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Mark_F

Anarchy In The UK
« on: March 09, 2008, 01:54:09 AM »
Reading an old UK Golf World Top100 Courses in Britain issue, there were a a few interesting categories. 

Cheapest Courses:

Ashburnham
Nefyn
Silloth - approximately an eighth the price of Wentworth West!
Donegal
Aldeburgh
Macrihanish -ditto
Castletown
Aberdovey
Southerness
Broadstone

vs

The Dearest:

Wentworth West - over two hundred quid.
Troon
K Club
Old Head
Kingsbarns
Belfry
Sunningdale Old
Turnberry
Doonbeg
Birkdale

Assuming you didn't have to pay greens fees because of a generous benefactor, how many would honestly pick the dearest group ahead of the cheapest?  There's only two courses I would pick from the dearest list.

Then there were the following categories.

Shortest:

Gleneagles Queens
Swinley
Western Gailes
Luffness
Wentworth East
Royal Worthington
West Sussex
Macrihanish - short and cheap, the perfect combination!
St Enodoc
Berkshire Blue

vs

The Longest:

Portmarnock Old
Waterville
Donegal
Hoylake
Ballyliffen Glashedy
Old Head - long and expensive, possibly the most appalling combination
Woburn Marquess
K Club - see Old Head
Troon - ditto
Adare

Even more clear cut, as surely even monsters off the tee like Matt Ward would choose the shortest group ahead of the longest?

And yet they keep building longer and more expensive courses in the UK (Belfry 2, St Andrews Bay, Castle Course, etc.)

How many would pick the longest group over the shortest?


Sean_A

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2008, 04:29:22 AM »
Mark

For the cash list I would say the cheaper list looks a bit more inviting inviting for me. 

Silloth
Donegal
Machrihanish
Castletown
Broadstone (not so cheap anymore)
Southerness
____________
Kingsbarns
Sunny Old
Turnberry
Doonbeg
Birkdale

Though I doubt I would ever pay the going rate for any of these expensive courses.


In terms of length of the courses the shortest wins by a knock out.

Gleneagles Q
Swinley
Western Gailes
Luffness
West Sussex
Machrihanish
St Enodoc
Berkshire B
____________
Portmarnock
Donegal


Ciao
« Last Edit: March 09, 2008, 04:31:16 AM by Sean Arble »
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Adrian_Stiff

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2008, 04:35:09 AM »
Mark- The purest opinion is very much a minority one and if you took those lists of 10 forgetting the price, the expensive courses would be more indemand than the cheaper ones. Can you imagine organising a coach trip to play block A (the cheaper ones) or block B (the expensive ones) and trying to convince others A is best.
A combination of whats good for golf and good for turf.
The Players Club, Cumberwell Park, The Kendleshire, Oake Manor, Dainton Park, Forest Hills, Erlestoke, St Cleres.
www.theplayersgolfclub.com

Sean_A

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2008, 04:38:54 AM »
Mark- The purest opinion is very much a minority one and if you took those lists of 10 forgetting the price, the expensive courses would be more indemand than the cheaper ones. Can you imagine organising a coach trip to play block A (the cheaper ones) or block B (the expensive ones) and trying to convince others A is best.

Adrian

Of course you are correct, but the cheapest list still looks very impressive to me - except for the bus journey!

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Jack_Marr

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2008, 05:24:11 AM »
I'd just as soon play the cheaper ones. There's nearly always a better atmosphere at these courses - more natural.

And sorry for being pedantic, but many of the courses listed are not in the U.K...
John Marr(inan)

Andrew Summerell

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2008, 08:02:38 AM »
Mark, in regards to Sunningdale you have failed to mention the ‘Clergy’ discount, which is especially inviting when playing both Old & New on the same day. All you need is a Theological degree & it would shift to the cheap list. Well, not quite, but it is a ‘hell’ of a lot cheaper.

Melvyn Morrow

Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2008, 08:12:12 AM »
Jack

Do I hear another lone voice from the wilderness? 8)

Be Pedantic, we don’t want the UK course on the list, keep them secret, hidden to maintain the atmosphere which I agree is indeed ‘ more natural’.

Viva Natural, Viva Pedantic. ;D

Signed by the Very Reverend ‘ Melvyn’ (if only – but would it help my game) ::)

Kevin Pallier

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2008, 08:24:31 AM »
Mark

I haven't played enough of the "bargains" to comment on that particular comparison but certainly as a group I know I've enjoy playing the shorter courses over the longer one's.






Melvyn Morrow

Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2008, 08:30:56 AM »
Kevin

Great, another real golfer.  Length is no proof of skill!!


Matthew Hunt

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2008, 08:46:38 AM »
Mark, was that the Issue where Muirfield came top with RCD only 0.02% behind in second?  It was one of the things that sparked my intrest in golf courses.

Bob_Huntley

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2008, 12:27:28 PM »
Mark, in regards to Sunningdale you have failed to mention the ‘Clergy’ discount, which is especially inviting when playing both Old & New on the same day. All you need is a Theological degree & it would shift to the cheap list. Well, not quite, but it is a ‘hell’ of a lot cheaper.



Andrew,

At one time we had a chap in Fresno, California, selling mail order Doctor of Divinty degrees. I cannot think of the name of the church at the moment but for twenty dollars he sold a couple of hundred thousand of these things. What's more people,  used them to officiate at weddings and all sorts of other scams. I think it came to a halt when the IRS got involved.

Bob

Tony_Muldoon

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2008, 05:56:03 PM »
I'd just as soon play the cheaper ones. There's nearly always a better atmosphere at these courses - more natural.

And sorry for being pedantic, but many of the courses listed are not in the U.K...

Mark's point would perhaps be weaker if he excluded the non GB courses. With the strength of the Irish Economy perhaps it's no wonder Jack has a preference for cheaper courses.

Ammended list.  Irish only.

Cheapest Courses:


Donegal

vs

The Dearest:

K Club
Old Head
Doonbeg



Shortest:




vs

The Longest:

Portmarnock Old
Waterville
Donegal
Ballyliffen Glashedy
Old Head
K Club -
Adare
Let's make GCA grate again!

Mark_F

Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2008, 11:28:10 PM »
Mark's point would perhaps be weaker if he excluded the non GB courses. With the strength of the Irish Economy perhaps it's no wonder Jack has a preference for cheaper courses.

Tony,

I was simply following the list from Golf World. 

I don't really go for all of that silly Celtic inferiority complex nonsense.  The Irish should - as should the Scots and Welsh - count themselves fortunate they are included as part of Great Britain.  :)

Mark, in regards to Sunningdale you have failed to mention the ‘Clergy’ discount, which is especially inviting when playing both Old & New on the same day. All you need is a Theological degree & it would shift to the cheap list. Well, not quite, but it is a ‘hell’ of a lot cheaper.

I see.  And do they actually require visual confirmation of said Testamur, or would my "Ian Paisley IS God" cap be enough to convince them?

Mark, was that the Issue where Muirfield came top with RCD only 0.02% behind in second?  It was one of the things that sparked my intrest in golf courses.

Matthew,

I think so.  It was the 2004 edition.  Obviously Wentworth is a lot more expensive than two hundred quid now, and in order for a cheap round you not only require a Theological Degree, but a Doctorate in Religious Insignificance.

Jack_Marr

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2008, 05:29:05 AM »
The French and the Germans should also be thankful that they're British. Vive la similarité.  :)
John Marr(inan)

Ally Mcintosh

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2008, 07:54:10 AM »
Mark,

I'll presume you were joking in that last post of yours?

Lucky I'm not actually Irish or I may have taken some offence.

Mark Chaplin

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2008, 01:25:54 PM »
Jack Marr - Golf World publish their top 100 courses of Great Britain and Ireland bi-annually. It is the golf magazine that bring the two nations together, sensibly in my book for comparing golf courses on the two islands.

If you exclude the Open venues most of the expensive courses are newly built for the American/overseas market and not home golfers - Doonbeg, Old Head, K Club, St Andrews Bay & Kingsbarns.

This doesn't bother me as I have no desire to play on any of them. I still work on the rule that a course shuld not exceed the price of a visit to TOC. I love Sunningdale and fortunately being a rozzer get the same deal as the clergy!
Cave Nil Vino

Jack_Marr

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2008, 02:23:32 PM »
Hi Mark

Yes, and there's nothing at all wrong with that. It's quite sensible to mention the two together.

I was just pointing out in the original post it just says Britain, with no mention of Ireland. It's like publishing a list of courses in the U.S. and including Canada, implying that Canada is in the U.S. Many people think we're part of Britain (even in England), so it's no harm to mention it.

John
John Marr(inan)

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2008, 12:38:53 PM »
I'm too late to play golf in the UK part of Great Britain and Ireland today, but tomorrow is the Feast of St Gregory the Great. Suppose I were to offer to sing the Collect for the day:Deus, qui animae famuli tui Gregorii aeternae beatudinis praemia contulisti: concede propitius; ut qui peccatorum nostrorum pondere premimur, ejus apud te precibus sublevemur. Per Dominum nostrum. At which course might I stand the greatest chance of playing for a nominal fee? I suppose I ought to check out the opposite, too. At which course would I most likely be rounded up and sent to the nearest lunatic assylum (or whatever they now call them in these politically correct days - mental gymnasia for the logically challenged?)?

Jason McNamara

Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #18 on: March 12, 2008, 02:15:27 AM »
I'm too late to play golf in the UK part of Great Britain and Ireland today, but tomorrow is the Feast of St Gregory the Great. Suppose I were to offer to sing the Collect for the day:Deus, qui animae famuli tui Gregorii aeternae beatudinis praemia contulisti: concede propitius; ut qui peccatorum nostrorum pondere premimur, ejus apud te precibus sublevemur. Per Dominum nostrum. At which course might I stand the greatest chance of playing for a nominal fee? I suppose I ought to check out the opposite, too. At which course would I most likely be rounded up and sent to the nearest lunatic assylum (or whatever they now call them in these politically correct days - mental gymnasia for the logically challenged?)?

Bump to make sure Mark follows up on this.

Guesses are Bishop Auckland, Royal Mid Surrey, or Whitby GC for the discount.  As for being rounded up, is there a Bethnal Green & Bow GC?   ;)

Mark_Rowlinson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #19 on: March 12, 2008, 03:11:54 PM »
Jason, There are plenty of local saints who might have me up for blasphemy: St George, St David, St Andrew come to mind, and if I knew who St Enodoc was I might need to avoid him, too. (Cornwall, like Brittany, enjoyed creating its own saints). The Welsh, too, went in for that sort of independently-minded creativity - St Deiniol is probably known only to aficionados on this site (fun little course overlooking Bangor). Some of those saints are also Royal (St George, St David) so I'd probably be hauled up for treason as well. A few may be getting a bit senile: St Anne's Old, for instance.

I'm not too afraid of Bishop Auckland as it is the home of the Bishop of Durham, and I imagine they are going to ensure that current appointments are of mild men, having achieved a degree of notoriety with Bishop Jenkins a few years ago. But there is a goodly number of religious courses worldwide: Quaker Ridge, Temple, Vicar's Cross (I'm sure he is), Canon's Brook, Magdalene Fields, Druid's Heath, St Nom, St Cloud, San Lorenzo and even San Francisco, to mention but a few.

As it happens I did not play golf - I was too busy - but I did sing a little Latin on the old steam radio - we had an octet doing O Nata Lux by Thomas Tallis on BBC Daily Service this morning - a little gem. Tallis, of course, was a recusant, remaining a Catholic even in protestant Elizabeth 1's reign, so maybe I should have gone over to Rome - the nearest course, Aquasanta, is a real gem, and there's even a course at Castelgandolfo where the Pope has his summer residence. Now I wonder if he sneaks out of the back door occasionally for a swift nine holes - don't misunderstand me, please.

Years ago, in my BBC days, I produced a recording of the Dupre Stations of the Cross in Ampleforth Abbey, a premier Benedictine Abbey. For the two most difficult pieces the organist asked one of the monks to turn pages and act as registrant. The organist was very efficient and got the recording over quickly. I complimented on this and said that if I'd known this I'd have booked in for 18 holes on the way home. Said organist rang me a few days later to say that the monk had thought I had said an 18-year old on the way home!

Back to the plot! Had I played today I suppose I might have got discount at Crook for being a fraud, Verulam and Aqualate for speaking Latin, Ryde for taking them for one, C & L Country Club for spotting that C & L add up to 150 (about as far as I can drive), Southfield (what you don't know is that Hill Top Road is a cul de sac off the wonderfully named Divinity Road), Singing Hills (a bit obvious),the Belfry for being downright batty, and Robin Hood for stealing from the rich.

Your turn!

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2008, 07:28:53 PM »


As it happens I did not play golf - I was too busy - but I did sing a little Latin on the old steam radio - we had an octet doing O Nata Lux by Thomas Tallis on BBC Daily Service this morning - a little gem.

By the miracle of 'broadband Radio' we can listen to this for the next 7 days.

Chooose, Daily Service, Wednesday.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/programmes/dailyservice/index.shtml?focuswin

(Hope you get residuals Mark!)
Let's make GCA grate again!

Jed Peters

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Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #21 on: March 13, 2008, 12:54:46 AM »
Mark, in regards to Sunningdale you have failed to mention the ‘Clergy’ discount, which is especially inviting when playing both Old & New on the same day. All you need is a Theological degree & it would shift to the cheap list. Well, not quite, but it is a ‘hell’ of a lot cheaper.

Does a degree in Moral Philosophy and Theology from St. Mary's College of California count?

Jason McNamara

Re: Anarchy In The UK
« Reply #22 on: March 13, 2008, 01:36:43 AM »
Ah, I didn't realize we could consider overseas courses.  Then I expect you'd be rounded up at Le Meridien outside Moscow, Mark - they might still be sore about the whole calendar mess.