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Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« on: August 22, 2014, 01:22:46 PM »
Not The Country Club ... the men's club next door.

I tried to get them to let me walk around it 25 years ago when I saw The Country Club, but was refused.  I don't remember the men's club ever getting much attention here.

BHoover

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2014, 01:25:17 PM »
Not only have I not played it, but I don't think I know anyone else who has played it.  I think that Pepper Pike Club is probably the most under the radar club in Ohio.

Chris DeToro

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2014, 01:31:47 PM »
Unfortunately I haven't but I do know someone that has and they loved it

Rees Milikin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2014, 01:55:17 PM »
Who is the architect of the course at the men's club?

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2014, 01:58:08 PM »
Who is the architect of the course at the men's club?

I'm pretty sure it is also a William Flynn course.

K. Krahenbuhl

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2014, 04:18:25 PM »
Who is the architect of the course at the men's club?

I'm pretty sure it is also a William Flynn course.

I'm have a trip planned there next month and have friends who have played many rounds there.  Is there anything specific you want to know about it?

Michael George

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2014, 04:20:06 PM »
It is William Flynn, just like the neighboring Country Club of Pepper Pike.  
"First come my wife and children.  Next comes my profession--the law. Finally, and never as a life in itself, comes golf" - Bob Jones

Jeff Bergeron

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2014, 04:41:16 PM »
Played it several times and it is very good. Definitely a Flynn. I haven't played the Country Club but knowledgeable people say the CC is better. Given the opportunity, play Pepper!

Jeff Bergeron

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #8 on: August 22, 2014, 04:54:38 PM »
Pepper is the CEO club of Cleveland. Generally speaking CEOs downplay their membership at 'mens clubs'. Very private.

Geoffrey_Walsh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #9 on: August 22, 2014, 06:21:52 PM »
I have played it as well.  Solid, Flynn course.

Tom, PM me if you are interested in playing the course.

JT Taylor

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2014, 07:13:06 PM »
Tom:

I am a member of The Country Club, "Country" as it is known and I have played Pepper Pike Club, "Pepper" as it is known, many times.  I know that you played Country many years ago.  I was a contributor to Ran's write up that he did on Country in the "Courses by Country" section of this web site several years ago.  I would be happy to help you offline so feel free to PM me as well.  Both Country and Pepper are William Flynn designs and were built at roughly the same time.  If you were to ask 10 people to split their 10 rounds played, they would likely tell you 8-2 or 7-3 in favor of Country.  That said, the par 3s are excellent and several par 4s are off the charts as well.  There are however a number of rather mundane par 4s as well.  When the course is conditioned properly (i.e. firm and fast) it is far more enjoyable.  Unfortunately it seems that it too often plays soft and green. 

As was mentioned above, it is primarily a corporate/CEO type club although that stance has softened a little bit over time.  You could a lot worse than spend a day playing Country and Pepper. 

There is no question that you can see similarities in the design of both cousres, as you should given that share the same designer and essentially the same property as they are literally right next to each other (you can see holes from each course when you play them both).  At Country, we have been working on a restoration project over the past five years and have the course nearly back to the original design.  We had a tornado hit the course last year and it removed a lot of trees (still not enough ;) ).  Pepper has one of the neatest/original features I've seen on a golf course.  Similar to Oakmont, where the 9th green also serves as the practice putting green, the first tee at Pepper also serves as the practice putting green. 

I'd be happy to discuss both courses in more detail with anyone who is interested.

Thanks.  J.T.

BHoover

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2014, 10:58:01 PM »
JT, I've heard from several friends who have played Country that it's one of the best, if not THE best, routed courses they've played. I've been told that there just aren't any bad walks from green to tee and that it just seems to make sense. What are your thought about the routing? How does the routing compare to places like Kirtland, Canterbury and Brookside?

Unfortunately it seems like you guys in NE Ohio can't catch a break in terms of weather. But at least we have LeBron back!!

Jeff_Lewis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2014, 11:29:20 PM »
Yessir.   What's your question?

Frank M

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2014, 12:57:56 AM »
Tom I have some photos if you're interested in anything in particular.

jonathan_becker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2014, 06:18:27 AM »
TD,

Are you finally headed to check out the quirky Mayfield along with a few others?  If so, drive down 77 to Canton and see Brookside again.  Do it!  :)

JT Taylor

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2014, 08:46:48 AM »
Brian:

I fully agree with you on the routing.  The ease of the walk and the pacing of the round is excellent.  Country is a "big" course that covers a lot of land but Flynn created a very efficient routing with very short green to tee walks. You move up and down the elevation on the property a number of times but the walk never seems tiring.

In terms of comparisons to other nearby courses, Canterbury is much more cramped. Herbert Strong had a much smaller piece of land which in some respects makes its design even more impressive.  For me, and obviously I'm biased, I think that Country is the overall better course in terms of design, routing and strategic use of hazards.  That said, I think Canterbury's greens are better (although not in Brookside's class; they have the best greens in Ohio IMHO).  Kirtland is a great course with two very different nines.  I love the back nine although, as you mention, with the crappy weather we have in NE Ohio, the back nine at Kirtland is often a quagmire.

It is amazing how much more rain we get in Cleveland than Akron and Canton get and they are only 40 or so miles apart. This summer, we have had three separate 24 rain totals at Country of over 3" with one of those over 4".  That is unheard of, even for us Clevelanders.  As a result, we've had our first and ninth holes almost fully underwater except for the greens, thankfully.  The course is so much better and more interesting/challenging when it is firm but sadly we don't get many stretches of those conditions here.

Mark_Fine

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #16 on: August 23, 2014, 03:49:24 PM »
Yes played it about 10 years ago and at that time the bunkers were dreadful (nothing like Flynn would have done).  I believe they have done work since to restore the Flynn look and feel.  The Country Club next door is great!

Bill McKinley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #17 on: August 23, 2014, 05:17:07 PM »
I have played Pepper a number of times and JT's comments are spot on when comparing Country vs. Pepper. 

I would add that the setting of Pepper is very cool.  Seems quite removed, almost Laurel Valley like at times.
2016 Highlights:  Streamsong Blue (3/17); Streamsong Red (3/17); Charles River Club (5/16); The Country Club - Brookline (5/17); Myopia Hunt Club (5/17); Fishers Island Club (5/18); Aronomink GC (10/16); Pine Valley GC (10/17); Somerset Hills CC (10/18)

BHoover

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #18 on: August 23, 2014, 08:37:29 PM »
Besides the differences between Country and Pepper Pike in terms of style/membership, I'm curious about the similarities and/or differences between the courses themselves. Are there substantial differences between the designs and the properties? JT mentioned that Country is on a fairly large property; is Pepper more compact?
« Last Edit: August 23, 2014, 09:03:58 PM by Brian Hoover »

Jay Flemma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ?
« Reply #19 on: August 28, 2014, 08:40:28 PM »
I know her!  She was Ironman's girlfriend!  Oh, wait...:P
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

jonathan_becker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Has anyone on this board played Pepper Pike ? New
« Reply #20 on: October 19, 2015, 01:30:29 PM »
Here's a couple snaps I took from my round this year.  It's a nice course but there's too much really good stuff going on next door to try and make a fair comparison.  But if invited, go play it.   


#2 Tee
 

 
Looking back on #5
 

 
 
#12 tee
 

 

#18 tee
 
« Last Edit: October 19, 2015, 01:35:29 PM by jonathan_becker »

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