More on Spyglass.....

[Bob_Huntley]

On the Spyglass thread, Pete Lavallee said:
Quote:

"I always found it counterintutive that the finest stretch of holes would come first."


I spoke at length to Bob Hanna today and he filled in many of the gaps in my knowledge of Spyglass. There was never any thought of a different routing than what is there now.

What I did discover, was that Jones and Morse wanted to use the the sand pit that is now Spanish Bay, but the Owens Illlinois Glass Company had another five years on the lease and would not relinquish it. Jones felt it was possible to build another Cypress Point there. The NCGA did not want to wait that long.

Bob
 

[David Stamm]

Wow, Bob. Just thinking of the possibilities of how that might have turned out is fun!

[Joel_Stewart]

Bob:

Is there any new news on the Forest Course at Pebble?  Last I heard it may be dead.

[Bob_Huntley]

Joel.

All I convey, is that hope springs eternal.

Bob

[Adam Clayman]

Bob, Thanks for contributing to what has to be one of the coolest aspects of our immediate society. I will say this, Mr. Jones sure was limiting himself with the comparison to CPC. On that land he could've easily out done the Doctor, Raynor or Hollins.

With your last line in reply #3 perhaps a change of name is in order for the Forest course? Santo to Beckert to Banks double play hey hey.

An obtuse reference to your hope springs eternal line, combined with the trees already on property, and the devotion these damn Chicagoans have to them.

[scuster]

... I will say this, Mr. Jones sure was limiting himself with the comparison to CPC. On that land he could've easily out done the Doctor, Raynor or Hollins.

Adam - out of curiosity, why do you think the land at SB would lead itself to a better golf course than CPC?  I was fortunate enough to just play both last week.  The inland part of both courses seem to be fairly similar from a topography stand point, with CPC having a vastly superior coastline.

[Adam Clayman]

scuster, My comment was made under the assumption that going too far inland wouldn't have been necessary and my belief that if the dunesland five holes had been expanded on, Spy would've been better for that reason. There is quite a disconnect between the area Spy exists and the SB site.

The inland holes at Spyglass are built on soils ridden with excessive clay. And as we all know the SB site was a sand quarry.

 

[Bob Jenkins]

Bob,

Really interesting stuff!

I note that Spanish Bay was at one time a sand quarry but I recall going by there when it was under construction and seeing a series of huge conveyor belts delivering sand to the site from across the road. I do not know where it was all coming from or at least I forget. I had been of the impression the site was quite rocky and they needed to import a bunch of sand from nearby.

Bob Jenkins

[Bob_Huntley]

Bob,

In previous threads you will have noted that I used the term "mined out sand pit."

When Spanish Bay was being designed, the plan was to truck in several hundred truckloads of sand and soil. The residents kiboshed that idea and a conveyor belt was erected along Congress Road to the site.

Any "Environmentally sensitive areas" were not natural at all, but placed willy nilly to satisfy the 'Save our Planet Society.'


Bob

[Bob Jenkins]

Bob,

Appreciate your info on Spanish Bay.

Going back to the thread I started on Spyglass, I was somewhat surprised by the comments which were to the effect that after the 5th hole, the course is not much at all. Although everyone cannot help but appreciate the first 5, I think RTJ did some incredible work on the rest of the course. Bunkering was outstanding and for the most part, left you with a difficult recovery. Great variety in long and short par 4s. A wonderful par 5 in 14 and a classic long par 4 at 16. Going back for the first time in many years, it just kept coming to mind that the place has so many great holes in addition to those at the front end. Most of the posters seemed down on the rest of the course which was surprising.

Take care.

Bob J

[Bob Jenkins]

I forgot to mention that after seeing much dead ice plant at points along the edge of the fourth, our caddy told me they killing the ice plant with Round Up as it is not native to the area. I found that somewhat surprising as in my visits down there I had seen one heck of a lot of ice plant. Maybe it has more to do with the pace of play?

[Bill_McBride]

Bob,

Appreciate your info on Spanish Bay.

Going back to the thread I started on Spyglass, I was somewhat surprised by the comments which were to the effect that after the 5th hole, the course is not much at all. Although everyone cannot help but appreciate the first 5, I think RTJ did some incredible work on the rest of the course. Bunkering was outstanding and for the most part, left you with a difficult recovery. Great variety in long and short par 4s. A wonderful par 5 in 14 and a classic long par 4 at 16. Going back for the first time in many years, it just kept coming to mind that the place has so many great holes in addition to those at the front end. Most of the posters seemed down on the rest of the course which was surprising.

Bob, as I said above, "it's a relative thing."  

The rest of Spyglass Hill is solid, well designed parkland golf, but it wouldn't be Top 100 without the opening holes in the dunesland.

IMHO of course.

[Bob_Huntley]

Bob Jenkins,

Ice plant is indigenous to South Africa not California. The Coastal Commission here has decreed that any golf course development will receive positive approval if ice plant is removed. Simple.

Bob

[Adam Clayman]

The introduction of iceplant to the peninsula was made by the U.S. Army at Fort Ord. It's my understanding it was used to stabalize the marvelous dunes at the east end of the bay for their shooting range and the Non com officers club.

Has that building been moved yet? (either by man or nature?)

Bill McBride, There are some very solid holes and even some world class holes in the forest. #8 being one of the WC holes. What makes the forest holes less than say Medinah?

[Bill_McBride]

Adam, please re-read my post #11.  Without the dunes holes I don't think the 'Glass is the equal of Medinah #3 or many other great parkland courses.  But it's high level with those holes.  IMHO it would be even higher if the routing could somehow be reversed.

Again, it's strictly my opinion.  I could well be wrong!  

[Nick Church]

The NCO Club (Stilwell Hall) at Fort Ord was demolished.  It had been restricted due to safety concerns.  The edge of the footprint had been falling off into the beach below for years.

I can remember going to youth roller skating night (i.e. "makeout night") at the NCO club.  The parque ballroom floor made a lasting impression.  Also, they always had a large screen TV playing "Miami Vice" on Friday nights.

We ran around those dune surrounding the club.  Now I wonder what kind of course Doak, Hanse, or C&C could make out of it.