Can anyone explain what shot values are?

[Ulrich Mayring]

Says the guy, whose favorite courses are North Berwick, Royal Dornoch, Prestwick, Merion, Deal ;-)

Ulrich

[Wade Schueneman]

I think Mr. Morrow makes a good point.  While there may be a time and place for categorical analysis of golf courses (ex. rankings or tournament venue selection, attempting to understand and replicate great architecture), it is really hard to quanitfy the magic of a great golf course.  While I will continue to assess shot values, perhaps in the end it is more of a smell test than anything else.  Perhaps it is just a way of saying the course really grabbed my attention and I felt pleasantly challenged.

[JNC Lyon]

Says the guy, whose favorite courses are North Berwick, Royal Dornoch, Prestwick, Merion, Deal ;-)

Ulrich

How is there a tension between my view on shot values and my favorite courses?  I think Dornoch and Merion get ranked pretty highly (though Merion more for championship pedigree than design quality), but NB, Prestwick, and Deal are never highly valued by the rankings that value shot values so much.

My opinions on those golf courses have nothing to do with shot values.  In fact, I would not even really now how to calculate a shot value as part of my evaluation of any golf course.

[Thomas McQuillan]

in my opinion, shot values are how well rewarded a good shot is and how severely punished a bad shot is.

[Melvyn Morrow]

Thomas

Meaning what exactly - its back up in the air as to how we define good bad, it’s just words that help complicate the game for - let’s be honest for no real constructive help.  What’s good in your opinion may be bad in mine, or we could agree or not - it’s just complicated the issue when no complication is required.

Melvyn

[Ulrich Mayring]

@JNC Lyon:
I just found it amusing that you think shot values over-emphasize flash and drama, while all your favorite courses are some of the most dramatic and exciting in the world. Well, I don't know Merion, it may be in the camp of subtlety.

Anyhow, I don't know what ranking according to shot values you speak of, but there have been many different definitions of the term in this thread alone, so I think it's a bit of a sweeping statement to say that the concept is garbage and useless. Some of the definitions brought forth may be, but I'd like to think that everyone has a personal use for his definition. In most cases I should think that the concept helps to form a clearer picture in one's mind about the relative merits of course A vs. course B.

I certainly agree with Melvyn that everyone has different standards and different opinions, but from that fact I would draw much different conclusions ;-)

Ulrich

[Kyle Harris]

Shot values are the set of abilities and tools required by the golf course in order to manuever the golf ball from the tee to the hole using the most efficient series of strokes.

[Melvyn Morrow]

Kyle

Love it but you made one spelling mistake - I think you meant  "Shot values are the set of abilities and tools required by the golf course in order to MANURE the golf ball from the tee to the hole using the most efficient series of strokes".

Reads much better with that minor spelling correction    Anyway if many do not understand what it is how can it be defined as useful?

Melvyn