[Jim Franklin]

When did this layout come into existence and who figured it out? I loved the 11th hole which is a combination of a short per 4 and a par 3. Your approach is over a green and a pond to the green in the back. Pretty cool stuff.

I have seen the course on TV plenty and never realized it had all of the rock outcroppings and that the land was pretty hilly. It was certainly better (a lot) than I expected. Even if you played the entire 27 holes, you wouldn't ever play the Open venue which is too bad.

[Mark_Fine]

Jim,
Were the bunker edges/surrounds still kept rugged or were they cut down.  Bill Spence was struggling to keep them knarly and being pushed to trim them up.  I'm curious but probably best to talk to you about it off line.  

[Jim Franklin]

They were not extremely rough, but they certainly were not trimmed. It rained the day I played (off and on) so I fortunately was not in any bunkers that day. It was a lot rougher looking than I anticipated. I was thinking it was going to be a manicured facility, but it was very cool.

[Mark_Fine]

It is more than cool.  I sure hope it stays that way.  We played the composite 18 along with all the other holes (two balls on the combination holes).

I'm sure Wayne knows the date you asked for.  I presume he'll chime in.  I have it somewhere and if I get to it before he does, I'll post.  I'll email you off line as well.    

[Jim Franklin]

Thanks Mark. It really did surprise the hell out of me at how fun the composite course was. It was pure dumb luck that we played it that day too  .

Was it Flynn that came up with the composite idea?

[Mark_Fine]

Jim,
I just emailed you.

[wsmorrison]

I didn't pay much attention to who proposed the composite routing progression for TCC, I was more concerned about what Flynn did at the club.  If my recollection is acurate, I believe the wife of one of the Board members proposed the idea, when I cannot say.  Mark, if you know, please post.

The routing progression changes were not new to TCC.  The routing progression during the1913 US Open differed from the routing on the first eighteen holes as played today.  Formerly, before the club owned the land the Primrose nine sits on, the first eight holes played according to today’s sequence.  Then the current eleventh, twelfth and thirteenth followed and then the current ninth and tenth.  The finishing sequence is the same as today’s fourteenth through eighteenth.  The hole progression as played in the 1913 Open was the same progression being played when Flynn came in to do design and redesign work on the golf course.  

When Flynn designed his 9 holes new holes and redesign two original holes, the course was not set up as the Clyde, Squirrel and Primrose nines.  Flynn intermingled nine of the holes into the existing 18 and the resulting A,B and C nines were a unique routing progression.  C-1 through C-8 correspond to today's holes 1-8 on the front nine.  Some of the Primrose holes represent changes made by Cornish while Rees Jones remodeled 3 greens on the current 18-hole course.  I don't have my notes in front of me so I cannot provide details.  Sorry 'bout that.

[Jim Franklin]

Thanks Wayne, I look forward to hearing more about how the composite was developed.

[wsmorrison]

I believe the composite course was put into play for a major.  It was probably on or before the 1963 Open.  I know that Palmer had a lot of trouble on the eleventh hole of the composite holes all week and that one time his ball landed on a tree stump and he tried to hit off it.  If it was before this tournament, my guess would be the 1957 Amateur.

[JNC Lyon]

Having played the first 18 at the Country Club, it would be interesting to see the pros play the original 18 as Ouimet and Vardon did in 1913.  Holes 2, 9, 10, and 12 are altered or eliminated for majors, but I believe I had more fun playing these holes (all of which are short except for 9) than I would playing 11, 12, and 13 of the Composite Course.  Personally, I think the Composite Course is a wonderful idea, as it means that for the majors, the course is a tough test, but for the rest of the time, the course is a quirky, fun, and great golf course for the members.  To date, the member's routing is my favorite golf course, with every type of hole necessary for a great golf course.

[Mark_Fine]

Jim,
I can't find an answer to your question though I have not looked too hard.  Wayne's suggestion makes sense in that the composite was in all likelihood developed for a major tournament and someone's idea to add some harder golf holes and those are hard golf holes.  If I find something I will post it.  

[Mark_Fine]

Jim,
Having done a little more searching it appears that it was likely the USGA who influenced the club to form the composite track.  It seems this combination (a par 71 of just under 6900 yards at the time) was set up for the 50th aniversary of the Ouimet's 1913 victory and the playing of the 1963 U.S. Open at Brookline.  If anything was done earlier for the 1957 Amateur, I can't find it.  Sorry about that.
Mark  

[TEPaul]

I think #2 turns into a par 3, #9 is used as a practice range, #10 and #12 are dropped (#12 is considered sort of weak for those players and they walk right around it).

[TEPaul]

" I loved the 11th hole which is a combination of a short per 4 and a par 3. Your approach is over a green and a pond to the green in the back."

Jim:

Wayne's right, a women member of Brookline first suggested that idea to play over that green to the one over the lake beyond. That green gets put to sleep when the composite course is used for a championship. It's probably hardly noticeable.

The green on the other side of the lake is pretty interesting too in how it's morphed on that course over time. Originally that green was used as the par 5 green of one of Flynn's Primrose nine holes. Even the club historian didn't realize that.  

The routing iterations of Brookline over its history is like trying to figure out a jigsaw puzzle in reverse, including that mysterious par 3 that was once on the first half of present #14.

And then there was the little par 3 whose green was where a tennis court is now. And as you probably know the 1st and the 18th were once a racetrack.

[Darren_Kilfara]

#11 on the composite course (#1 tee to #2 green on the Primrose nine) is a real brute. I think a lot of people don't realize how tight the drive is - you need to thread your ball through a chute of trees with a fair amount of draw to have any realistic shot at the green. That said, #12 on the composite course (#8 on the Primrose) is a tough enough par 5 for members, never mind a par 4 for the pros. Unless your drive is on the very right edge of the fairway, you need a banana-ball draw on your approach to steer clear of the trees on the left...and this on a completely blind shot of at least 190-200 yards which rises 30 feet above a rock outcropping. Frankly, while I think it's a very pretty hole - the rock outcropping frames the drive beautifully - it's a fair bit beyond the pale as well. And while I'm no great fan of #9 or #10 on the main course - #12, on the other hand, is a great dropshot par 3 to a really neat push-up green - I prefer them, warts and all, to the first two composite holes.

Cheers,
Darren

[Mark_Fine]

Tom,
Do you know what is happening with the current #2 hole?  When I was there this summer, we were told something about a possible lawsuit (safety issue with neighbor).  It was playing as a par three rather than a short four.  

[TEPaul]

"Tom,
Do you know what is happening with the current #2 hole?"

Yes, I do. Coore told me about that. But in the spirit of "the Fifth" I refuse to answer that question on the grounds it may tend to incrimminate me.  

[Mark_Fine]

Tom,
I hope it returns to a short par four!  

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