and NOT trying to see everything, I decided to practice what I preach. So, beyond the three venues cited above, I only took time to visit Australia’s two most renowned courses, Royal Melbourne and Kingston Heath. But, strange as it may seem, I also played the Sandringham public golf course because I was dying to see what muni golf was like in Melbourne and the fact the entrance is directly across from Royal Melbourne had me a bit intrigued.

Rather than attempt to detail each course, I’ll try to give my overall impressions as a first time visitor, including my impressions of the golf courses and “the experience”, the latter being important, it seems to me, as still not too many American golfers have made it “Down Under”.

Cape Kidnappers was first up and what first struck me was how relatively easy it seemed to get there. Yes, the flight from Los Angeles to Auckland takes 12 hours, but like trans-Atlantic flights I’ve taken to Ireland many times, it was a red eye flight. From Auckland, there is another one hour flight to Napier and then maybe 45 minutes to the entrance to Cape Kidnappers. The entrance road then leaves its own lifetime memory. A pretty amazing 10-15 minutes up to the clubhouse. No wonder the road itself reportedly cost more than the golf course.

Once up top Cape Kidnapper’s doesn’t immediately reveal itself, but like Ireland’s Old Head, it is obviously in the “8th Wonder of the World” category. I expected that, of course. But, still wasn’t prepared for the sheer scale of the place. Awesome is all I can say.

But, Cape Kidnappers differs from Old Head in several key respects: the routing is not all about placing tees and greens at the edge of cliffs, the quality of the greens and bunkers is much greater and there simply is far more fun golf to be played. Cape Kidnappers also features many forced carries due to the many ravines throughout the property.

After touring and playing the course a few times I struggled to sum up the architecture, but found truth in the summary comment Bruce Hepner made. “Everything fits”, said Bruce, going on to say to say the design was guided by “restraint”.

I agreed with Bruce, but wondered how I could convey what this actually means to interested folks at GolfClubAtlas. After all, I thought, I could narrow the focus and point out a green or bunker design that hardly seemed to demonstrate “restraint”. Yet, when you step back and take a wide, big picture view, the theme of “restraint” becomes clear. Simply put, the golf course architecture doesn’t try to compete with the amazing canvas.

The same thing can be said of Cape Kidnapper’s clubhouse. It may be the most perfectly understated clubhouse you will ever see.

On to Melbourne I went where I encountered perhaps the most pleasant surprise of my trip: Kingston Heath, a venue we in the states don’t usually talk about, but a golf course we could learn a lot from. Kingston Heath proved to be an essay on what is wrong with so much of modern design. Do we really need an ever expanding playing field? Kingston Heath weighs in – all 140 acres after a 20 acre expansion for new practice facilities – with a clear “no”. Must all property be blessed to provide interesting golf? Again, Kingston Heath says “no”. Do we need massive clubhouses to compliment the golf course? “No” again, Kingston Heath says.

Kingston Heath is simply exquisite with perhaps the finest bunker work you’ll ever see, with a tie in to the surrounding vegetation like I have never seen. Then, too, Kingston Heath has in Paul Rak, the Secretary-Manager, one of the finest gentlemen you will ever meet in golf. Tom Doak has his “31 Flavors” and while Kingston Heath doesn’t make his list, it would make mine. It simply is a place that must be seen and studied if you are in to golf architecture.

With all the accolades I give Kingston Heath, I have to acknowledge Royal Melbourne sets a higher standard for a golf course. Royal Melbourne has many of the good things found at Kingston Heath, but the topography is simply far better, at least on the West course. I’ve long wanted to see holes like #4-6 and #10 and they lived up to their billing. But, many other holes cried out “this is a course both good and average players would enjoy everyday”. The philosophy of Mackenzie comes through pretty clearly.

I mentioned playing the Sandringham golf course just to get a feel for public golf in Melbourne. Let me just add two points: affordability and some pretty good golf. Sandrington can be played for just 23 dollars on both weekdays and weekends. The “pretty good” golf is found on the back nine after a rather pedestrian opening nine holes.

Okay, on to St. Andrews Beach, perhaps the most difficult property to describe of the three Renaissance Cup venues. No report would be complete without mentioning that the Mornington Peninsula has what seems a wealth of good golf property. To stand out, one must build something really good and I believe Tom Doak and his team has done so at St. Andrews Beach. We played the course several months short of a completed grow in, but one could already tell this will be a fun, interesting and challenging course to play. The 1st hole has an interesting contradiction: the tee shot is well elevated providing a panoramic view, but the approach shot on this par 5 is likely to be blind without a well positioned 2nd shot. There is lots of width here, but actually not much room to set up the ideal shot to the green.

What quickly follows is a great 2nd hole with an obvious hint of the famous 9th hole at Cypress Point and the 2nd at Pacific Dunes. Tom Doak borrowed, but didn’t copy, it is fair to say.

The 3rd hole completes an impressive opening trio with a tee shot that won’t impress a first time visitor, I suspect, but play the hole once and the golfer will quickly understand the importance of a tee shot “well placed”.

I could mention quite a few other holes that I believe will prove fun to play over and over again, but perhaps the long par 4 10th, par 3 16th and the closing hole are most worthy of mention. The good news is that one could debate which of many holes will offer the most fun to play. The more the merrier, I say. St. Andrews Beach may not be a true seaside golf course like the name implies, but it will provide a boatload of enjoyment for members and visitors alike, I suspect.

Last but certainly not least, my “Down Under” golf adventure ended at Barnbougle Dunes in Tasmania, an hour flight from Melbourne and a 1 to 1.5 hour drive to the village of Bridport. There you will find a great piece of property, a great golf course and – I have a hunch – what will prove to be a great place to hang out if just getting away for golf is what you are after.

After hearing marketing spin over hype a property like Doonbeg in Ireland, I was very happy to find Barnbougle is the real thing. Mike Clayton described the course as already one of the two or three best in Australia and judging by my experience at the big two – Royal Melbourne and Kingston Heath – I doubt many people will challenge Mike’s observation. Then, too, the American developer Mike Keiser boldly predicted Barnbougle will reach the Top 50 in the world level within a few years. He can’t be far off, I have to think.

Barnbougle itself doesn’t make a strong opening statement. The first two holes offer a pleasant, if not exciting start. What makes Barnbougle really special are three excellent short par 4s, the 4th, 12th and 15th holes. I also enjoyed the contrast of #7 to #8 and going from a “little devil” par 3 to a brute of a long par 4.

Part of what made Barnbougle special was the people side, including finally meeting and playing with author Paul Daley, photographer David Scaletti and Barnbougle investor Jonathon McCleery. Together they introduced me to Aussie golf, a little banter, more than a few drinks, in short, the closest thing to Irish golf I’ve experienced.  Putting people like Paul, David and Jonathon together with the Barnbougle golf course and the outstanding 19th hole site made this the venue I most look forward to visiting again

Speaking of people at Barnbougle I must conclude by taking my hat off to Greg Ramsay. Sure Tom Doak and his team have a passion for building golf courses people will enjoy playing for a long time. But, creating great golf venues takes more, a passion that goes beyond the course itself. Greg believed in Barnbougle when others didn’t or thought it was impractical. I have a hunch that years from now people will look back and think Greg’s vision was a no-brainer.






 
Tim Weiman

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2004, 09:12:21 PM »
A hearty thank you Tim for that wonderful commentary.  I wish more posts on GCA lately would have something to say on the subject, like yours clearly does. It brightened my evening just living a little vicariously through your descriptions and hearing the enjoyment you got out of the trip.  Good on ya mate! ;) ;D
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Mike_Cirba

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2004, 09:18:01 PM »
Tim;

I'm really glad you had the chance to get over and have a look see.  It sounds as though you had a wonderful time and I'm envious.  ;)

Stylistically, what would you say the major differences are between each of the three courses?

cary lichtenstein

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Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2004, 09:27:22 PM »
I too feel that we should have more informative posts like this.
Live Jupiter, Fl, was  4 handicap, played top 100 US, top 75 World. Great memories, no longer play, 4 back surgeries. I don't miss a lot of things about golf, life is simpler with out it. I miss my 60 degree wedge shots, don't miss nasty weather, icing, back spasms. Last course I played was Augusta

Tim_Weiman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2004, 09:54:06 PM »
Mike,

I really think Tom and his guys made a major effort to go with what the land gave them. To again refer to Bruce Hepner's comment about Cape Kidnappers, everything seemed to fit on each course, different as they were.

New Zealand, Melbourne and Tasmania didn't seem as far away as I've long thought, but in fairness, it DOES take a commitment to go there. So, you don't want to find exactly what you have found elsewhere.

Cape Kidnappers might not be the course you go to "study" golf architecture. It does have a resorty feel to it, I suppose. But, it is Cape Kidnappers, something I doubt you have ever seen before. It isn't just dramatic cliffside golf like the owner of Old Head tried to create. It has that, of course, but more. The inland holes offer some real cool golf. Take #18, for instance. The tee shot has the element of confusion. You have a hard time knowing exactly where to aim your shot. Then, into the green, there is a good chance you'll be blind....unless your tee shot happens to find the right spot. It all comes across as the antithesis of formula, a bit risky perhaps, but the opposite of mailed in.

Another feature, was the importance of well placed approach shots to what appears to be a large receptive green (the first time you see it). #4 was an example. For a pin on the right side you might need to land slightly to the left of the green, but the slope of the land right at that point isn't obvious.

The 14th was also memorable, a twist on the Road Hole. The drive is over a ravine set at an angle. Flirting with the ravine, sets up the best way to deal with the Road bunker......I think because I wasn't brave enough to really know! Even a world class golfer like Greg Turner found the pitch all could handle.

St. Andrews Beach couldn't have been more different. Though near the sea, many holes played through broad valleys, the land generally more gentle, perhaps better suited for golf than at Cape Kidnappers. The bunker work will appear more dramatic here when the grow in is complete, but I'll bet the tie in to the surrounding tall native grass will work nicely. There is a lot happening on the greens. They are bold, but not obviously so when viewed from approach shot distance.

I have somewhat the same reaction to St. Andrews Beach as the new course at Stonewall. Not that the look anything alike, they don't. But, the course offers members shots they will enjoy trying over and over again and perhaps getting it right 2-3 times out of ten for the average guy.

Barnbougle is links golf. The land offers lots of movement large and small, probably the most varied lies. Against the aforementioned Doonbeg, ther simply are far more fun shots to play, especially the short par 4s I mentioned.
Tim Weiman

Doug Siebert

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Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2004, 01:13:04 AM »
I mentioned playing the Sandringham golf course just to get a feel for public golf in Melbourne. Let me just add two points: affordability and some pretty good golf. Sandrington can be played for just 23 dollars on both weekdays and weekends. The “pretty good” golf is found on the back nine after a rather pedestrian opening nine holes.


Hmmm, a very affordable muni with a pedestrian front nine and "pretty good" back nine, with a well-known neighbor that's well up in everyone's Top 100 list?  Sounds like a course I remember playing in Monteray too long ago!
My hovercraft is full of eels.

Mike_Sweeney

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2004, 05:50:01 AM »

Speaking of people at Barnbougle I must conclude by taking my hat off to Greg Ramsay. Sure Tom Doak and his team have a passion for building golf courses people will enjoy playing for a long time. But, creating great golf venues takes more, a passion that goes beyond the course itself. Greg believed in Barnbougle when others didn’t or thought it was impractical. I have a hunch that years from now people will look back and think Greg’s vision was a no-brainer.


Tim,

Nice report and nice acknowledgement of Greg.  8)

TEPaul

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2004, 06:25:41 AM »
Thank you Tim; It's wonderful that these kinds of courses are being done--Tom Doak and Renaissance is certainly on a world-wise roll. At the end of his career will he have followed Alister MacKenzie''s career in reverse---will Tom have begun his career in the US and end it someday with some of his greatest work in the Old World?
« Last Edit: December 17, 2004, 06:26:24 AM by TEPaul »

John_McMillan

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2004, 10:01:19 AM »
Tim,

Sounds like you had a great opportunity with the Renaissance "Down Under" tour.  

The Renaissance Cup was played at Cape Kidnappers.  I've heard that some felt the set-up for this course was too difficult.  What did you find?  I understand that Doak tried to compensate for the course's difficulty by sending different handicaps off different tees.  Were the tee differences enough to level out the difficulty at which the course played?

I've also heard that the general impression of the Renaissance tourers was in inverse order of the courses played - ie that they liked Barnboogle best and Cape Kidnappers least of the three (though all got high passing grades).  What was your impression of how the courses will shake out in a pecking order 10 years from now?

Tim_Weiman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2004, 01:53:59 PM »
John,

I think your reference of inverse order makes sense, that is Barnbougle made the most favorable impression followed by St. Andrews Beach and Cape Kidnappers. Barnbougle just seemes to be the complete package, the land, the design, specific holes and a sense that the overall project is headed in the right direction.

St. Andrews Beach may be a bit of a sleeper at this stage. It is furthest behind in terms of grow in and the rest of the project. But, even at this early stage one could see it will emerge as an awfully fun place to play golf. I look forward to seeing and playing it again, for sure.

Cape Kidnappers, because the site is so dramatic, might always be hailed as an "8th Wonder of hte World" golf course and perhaps less appreciated from a strickly architecture point of view. As for whether it was set up too difficult, honestly, I didn't have that feeling despite having a game that is in very poor shape. I'd guess the number of forced carries might have been an issue for some, but for me the only shot I felt I just couldn't hit was the par 3 6th, mostly because my long irons are horrible right now and if you fall short your ball can come back down a long way.

Tom Paul:

I can't speak for Tom, but don't think it out of line to suggest he wants a solid international record by the end of his career.

Sounds like there are projects coming in the "Old World", but I'll leave that to Tom to disclose at the appropriate time.
Tim Weiman

George Pazin

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Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2004, 02:03:11 PM »
Are they still planning a second course at St Andrews Beach?
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

peter_p

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2004, 02:27:32 PM »
George,
I didn't go, but it sure looks like it is a go http://www.ausgolf.com.au/standrewsbeachgolf2.htm

Tim_Weiman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2004, 06:51:57 PM »
George,

My understanding is that a second course (and the composite course) is still planned for St. Andrews Beach. On the timing, I don't have any insight.

FYI, land certainly exists for at least one other course at Barnbougle. Timing on that is even more uncertain, I'm guessing.
Tim Weiman

Player_Aus

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #13 on: December 17, 2004, 11:33:56 PM »
George,
re the 2nd course at St Andrews Beach.  It has been routed and is "just there".  Timing has to do with the opening of the Gunnamatta course, which is imminent, membership sales etc.  The Fingal Course is every bit as exciting as the Gunnamatta course and will make the complex one of Australia's premier golfing destinations.  With all the hype of CK and BBD I think StAB's quality will surprise a lot of people

Jay Cox

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Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #14 on: December 17, 2004, 11:38:53 PM »
Who did the routing for the second course?

Player_Aus

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2004, 11:40:39 PM »
Tom Doak and Mike Clayton...

Chris Kane

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Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2004, 06:45:09 AM »
Jay, while St Andrews Beach is a collaraboration between Tom Doak and Mike Clayton, my understanding is that Doak did the routing for the first course, while Clayton has routed the Fingal course.

I'd call the first course (Gunnamatta) a Doak/Clayton course, while the Fingal is a Clayton/Doak.

John_McMillan

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #17 on: December 18, 2004, 10:11:22 AM »
I didn't have that feeling despite having a game that is in very poor shape.

I'm still not giving you any strokes next time we get together to play.

The Renaissance Cup doesn't use handicaps, so the multiple tees were used for players instead to increase the playability of the event.  How well do you feel that system worked?  The concerns that I've heard about the Cape Kidnappers difficulty related to wind and green speeds.  Were the Doak forward tees a good compensation for these factors?  How well do you feel Cape Kidnappers is "teed" compared to other courses?

Tim_Weiman

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Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #18 on: December 18, 2004, 11:14:35 AM »
John,

The multiple tees used worked fine for the competition, I think. My problem was more related to horrible iron play.

I seem to recall Tom once mentioning to me that multiple tees weren't his favorite thing, but clearly at Cape Kidnappers they are a requirement and they way they have been deployed should accomodate most golfers.

Yes, there is wind, though the days we were there it hardly was the worst I've seen elsewhere. What the wind did do was keep me cool and lead me to foolishly overlook the need for sun block.

As a result, I was the Renaissance Cup winner - or loser - for "most sun burn".
Tim Weiman

Mark_F

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #19 on: December 18, 2004, 06:57:00 PM »
But Chris, will the Fingal be acknowledged as a Clayton/Doak course? ???

Assuming it ever gets built of course, since the scuttlebutt, wild conjecture and unfounded gossip about the place has everyone bar The Donald ready to take it over in a New York minute.  ;)

Joel_Stewart

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Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #20 on: December 19, 2004, 12:08:11 PM »
Can anyone rate the three courses in order of preference.  I've talked to two people who attended and both rated them
1. Barnbougle
2. St Andrews Beach
3. Cape Kidnappers (a distant third)

By the way, congratulations to Mike Keiser and his partner Jimmy Dunne for winning the Cup.

Jonathan Cummings

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #21 on: December 19, 2004, 04:18:33 PM »
Man, St Andrews Beach and Barnbougle must be out of this world because I thought Kidnappers was top 100 material.  What the hell do I know!

JC

JonMc

Re:Renaissance Cup Adventure
« Reply #22 on: December 20, 2004, 02:25:15 AM »
 :) Tim - thanks for your wonderful comments, it was a pleasure to have played with you and seen your enjoyment of Barnbougle first hand. We look forward to seeing you back soon - if you can make it back, I'm sure that David and Paul will be able to also! And we will provide the suncream! My view of Cape Kidnappers was that it was a spectacular course. There was an enormous amount of discussion around the 15th hole - 600 metre par 5 and how tough it was given the steep fall off on both sides. However, can you imagine the criticism if there was no hole there? And then no 16th tee? I enjoyed the course, but you HAVE to hit it straight. I think that it is a course that people should play (if they can afford it) as it is a marvelous experience. Tom has done a great job on land that, whilst spectacular, would have presented many challenges.
Agree with your comments of St Andrews Beach - it will be a great course when - as Jim N says - it reaches puberty. I played there last week and it is a fantastic design and heaps of fun to play already, just needs a little time before it develops fully. The greens and surrounds are already as good as I have seen anywhere, and certainly very, very consistent throughout the 18 holes which is unusual.
I can't really comment re Barnbougle, other than saying that we were very happy with how everything went.
Enjoyed the format of the Ren Cup, however, as a 9 handicapper, my life would have been a lot easier if I played off 10! On balance I think that it was as fair as possible and was certainly a fantastic experience to be there and mix with many wonderful people from around the world.

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