Langford and Tillinghast

[Phil_the_Author]

Does anyone have any information as to the work that Billy Langford and Tilly did together in redesigning the Westmoreland CC? It was done around 1920-21.

Did they ever partner on anything else that anyone is aware of?

There is a wonderful article in the July 1921 issue of Golf Illustrated in which Jack Hoag details this collaboration, including an incredible photograph of the 16th green. It is an amazing punchbowl design...

[Phil McDade]

Phil:

Frequent GCA poster Dan Moore may be your best bet for any information re. Westmoreland. A fairly extensive timeline put together a year or so ago by Dan for a GCA Langford outing doesn't mention Westmoreland. But the timeframe of 1921 was when Langford was doing some really interesting courses -- Culver Academy (1920), Bryn Mawr (1921), Ozaukee and Wakonda (1922), the original nine at Harrison Hills (1923), and the sadly NLE Acacia (1924).

[Dan Moore]

Phil,

I've seen the article you mention and the amazing looking green, but that is the only info I have seen about the Langford Tillinghast work at Westmoreland.  I have noticed in the PGA consulting letters that Tillie recommended changes to several Langford courses in the 1930's and at times was pretty critical of certain features.   

[Phil_the_Author]

Dan and Phil,

I had known of his work at Westmoreland but never any details until I came across this article. I was very surprised by it because it is clearly a collaboration. This is one of the VERY few collaborations of design work that Tilly did (other than with those who worked for him) before he went to work with Billy Bell in 1937.

For that reason I think it is quite important. It would be wonderful to find out how it came about and whose idea it was. Tilly did very little work in the Chicago area. One could alomst speculate a 'What if?' type of scenario that would lead to a Langford/Tillinghast rather than a Langford/Moreaus.

I'll definitely let you know anything I can find out...

[Peter Flory]

This is an old thread that quickly died on the vine.  But I was perusing old Golf Illustrated issues and came across the photo of the 16th green at Westmoreland from 1921 that was referenced here.  This is now the 7th hole and the circus ring was removed and the front bunkers turned into a lower tier on the green.  It's sort of a tabletop with drop offs on both sides and no bunkers.  They mention Tillie and Langford in that issue, so I'm assuming that this is their creation. 

I colorized the photo so that it would be easier to see what is sand and what is grass.

It has to be one of the wildest green complexes ever constructed in Chicagoland.  I would love to see what the rest of the course looked like at this time. 

Notice that the area on the right side of the pic is also sand, to the right of the little shelf of rough.  I confirmed this by comparing it to an aerial from '39. 

[Sven Nilsen]

Funny enough, that image of the old 16th popped up recently in an essay on William Watson that was distributed in another forum. 

The photos I have of the rest of the course don't show anything as dramatic as that punchbowl. 


It should probably be noted that many of the bunkers on the course were altered by Joe Roseman shortly after Tillinghast and Langford did their work (and by all accounts prior to that photo being published).

Sven

[Peter Flory]

This does remind me of the drama in the shaping at the Illinois Golf Club- Tillinghast with Roseman on construction. 

In that July 1941 Golf Illustrated article, they talk about how Westmoreland is known for it's variety in bunkering with no two green complexes being alike.  I'd say that they weren't kidding. 

On Twitter, Shawn Smith posted another image of the hole from later and mentioned that restoring this green is in the long-term plan for the club.  I just don't see the membership there going for it, but am hopeful.  I don't think that the current green is a bad one at all.  It's just radically different than this- a tabletop with run offs around it and a front section and a higher back section over a tier. 

This version is like a PG version of the 1941 image. 

[Jeff_Brauer]

When I lived and worked in Chicago, a high percentage of the older courses that I saw and liked were said to have been designed or at least built by Mr. Roseman.  He had a nice touch on the dozer! (or rake, since his company invented the Roseman Tractor/Rake)

[Dan Moore]

After the Western Open in 1917 Westmoreland undertook a series of modernizations to the Watson Course. First by Langford who supervised the construction of several greens in 1919. Roseman built them. I believe from playing there last year the 5th and 11th may still be original Langford greens.


Later in 1919 Tillinghast was brought in and I've seen documentation of proposed work on the 1st, 9th and 18th holes. The 18th (today's 9th hole) was to feature a massive U shaped bunker built into the face of the hill at 300 yards that extended entirely across the fairway. The 9th was to be bunkered on the right with a bunker extending 200 yards long and a large bunker placed at 200 yards on the left. Several bunkers were to be added between the 9th and 18th greens. You don't see these bunkers as described in 1920 on the 1938 aerial. All this work was being carried out by Roseman who it appears from a 1922 article to have greatly modified Tillie's proposals giving them his own twist.


Tillie was back in 1935 on his PGA Tour. At that time he recommended a new 7th green to replace the "formal" punchbowl green 50 yards behind the existing green on newly acquired land. He also recommended a new location for today's 12th green. In the 1938 aerial you can see two greens on the 12th hole and the new green already built on the 7th. Tillie also recommended closing parts of some bunkers.


More recently Arthur Hills made numerous changes. Knowing how many hands had touched the course over the years I was pleasantly surprised last year in playing in the Il. Sr. Am how well integrated everything felt. That is a tribute to the recent renovation which opened up a lot of width again and the new strategically located flat bottomed, narrow bunkering. Plenty of room to avoid them but beware of you didn't.

[PCCraig]

Funny enough, that image of the old 16th popped up recently in an essay on William Watson that was distributed in another forum. 

Do you have a link to that essay, Sven?

[Jim_Kennedy]

Behind every great man...

[Peter Flory]

7 miles of drain tile at Westmoreland?


There is a par 5 on the Eastern border that was historically on soft ground.  On that hole, I believe that you officially play through 3 towns.  Something like you tee off in Wilmette, play through Evanston, and then hole out in Skokie.