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The Forecaddie

Looks like Shackelford was right
« on: September 03, 2003, 06:40:19 PM »
Golfweek reports that a team from Tom Fazio's design shop was charting shots all week during the US Amateur, and word is some of the the bunkers the long bombers flew will be relocated or fairways recontoured to bring the hazards back into play.

Having this Tom Fazio over is like inviting a vampire into your house isn't it?

Patrick_Mucci

Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2003, 07:14:14 PM »
Forecaddie,
Golfweek reports that a team from Tom Fazio's design shop was charting shots all week during the US Amateur, and word is some of the the bunkers the long bombers flew will be relocated or fairways recontoured to bring the hazards back into play.

Having this Tom Fazio over is like inviting a vampire into your house isn't it?

Who's word ????
What bunkers ???

Didn't Margaret C and many others indicate that Oakmont has a long history of not altering their golf course ?

How reliable is your source ?

Is Mark Studer aware of your contention ?
What does he say ?

Who invited Tom Fazio in to Oakmont ?   ;D
« Last Edit: September 03, 2003, 07:15:00 PM by Patrick_Mucci »

JohnV

Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #2 on: September 04, 2003, 09:26:27 AM »
Mark Studer is in Scotland right now on a well earned vacation (lucky dog.)  Tom Fazio's people were charting drives at the US Amateur on some holes at the request of the club.  If some changes are made as a result, they will be well thought through and discussed.  Just because Fazio and his people are involved at Oakmont doesn't mean that bad things will happen.  This is because the people at Oakmont have a good sense of history and will keep overall control of any changes.  The clubs where changes happen that don't fit are the clubs where nobody is willing to do the work to direct the architects doing the changes and just let them do what they think is right, even if it isn't.

I doubt there will be any recontouring of fairways, but I am certainly not in the loop about any of that.   Some bunkers might be added/extended/moved.  Others that were put in by Arthur Hills and R.T. Jones might be removed.

I did read somewhere that they were going to lower the new tee on #7 that Fazio added to restore uphill nature of the tee shot.

Changes happen and will continue to happen at Oakmont, but at least they tend to be well thought out and based on study and a reverence to the history and nature of the course.

The Forecaddie

Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #3 on: September 04, 2003, 11:07:40 AM »
John, so how are things on that ostrich farm in Pittsburgh?


JohnV

Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #4 on: September 04, 2003, 02:18:39 PM »
Forecaddie, all I can say is that I'd rather have my head in the sand than in the place that some others here seem to have put theirs.  Every membership at every course has the final say in what is done to their course.  If a course in California or Philadelphia chooses to let an architect run wild, that doesn't mean that one in Pittsburgh will allow him to do the same thing.

Tim_Weiman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #5 on: September 04, 2003, 02:28:22 PM »
JohnV:

Repeating previous posts on this subject, I share your optimism that we should not judge Oakmont simply by the experience of Riviera and Merion.

If Geoff proves to be correct in the long term, I'll be the first to admit it. But, in the meantime, I remain cautiously optimistic about Oakmont. They have some good people. They are well aware of the situations at Riviera and Merion. They are mindful of Oakmont's history and are determined to do the right thing.

I may not agree with every decision made, but suggesting Fazio will simply dictate changes doesn't square with my understanding of the people at Oakmont.
Tim Weiman

Jeff_Brauer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #6 on: September 04, 2003, 02:52:54 PM »
Forecaddie,

I'm curious about your thread title?  What missive did Geoff say "Fazio would redo Oakmont" and when?  The reason I ask, is I was aware over a year ago that he had been working there in preparation for the major tournaments coming, including extending some tees, etc.

I'm sure he'll do a fine job.  The real wonder is he prepared a master plan two years ago to make the course ready for long hitters, and he's out there again this year to make sure it doesn't have to be revised for distance increases prevalent since then!
Jeff Brauer, ASGCA Director of Outreach

JohnV

Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2003, 04:23:27 PM »
Jeff, I think it was always a part of the plan to visit during the Amateur and make sure the changes were good.  It was a great opportunity to double check the work before the really big show in 2007.  I'm sure any changes from here will be more of the nature of fine tuning that major surgery.

Paul Richards

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2003, 10:15:39 PM »
This topic poses the question of "when HASN'T Shakelford been right?" ???
"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

Forrest Richardson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2003, 10:54:53 PM »
Capable people from Mr. Fazio's office have been at Oakmont assisting with many aspects of the changes there -- for several years now.
— Forrest Richardson, Golf Course Architect/ASGCA
    www.golfgroupltd.com
    www.golframes.com

Patrick_Mucci

Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2003, 11:58:42 PM »
Paul Richards,

NGLA

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2003, 01:51:22 AM »
Patrick, you say NGLA.  Would you elaborate?  I don't know what Geoff said about NGLA.  But, is seems that you could expand on what appears to be a negative observation on your part about some evaluation Shackleford made about NGLA, unless you are just expressing a biased feeling without stating any specific fact.
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Patrick_Mucci

Re:Looks like Shackelford was right
« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2003, 09:53:40 AM »
RJ Daley,

I've already elaborated on that thread.
Use your search capabilities to retrieve it.

NGLA is in good hands and heading in the right direction.