Dear Colleagues

[paul cowley]

Hello Tony

Google Blecavator.

I've used this in the past with good success on gravel soils mixed with large rock.

Since it seems you have a subsoil that perks, this machine will leave a soil or crushed gravel seed bed layer of 6 to 8 inches.

Paul

[Brian Phillips]

Tony and Blecavator,

I have used this a lot as well but all it really does is punch the stones and rocks down into the subsoil.  It does leave a great finish but I am not sure it it what Tony is looking for though.

http://blec.co.uk/construction_blecavator.htm

The knives wear out pretty damn fast as well so u need someone on site who knows how to change the knives a lot.

Cristoph,

I have also used a similar machine and have used the left over stones for mounding and shaping areas outside the fairway and rough areas.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Tony,

If you do the screening and it turns out that a disproportionate amount of the volume is stone, where are you going to get the missing/necessary fill from ?

At what cost ?

[Jim_Kennedy]

Tony,
What about a materials trade? If you have the option of lowering grades and there is a company in need of gravel in a reasonable radius it might work, or possibly work for parts of the job.
During a recent excavation for a new synthetic football field near me there were several thousand yards of soils left over. A company about 15 miles away has been taking it away and trucking it back at a 3 to 1 trade, i.e., they take three tri-axles away and bring one nicely screened load back, which is being used for other finishing projects.

[David_Elvins]

Tony,

Don't think it would work but it might be heading in the right direction. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_31SWF8kkGk

[Tony Ristola]

Hi Tony,

I hope that you are doing fine - while I did some research for a golf club in Switzerland recently I found out that during the late 1950s when German Architect Bernhard von Limburger designed and built their 18 hole course he also had a problem. there with stones on the site. He and his builder found a potato harvesting machine ("Kartoffelerntemaschine") and modified it. The machine would collect the stones, put them on a conveyor belt ("Förderband") directly leading into a truck. I could find no picture of that machine/construction. Even though this was 50 years ago I thought it would interest you, but somehow forgot to tell you about it when we met in November.

Greetings

Christoph

Thanks once again everyone; appreciate the time and effort.

Hi Christoph,

In 1990 we used a stone picker along these lines in Finland... engineered for the express purpose of stone extraction called Kivi Karhu (Stone Bear). It worked well, but am afraid when the trees are ripped out, and the bit of topsoil mixed with subsoil, this won't do the job.

Paul,
Used one of these in Germany, and for the reasons above it wouldn't be the machine for this site.
I used it sparingly for one section at a course in Bavaria. Another club had used such a machine and after burying the stone, the soil layer above the buried rock didn't drain well.

Pat,
If the soil isn't enough (I've come up with some soil saving design ideas), we will most likely have to buy it.

Jim,
The entire area is gravel rich, and is inexpensive; it would be a grand idea to make a material swap.

David,
Interesting vid; not sure that would create a playing surface devoid of stone.

[Tony Ristola]

An update:

I have spoken with one builder that told me they could grind the stumps, leave the roots and rock in the profile, stone and debris pick the top 2 to 3 inches... which is what the investor group's point man told me they wanted to do. The wood chips would be worked into the "soil".

With so many trees, when the trucks and tractors start hauling the logs and branches out this spring, will create a nice mess. Then...

What happens if an irrigation head need be moved after grow in, or a drain need be installed, or a leak in the irrigation line need be fixed... dealing with the root mass below the surface, and wood chips creates a nice grow-in/maintenance challenge.

The builder also said a few stones would likely still be present near the surface, and the fairways would require a fair bit of top dressing afterward, but that cost goes to maintenance, not construction. In the end it's a shell game, with the quality being less that optimal. If one looks at Total Cost...

The folks will be deciding soon which direction they'll be going.

Thanks again for everyone's input.

.

[Michael Rossi]

Tony

I have seen a different machine that may be of help, similar to the one in the video link, if I can find it I will post a reply.

http://track-loader.net/blog/rock-crusher-attachment-for-skid-steers/

[Greg Chambers]

If the plan is to incorporate tree stumps/roots into the subsoil, then they need to be prepared for fairy ring, EVERYWHERE.  At the course I am now, there was some sagebrush that made it into the subsoil, and even in the topsoil in a few spots.  It's very easy to tell which holes it happened on.

[Marty Bonnar]

Tony,
I note you mentioned this project is in the mountains. Have you seen the Site? Be wary if there's any evidence of frost heave up there. That'll bring even well-buried big stones back to the surface in double-quick time!
cheers,
MB.

[Tony Ristola]

Thanks to all who took the time to look into alternatives, post from experience or send messages. Much appreciated.

I forwarded the info to the investor group, but it didn't sway them a millimeter. They have a fixed budget, and will accomplish the work using their "schnitzeling" method.

I wish them well.