Course setup - USGA Ladies Open

[jeffwarne]

Ron,
It would be a shame if they made 8 (9) a par 4 as it's a cool hole and that would further unbalance the nines.
I'd prefer to see 8(9) lengthened( if needed)-not reduced to a par 4
Also , while I'm not a fan of the faux (via setup) driveable par 4, it would seem 4 (5) would be perfect, as they did for the ladies.
Tremendous options off the tee for preferred angles as the hole was designed as a short hole, as opposed to  retrofitting as the USGA likes to do.
Anyone see how far right the eventual champ chose to drive it for a perect angle the last day?

12 is great hole and needs no  lengthening-small target-major penalty ala #11 Shinny
7 (? -it is what it is and lengthening,well...(it seems pretty long to me from the back)

4000 yards sounds crazy, but really isn't and actually includes 2 short holes. (10 and 12)
 

[Ronald Montesano]

12 is a wafer of a green, for sure. Exposed as it is and a downhill shot to boot, it could give the dudes headaches if F, F and windy.

[Patrick_Mucci]

"The point, which you missed, is that Sebonack can be presented as daunting as you wish."

Actually, Pat, I got that point right away. (Sorry to break it to you, but your 'points' are always immediately clear and easy to understand, since they are invariably the most obvious points anyone can make.)

You can say that you "get it" but your questions prove otherwise.

Yes, IF Sebonak was set up differently and mother nature had co-operated (a value laden term) then the course would've played harder and the scores would've been higher. (If memory serves, I believe that you personally experienced the course under tougher conditions, and had been predicting very high scores for the Open IF the weather "cooperated".)

My point was and remains: so what? Are you implying or suggesting or drawing out any interesting or valuable or useful 'lesson' from that fact, or are you simply wishing that the scores had indeed been higher? If the former, what is that lesson; if the latter, why would you or I care?

What you obviously don't get is that if Mother Nature had co-operated, the course set-up would have been considerably different.
The course was set up short, with fairly benign hole locations.

This was, in case you forgot, the U.S. Women's Open, not a local charity event.

As Joe Dey stated, "we're not trying to embarrass the best players in the world, we're trying to identify them"

Sebonack, with Mother Nature's co-operation would have been F&F.
You never would have seen Park's shot, into # 9 on the last day, hit that green where it did and stop so quickly.
You would have seen marginal tee shots run into the bunkers in the DZ as intended.

In short, you would have seen more demanding and more spectacular golf.

Hope that helps fill the information void.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Jeff, how do you think Sebonack would work for the men's U.S. Open, and what changes if any might they have to make on the course?  

I think Sebonack could hold the Men's US Open tomorrow.
Everything there is presented firm(and as fast as they want it), even this week with some rain and very,very humid conditions.
It would be a shame if they held the US Open there and bastardized the design with narrow fairways and stupid fast greens

Jeff,

I'd agree, other than the tee markers, very little in adjustments would have to be made.

The key, like it was at Merion and Sebonack, is "Mother Nature."

The problem is, she's so hard to predict and you can't risk guessing wrong.

I think there has to be a few modifications to the course, unrelated to Opens.

The problem I see is as follows:

Ross tinkered with # 2 for about 26 years.
CBM tinkered with NGLA for most of the remaining years of his life.
Ken Bakst has tinkered with Friars Head since inception.
Ditto Atlantic and tinkering.

So, my question is: WHO will do the tinkering at Sebonack ?

We know that collaborations are difficult at best.
I don't think that Mike possesses the knowledge or experience to tinker on his own.
So, whose hand will guide future alterations at Sebonack ?

[Ronald Montesano]

whom is the object of a preposition...where's yours?

[Mark Hissey]

The main issue for hosting a Men's Open would be logistics. For playability, there is far more that we could do in the way of length, green speed and rough. Plus, early June can have some nasty weather.

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