Woodlake CC (Vass, NC) 2021-22 Renovation

[Erik J. Barzeski]

I'm looking forward to playing Woodlake in the coming months, and I've heard a few good things from a few different people, but was mildly surprised not to see any posts here about it.

What are the thoughts on the course, the recent renovation… etc.?

https://triadgolf.com/2021/10/04/woodlake-country-club-to-reopen-in-late-2022/

https://www.woodlaketoday.com/news/woodlake-country-club-unveils-exciting-opening-date-of-the-maples-golf-course-as-well-as-website-brand-and-membership-launch

https://woodlakecountryclubnc.com/

Kris Spence will stop you in your tracks if you try to label his recent work at Woodlake Country Club as an impending renovation or restoration. The Greensboro-based golf course architect has a much more fitting description of the project.

“This is a resurrection from the dead, this thing was gone,” Spence said of the 36-hole development outside of Vass, which is about 10 miles north of the golfing paradise of Pinehurst.

[Edward Glidewell]

It's been mentioned in passing in a couple of threads.

I had a chance to play it in early October and really enjoyed it; there are some excellent holes out there. There were also photos posted on the Golf Club Atlas Instagram with some positive commentary.

[Paul Rudovsky]

Played it last week and really liked it.  A solid Doak 6 IMO.  Only hole I would question is #2...a par 5 "transition hole".  Looked to me like the new owner was NOT skimping.  Think and hope it will do well


Greens very tough and slopped...important to be on correct sides of cup. 

[Erik J. Barzeski]

Thanks. Will gladly read more.

So the course was basically growing over and was not tended to for quite awhile, eh?

[Ronald Montesano]

Is #2 the island fairway hole?

How many holes do they have? I count 28, but I may be off. I know that they added a new, 19th hole.

[Edward Glidewell]

They originally had 36 holes -- one designed by Ellis Maples and one by Arnold Palmer. They only renovated the Maples course, but if you're looking on Google Maps you can probably still see some of the Palmer holes. It's only 18 holes now, although I think they're discussing building a 9 hole par 3 course on some of the old Palmer layout.

And yes, both courses had been abandoned for years. There's also a lake there that's mostly empty at the moment because of a damaged dam, but they're in the process of rebuilding the dam.


I agree that #2 is awkward, although I think it would help if they cut back some of the foliage. I thought I hit a good shot but ended up losing my ball -- the fairway stopped where I hit it but I couldn't tell that from the tee.

[Erik J. Barzeski]

Thank you. Perhaps if I remember to get my phone out and take some photos, I can add some to this topic when I get back.

[Jay Mickle]

I played the course any number of times about 10 years ago and enjoyed it far more than the Palmer course which has been abandoned. At the time it seemed a bit claustrophobic as the corridors were pinched by trees. I played it in early September with Kris Spence during a soft opening. I was blown away by the changes that he made in terms of tree removal, opening up sight lines, adding and taking away some bunkers and the expansion of the greens out to what they had been when Ellis Maples first opened the course. The second hole can certainly be a bit offputting the first time you play it, maybe the second time also, but once you understand it, it’s a very interesting strategic hole. I hadn't remembered the topography I hadn’t recalled the topography to be as good as it is both naturally, and with a bit of enhancement.
Even in an area with great courses, this one can hold its own.
 

[Erik J. Barzeski]

What is the second hole? Is it a par five where you hit a shorter club (shorter than a 5W or something) off the tee? Something else entirely?

We'll only get to play it once, and while I will accept a quirk of architecture on occasion, the three people I'm playing with may be bothered if they hit what they think is a good shot only to get punished by something unseen, or any other things like that. Being so early in the round I'm hoping I can share some info with them so that they're more content with the rest of the round, too.

So what is #2? What's odd about it?

[Peter Sayegh]

What is the second hole? Is it a par five where you hit a shorter club (shorter than a 5W or something) off the tee? Something else entirely?

We'll only get to play it once, and while I will accept a quirk of architecture on occasion, the three people I'm playing with may be bothered if they hit what they think is a good shot only to get punished by something unseen, or any other things like that. Being so early in the round I'm hoping I can share some info with them so that they're more content with the rest of the round, too.

So what is #2? What's odd about it?

Erik,
Luckily I was told to do quick recon before I teed off. It's odd because it's a "semi" dual peninsula hole without great views afforded from the tee or landing area.
I aimed at the tree with the brownish right half and you'll see my second approach look. I pushed it into the "beach" which was very playable but may be water when the dam situation is finally resolved and executed.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/194357794@N03/albums/72177720313447703/with/53403845524

They originally had 36 holes -- one designed by Ellis Maples and one by Arnold Palmer. They only renovated the Maples course, but if you're looking on Google Maps you can probably still see some of the Palmer holes. It's only 18 holes now, although I think they're discussing building a 9 hole par 3 course on some of the old Palmer layout.

And yes, both courses had been abandoned for years. There's also a lake there.

From what I garnered, the use of the remnants of the Palmer course are to be determined-but not for years. A 3-5 hole loop is the last option I heard.

I know that they added a new, 19th hole.

Ronald, I don't believe there's a 19th hole. The new, current, 18th, is what has been highlighted. If you look at Google Maps, the new 18th borders Woodlake Blvd. I assume it's the reverse of the old Palmer 9th/18th.
[Edit after Erik's comments below. I screwed the dialog, not the visual].

I played the course any number of times about 10 years ago and enjoyed it far more than the Palmer course which has been abandoned. At the time it seemed a bit claustrophobic as the corridors were pinched by trees. I was blown away by the changes that he made in terms of tree removal, opening up sight lines, adding and taking away some bunkers and the expansion of the greens out to what they had been when Ellis Maples first opened the course. Even in an area with great courses, this one can hold its own.

Looked to me like the new owner was NOT skimping.  Think and hope it will do well.
Greens very tough and slopped...important to be on correct sides of cup. 

To Jay's point, the tree removal was evident but I liked the non-uniformity of the width throughout the course.
To Paul's point, the greens were fantastic. I 4-putted the 9th from back right...and don't feel all that bad about it.

[Kris Spence]

The 2nd on the Maples was one of 3 holes on the Woodlake property with a fairway island concept.  The others were the 18th holes on both courses, we abandoned the original Maples 18th to create 25 lakefront residential lots.  I will find out later this week if the old Palmer 18th will become a 6 hole short course this spring/summer.  I created a new Maples 18th by routing a new 520 ish par 5 backward down the old Palmer 1st.


The 2nd hole is a par 5 playing across a lake connector to a 2 acre fairway section.  Driver is not too much club, playing near and right of the 2 bunkers left off the tee provides the ideal and shortest route.  There is little to no dry ground over the bunkers but plenty out right. The 2nd shot has multiple options, if not going for the green, a direct line at the left greenside bunker sets up a great angle into the green.  The original hole had a right side bunker between the green and lake which was removed providing a more dramatic forced carry option.


The course was mostly overgrown when I first visited, the turf areas were anywhere from 4 to 6 feet high in growth.  Greens were covered in broomsedge and bunkers unrecognizable including 10-12’ small pines and other scrub.


Having renovated several Ellis Maples designs, I’m convinced Woodlake is one of his best.  His associate at the time (1971)was Ed Seay.  Holes 1-2 along the lake are a soft opening to what follows.  3 through 10 are as good as it gets, the 11th was a bit of a sleeper we enhanced with a subtle punchbowl green.  12 thru 18 are great examples of how to design on flattish ground using lateral movement, varied width and layering of bunkers.  The putting surfaces are Ellis at his very best, tons of variety set on angles with extended corners.  We reclaimed quite a bit of surface in the corners and softened a few areas but they’re largely his original concepts except for the 18th.


Once the 1200 acre lake is restored and other clubhouse related amenities completed, Woodlake will realize its true potential, something I doubt it ever did with the prior owners.  As Jay mentioned, this course can hold its own in the Pinehurst/SP market full of great courses. 


Thanks for giving the course the exposure it deserves, definitely put it on your play list when visiting Pinehurst.  It will offer semi private and package play.  (Pardon my typo’s)

[Edward Glidewell]

Erik,
Luckily I was told to do quick recon before I teed off. It's odd because it's a "semi" dual peninsula hole without great views afforded from the tee or landing area.
I aimed at the tree with the brownish right half and you'll see my second approach look. I pushed it into the "beach" which was very playable but may be water when the dam situation is finally resolved and executed.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/194357794@N03/albums/72177720313447703/with/53403845524

The hole looks basically fine in your photos -- when I played, the brush etc. in front of the fairway was several feet higher and the bunkers weren't even visible from the tee. We couldn't see our balls land and weren't really sure where the fairway stopped.

[Erik J. Barzeski]

I aimed at the tree with the brownish right half and you'll see my second approach look. I pushed it into the "beach" which was very playable but may be water when the dam situation is finally resolved and executed.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/194357794@N03/albums/72177720313447703/with/53403845524

Oh great, thank you! Didn't expect to get the full photo treatment, but so glad.

The 2nd on the Maples was one of 3 holes on the Woodlake property with a fairway island concept.

Oh wow, thanks Kris!

How long was the course unmaintained if there were 12' pine trees in bunkers?

[Peter Sayegh]

Kris,
Were you consulted on when the course SHOULD open after your work?
The course didn't seem "rushed" when I played.

[Paul Rudovsky]

The course didn't seem "rushed" when I played.

I agree w that assessment...yes the lake and dam need a lot of work...but the course is absolutely ready.

Played with a good friend...he played blues (about 6500) and I played all the way up (about 5500).  We BOTH thought #2 bent to the right and I hit what I thought was a perfect fade :-(.   7 on the card.  my bad for not looking closer bot fairway bunker on left side obscures the fairway beyond...in any case this clearly looked to me like a transition area that had to be dealt with some way