[Glen Rapoport]

Have any of you played Shady Canyon in Irvine, California?  It's a relatively new Fazio that struck me as very "member friendly" in how it played.  I would be curious as to what the "California" contingent feels about it relative to other new courses in that area.

Glen

[Tommy Williamsen]

Glen, Shady Canyon has been discussed a few times.  That may be the reason for the lack of response.  I liked Shady Canyon.  I played it when it first opened.  I thought Fazio did a great job routing the course and the views were nice.  I felt that their were a few forced carries that were too long and the shots into the green were not as interesting as I would have like.  But it was fun and would be a nice home club.

[Wayne Freeman]

Tommy- your nice home club is running about 300K to join.  The place exudes big dough and no tipping is allowed. Mark McGwire is a member and has put in  about $15 million into his pad. The clubhouse is phenomenal -  food, practice facilities etc.  As far as the golf course:
         I was pretty disappointed for several reasons. Firstly it is impossible to walk and sometimes it seems as though it is 1/2 a mile or more from green to the next tee.  And many of the fairways narrow so much out in the landing zones that I felt cramped a lot. I thought the whole layout could have been a lot better.  The greens are fantastic however, and I thought the par 3's were excellent.  

[Patrick Schultheis]

I played Shady Canyon about 18 months ago.  It was a beautiful facility --- great clubhouse, restaurant, practice facility, etc.  My host is an old friend and was exceedingly gracious.  I had a wonderful time.

I enjoyed the course.  I'm a member at Aldarra, so I was looking for similarities between the two Fazio-designed courses that were built around the same time.  I did note some --- on both courses, there are a couple of short-ish par 4s with great strategic options.  In addition, there are a good mix of par 3s on both courses.

The big difference, in my view, is the walkability of the courses.  Aldarra is a great walking course.  While quite hilly, the course virtually demands to be walked.  Other than the steep climb between 10 green and 11 tee and the tunnel under the road to get to holes 3-8 (which is an easy walk in any event), the distance between greens and tees is slight.

Shady Canyon, on the other hand, is NOT a walker's course.  I shamed my host into walking.  While I didn't regret it, there were some BIG walks (with steep climbs) from many greens to many tees.  At least twice a club employee drove by on a cart and asked us if we were ok, wanted a ride, etc.  (Very kind --- I'm not complaining about that.)  At least two other groups on the course asked if we were crazy for walking.  For the record, it was a nice, mild May day on SoCal --- not too hot at all, even for this Washingtonian.

On the whole, I really enjoyed Shady Canyon.

[ed_getka]

Patrick,
   Welcome to the site. Could you explain what the mix of the par 3's is at either course? I have only played The Preserve by Fazio out in the Carmel Valley. 2 of the 4 par 3's were interesting there. The other two were basically the same hole, downhill with open greens and not calling for any particular shot or challenge.
    How does the severity of the land at Shady Canyon effect the holes' playability? I'm assuming the land is severe if the course isn't very walkable.

[Sean Leary]

Patrick,

Aldarra is a great walking course? I would call it quite walkable, but the greens and tees aren't that close together.  I walk it too but it is difficult to walk it in in less than 4 hours. Certailnly not a cartball track, but it isn't a really easy walk..

[Patrick Schultheis]

Sean - I maintain that Aldarra is a great walking course.  That doesn't mean it isn't a tough walk....

Ed - thanks.  My specific memories of Shady Canyon's par 3s are a bit hazy.  I recall (without specificity) a couple of fine short-mid-length holes, and one long, uphill par 3.  I liked the mix.

At Aldarra, #2 is a short-mid par 3 with a wicked false front.  #6 is a mid par 4 over a creek to a steeply sloped green.  #9 is a short par 3 over another creek (salmon should be running in it in a few weeks) to a large green.

#13 is a long, narrow, downhill par 3 to a green that slopes away from the tee.  #15 is a hard, hard hole --- long, uphill par 3, over a  hazard to a very difficult green with a massive bunker in front.

The terrain at Shady Canyon is severe, but not markedly more than at Aldarra.

[ed_getka]

Patrick,
  At Aldarra, are the first 3 par 3's relatively level? #13 sounds intriguing with the fallaway green. In general, what club are you hitting there, and what kind of shot do you try to play?  What is the idea on #15? A perfect shot or purgatory? Or is there some sort of bailout that gives you some kind of chance of getting up and down?
   Out of curiosity what sort of hole seperates those 2 par 3's??
   Thanks for the feedback.

[Patrick Schultheis]

Ed -

The 2nd is slightly uphill. There is a nasty bunker left of the green, and a false front that pushes shots that are short and/or left further left.

The 6th is flat but feels like it's uphill - particularly when the hole is back.  The 9th is slightly uphill.

I either play a 3 hybrid or a 3 wood on 13, depending on the tee position, the hole location and how I'm hitting it. A safe shot is short and right of the green - a shot with relatively low trajectory has a good chance to run up to the fringe or the front of the green.

14 is a medium-length par 4, with a sharp dogleg left protected by bunkers.

I'll be honest, I don't have a good idea of how to play 15. It's among the most difficult par 3s I've ever played.  There are bail-out areas - a 160 yard shot short of the bunker is fine. A longer shot left of the bunker might run up on to the green. Shots right of the bunker are unlikely to be on the green, but there is a generous landing area there. Of course, too far right and you're in a wetland hazard.

Sean - please chime in here with your thoughts (and disagreements).

Patrick

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Shady Canyon is my favorite Fazio course I've ever been on, since I haven't been on the shell that was once Riviera.

With that, after a recent visit, I still found I like shady Canyon best, even despite an unimaginative routing. That beautiful canyon deserved much more. The wind direction rarely changes and the course ultimately suffers because of it. The course is completely unwalkable, even though they do have caddies who do walk it. I hope Jim Rome tips them good. (He lives high above the course and supposedly does his show from his home. I also hear he has become somewhat of a recluse, even though he does still make a public appearance or two) The membership also preportedly consists of Mark McGwire, Shawn Green, Kobe Bryant and many more atheletes as members.

Shady Canyon is hosted by a top notch Director of Golf, Brian Gunson. A class act if there ever was one. the club is by far the best The O.C. has to offer, that is unless someone has a billion dollars and wants to buy all of the houses on the West Bluff of the Back Bay, raze them and then rebuild Orange County Golf Club. (circa 1915)

(a ludicrous idea I know)

Shady Canyon's 1st hole you can just about play on every Tom Fazio course ever constructed. In fact, I think they managed the scientifically impossible by cloning it from one of five holes at Big Horn. (God forbid once again. Science out of control!)

The 2nd is a pretty decent hole. Very strong with the excellent false front the new guy justly here extrapolates on. The 3rd is by far one of the best short 4's Fazio has ever built, that is unless Tom Marzlofftov is now counting Riviera #10 as his own. The 4th is a somewhat decent mid length 4 and then the best Fazio green I've been on since I played QofLQ #14. I would rate both of those holes along with the 5th at Shadow Creek as the best par 3's King Fiz has ever built.  The 6th is a pretty fun downhill rollercoaster with a green that accepts the shot well. As close as you will get to a Fazio fall-a-way until you try the 16th here, followed by a so-so uphill short 4th; a nice looing par 3, 8th that is about as tough as a Hostess Twinkie. the 9th is one of the few times you'lle ver see a bunker in the middle of a fairway on a Fazio course, but the hole makes no architectural sense. I originally liked it the first time I played it, but have since 180ed on that opinion.

Most don't care for the 10th. I found it to be a nice looking hole. the 11th is just simply a horribly placed par 3. It's in a very suspect area (a wetlands and it's literally a 400 yard drive to the next hole. Personally he should have created some sort of chasm-like hole where you could stumble off the green and find yourself on the next tee. However that kind of golf is strictly verbotten by the Fiz King.

The next holes are just sort of unmemorable, including the Par 3 into the canyon and then the short 4 up the hill, followed by the typical Fazio convention of holes till you get to the second shot of the 16th which is to another fallaway green. it can be reached in two by the meekest of golfers.

The 17th is a good par 3 and the 18th is by far the best finisher I've ever played of his. It's in a great setting, with little strategy but requires a carry of the creek on the second.

All in all my favorite Fazio gets a Doak 4 or 5 for effort. It's nothing more then that. On the other side it's expensive to maintain (I'm told)

The clubhouse is beautiful as explained by others here.

[Thomas_Brown]

Tommy is lightening up in his critiques!  

I really liked #3 as well.
The tee shot shows diff. strategic options.
The green offers diff. hole locations that dictates the strategy from the tee.  Native So. Cal. trees & environment perfectly intact on the tee through the green.
Bunkering somewhat restrained given the construction bias.

I'll hazard it and call it one of the few truly minimalist Fazio holes I've seen.  The Preserve up north has a few like this one as well.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

It must be old age!

[Sean Leary]

Ed -

The 2nd is slightly uphill. There is a nasty bunker left of the green, and a false front that pushes shots that are short and/or left further left.

The 6th is flat but feels like it's uphill - particularly when the hole is back.  The 9th is slightly uphill.

I either play a 3 hybrid or a 3 wood on 13, depending on the tee position, the hole location and how I'm hitting it. A safe shot is short and right of the green - a shot with relatively low trajectory has a good chance to run up to the fringe or the front of the green.

14 is a medium-length par 4, with a sharp dogleg left protected by bunkers.

I'll be honest, I don't have a good idea of how to play 15. It's among the most difficult par 3s I've ever played.  There are bail-out areas - a 160 yard shot short of the bunker is fine. A longer shot left of the bunker might run up on to the green. Shots right of the bunker are unlikely to be on the green, but there is a generous landing area there. Of course, too far right and you're in a wetland hazard.

Sean - please chime in here with your thoughts (and disagreements).

Patrick

The first three par 3 's are relatively level, although I think 9 plays a little downhill from the back two tee boxes, but there are relatively level holes.

I believe 6 is tricky because the wind swirls at that part of the golf course.  Many times you play 3-5 into the wind , then play 6 (which turns back) and you are into the wind again.

13 and 15 are just really hard holes.  There is some bailout on both holes, but not much.  15 to a right pin is just brutal, particularly from the back 2 sets of tees (From the way back tee, it might be the hardest Par 3 I've ever played)

[Joel_Stewart]

This thread is 10 years old and I was wondering if anyone has played it lately and could comment?


Has Fazio made any changes from the original routing?

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