[MCirba]

Bret,

If Swan left in June 1898 it seems likely that his eventual course was one of nine holes before his departure based on the dates of those articles.  Would you agree?

[Mark_Fine]

Mike/Bret,
This is one of those areas where I don't think we have enough evidence to draw an accurate conclusion.  You have to believe Dunn was involved with the expansion to 9 holes.  But did he just implement plans left behind by Swan, did he add new holes himself,...? The other thing that would be great to confirm (but might not be possible) is if the first three holes in Swan's original routing were in any way overlaid on anything that Reid Jr did? 

[MCirba]

Did I understand correctly that a copy of "Harper's Round Table" that includes a drawing of the original links (and other materials) may be available?   That would certainly be helpful.

[Mark_Fine]

Mike,
I have a copy on order (Bret spotted it).  We are keeping our fingers crossed that it includes some good info.
Mark

[MCirba]

Awesome.  Can't wait to see it. 

[Bret Lawrence]

Mike,


I agree with Mark, that there isn't enough evidence to make a conclusion regarding who added the three new holes that opened in October of 1898.  It is clear that Swan was still at the school in April 1898, when they were promised a nine hole course.  After the Summer of 1898, the first and second newspapers of the 1898-1899 school year mentioned three new holes were added and open for play by October 1898.  For all we know, the new holes could have been ready as early as July after the kids went home for Summer break.  There was just no one around to report on it?


I would like to see the map of the 1897 course before I try to form any more conclusions.  It should also be very helpful to determine if any of this course coincides with the course that exists today.


I think the timeline you put together is very good, but it will help to see a little more information to fine tune some of the assumptions we are making.  If we don't find the information we are looking for, it would be better to say we don't really know and lay out the details that we found, much like you have done with Dunn and Swan.




Bret

[MCirba]

I agree Bret. 

I'm enjoying the collaborative environment here, thanks!

[Mark_Fine]

As soon as I get that magazine I will let you know what I found.  Have some other info hopefully coming as well from lurkers here who attended the school 😊

[MCirba]

Here we go....

[Mark_Fine]

Thanks for putting them up Mike (I have not posted pictures for so long, I forgot how).  The comparisons to the old aerials (I have them dating back to 1931) are interesting. 


Does anyone here know what are the oldest 9 holes courses in the country? 

[MCirba]

You're welcome, Mark.   From the looks of the old aerials compared to the maps I think today's holes 1, 2, 3, and 4? (the 5th on the Swan course) were basically there, albeit in a rawer form, since inception and possibly part of the makeshift course that Reid Jr. laid out earlier (according to one recollection).   

The articles describing that course Gordon planned indicated that he was going to be altering and modernizing 5 of the existing holes and constructing 4 new holes.   Once the work was completed it was reported that there were 9 new greens, 2.5 new fairways, and a "fascinating water hole".   It does sound from those descriptions that Gordon preserved much of the routing he inherited.

As far as oldest still existing 9 holes courses, I recall that both Dorset (VT) and Foxburg (PA) lay claims.

[Ian Mackenzie]

I attended the school from 1976 to 1980 and some of your info does not quite correspond to what is there, but I do not see it as that relevant. The infirmary was there when I got there and it borders the (current) 9th fairway. It has now expanded substantially.

Ian,

Here's more regarding the location of the Infirmary.   As mentioned, the original infirmary circa 1910 was on a farmhouse in the middle of today's golf course.   By 1929 it was moved to the new "McPherson Hall building where it stayed until 1976.   

From 1929 to 1976, the Lawrenceville School Infirmary, as it was then known, occupied the Georgian style building that is now McPherson House. In 1931, the mothers of boys in the school created the Ladies Auxiliary to the Lawrenceville School Infirmary. With the creation of Parents at Lawrenceville in 1975, the Ladies Auxiliary became the Infirmary Committee, a support organization open to fathers and mothers of Lawrenceville students.

I found that info at the school online archive Bret earlier pointed us to at http://stephanarchives.org/doing-research/collections/finding-aids/document-collections/parents-at-lawrenceville-records-finding-aid/

Very interesting.
My mother was once president of "Parents at Lawrenceville".
I got there in the fall of 1976 and MacPherson House was  a dorm for seniors where my hockey coach was housemaster.


The house on the course to which you refer, just to the right of the par 3 third hole,  was inhabited at the time by my french teacher and later by the head of the biology department.

[Mark_Fine]

Thanks Mike.  Bret and I were just exchanging emails.  I sent him the actual yardages of the original 6 holes from Swan (they were hard to read off the stick routing in the Harpers' article).  Here are the yardages.  1- 175 yards 2 - 304 yards 3 - 282 yards 4 - 187 yards 5 - 241 yards 6 - 326 yards

What do you make of the 1931 aerial compared to the 1957 aerial showing the Gordon design?   

[MCirba]

Mark,

From the looks of the comparative aerials, it seems that the Gordon course incorporated what was there at the time for holes 1-4 and 9, although rebuilt the greens, added bunkers, and possibly built new longer tees for all the holes.    This would be consistent with the 1953 article mentioning that he incorporated 5 existing holes, rebuilt all the greens, and created 4 new holes, which look to be 5 thru 8.

The 1897 drawing shows today's holes 1-3, and 4 in their general position.   I don't know what to make of the yardages listed as they are a bit confusing in relation to the other landmarks on the map.   

How long are each of those holes today?   I don't have Google Earth on this computer or I'd do a comparison.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Mike -


This is from memory....


Hole 1 - par 4 around 320 yards
Hole 2 - par 4 around 340 yards
Hole 3 - par 3 around 200 yards
Hole 4 - par 4 around 360 yards


A stream runs across all of these holes but is really only in play on #1 and #4.

[MCirba]

Thanks, Ian.   I think that's probably consistent with new tees created over the years.   Those look as though they would have been holes 2-5 on the Swan course.

[Bret Lawrence]

Mark sent the following description asking for it to be posted on this thread. The font is very small, so it may be difficult to read:

[MCirba]

Had the great pleasure of playing Lawrenceville yesterday morning with Joe Bausch and Matt Frey and will try to get some pics up this week.

One correction to previous threads.   The original infirmary was indeed to the right of today's 3rd hole but it was not the structure that stands there today, which is evidently one of the original houses.   The infirmary was just to the right of that building, but is not there any longer.   That info from a fellow who's been with the school since 1960.   

[MCirba]

Here's a couple of pics to warm up.  The first is the approach to #1 and the second is the view from #2 tee. 

[Joe Bausch]

Photo album of Lawrenceville, the par 4 4th hole being pretty darn good:

http://xchem.villanova.edu/~bausch/images/albums/Lawrenceville/

Pics taken in auto HDR mode with a Sony RX-100 (and some cropping and additional touch-ups with iPhoto).

[Mike Nuzzo]

I appreciate the Treehouse's interest and sharing of information.

Mark I'm interested to know:
What is there to be restored?
How could the current course be described to any particular style or architect?

Thank you
Mike

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