[Tom Huckaby]

Are there any Golf Magazine panelists participating on this site? Bueller?

Golf's Most Beloved certainly WAS such a panelist at one point... but word was they did a house-cleaning fairly recently... he shall have to speak for himself.  

[Mike_Cirba]

Huckaby,

What's this??  A "newbie" again with only 3 posts??!?!?  

Did you figure out some nefarious way to roll the odometer reading back?  

[Tom Huckaby]

Mike - who are you and how dare you talk that way to a newbie like me.  And here I heard you were a nice guy....

Truth is I somehow inadvertently offed myself yesterday.  Tommy says there's a way to do this in Profile, and I must have accidentally done so.  I'm afraid to go look at Profile now...

TH

[John Kavanaugh]

Mike - who are you and how dare you talk that way to a newbie like me.  And here I heard you were a nice guy....

Truth is I somehow inadvertently offed myself yesterday.  Tommy says there's a way to do this in Profile, and I must have accidentally done so.  I'm afraid to go look at Profile now...

TH

Huck,

I deleted your account yesterday because I couldn't take your babbling any longer...Of course we all new Tommy would let you back.

[Tom Huckaby]

Mike - who are you and how dare you talk that way to a newbie like me.  And here I heard you were a nice guy....

Truth is I somehow inadvertently offed myself yesterday.  Tommy says there's a way to do this in Profile, and I must have accidentally done so.  I'm afraid to go look at Profile now...

TH

Huck,

I deleted your account yesterday because I couldn't take your babbling any longer...Of course we all new Tommy would let you back.

 
Man this would be a strange place if you had that kind of power.

But well jousted!

TH

[Jim Colton]

For those staunch defenders of Chicago golf, this list says it all.

From what I can tell, there's only the one.

Since i'm not up to date on the likes of a "Dancing Rabbit", I don't know what state it's in. If there's another course on this list from the Chicago area, my point will still hold.

Now, if we can get it up to 3%, I may retract.

There are two Chicago area courses...#65 The Glen Club (although it's extremely overrated).  Weaver Ridge at #73 is not Chicago area but only a couple hours away.

They should consider adding 'the next 50' or an honorable mention list in no particular order, because the list of quality public courses is getting deeper and deeper.  Certainly you'd see Chicago area courses such as Kemper Lakes, Pine Meadows, and Cantigny on the cusp.

Here are the top 20 courses that dropped out.  I've played 7 of these, which makes me realize I'll never get to all 100 with all of this turnover.

49 World Woods - Rolling Oaks
50 Harding Park
56 Blackwolf Run (Meadow Valleys)
59 Pelican Hill (Ocean South)
61 Grand National (Lake)
63 Iron Bridge
70 Grand National (Links)
71 Lost Canyons (Sky)
72 Pinehills (Jones)
74 Castle Pines North (Ridge)
78 Kauai Lagoons (Kiele)
82 Pinehurst No. 4
84 Hualalai
89 The Greenbrier (Old White)
90 Red Sky Ranch (Fazio)
91 Crumpin-Fox
95 Tidewater
96 Ventana Canyon (Mountain)
97 Mauna Lani (North)
100 La Purisma

[Greg Tallman]

How can a course go from 49 to not ranked?

Did the panel change that drastically?
Did the criteria change?
Was the course redesigned?
Did the manangement of the resort do something to offend the worng person(s)? (Pine Barrens fell considerably)

Curious omission given previous ranking.

On another note Old White undergoes a restoration that could only make it better but falls out of the ranking?
Does the fact that it was closed count against it?
Did some raters who did not understand the nature of the project get put off by "another renovaton project"?

Played them both many times and thoroughly enjoy each but  I am not arguing that either of these two courses do or do not belong on the list but rather questioning how the movement of courses is influenced.

[Kyle Harris]

A waste, the rankings
Time better spent playing golf
Nice day now, who's in?

[Tom Huckaby]

r - well... I'm not 100% sure I ever really did accidentally hit that button.  It is rather prominent.

But the powers that be can come up with no other explanation, so I am ready to accept my foibles.  Maybe I did hit it inadvertently.  

And it's only twice.  

TH

[cary lichtenstein]

Tobacco Road Missing from another list...how can it be

[Jason Blasberg]

Tobacco Road Missing from another list...how can it be

Unfortunately, it appears that many many people just don't get it.

[Mike Hendren]

I easily envision a golfer standing on the first tee of Tobacco Road and thinking:  "This is BS."

Next year will be the 10th anniversary of The Other Senior Tour, an eight-guy trip where half the group can't break 90.  I'm dying to take the guys to Pinehurst and stay at the Pine Crest Inn.  I'm very reluctant to arrange golf at Tobacco Road, however.

I'm not sure one can "get it" while repeatedly reaching into his pocket for another Pinnacle.

That said, I'm a giant fan of the place and found it surprisingly playable with a little guidance from the Gracely boys.  Then again, when you name your ownself "Bogey" an 81 on your inaugural round at the Road is cause for celebration.  BTW, I find the opening tee shot ridiculous.

Mike

[Joe Hancock]

 Then again, when you name your ownself "Bogey" an 81 on your inaugural round at the Road is cause for celebration.  

Assuming par of 72, wouldn't you more accurately be addressed as "Half Bogey"?

Joe

[Scott_Burroughs]

My mom and stepdad, both 21-handicappers, loved TR, and they are normally ones that like 'pretty' above all else.

I've found that the opening tee shot at TR has become easier as equipment has improved in the last 7 1/2 years since I first played TR.  Just go over the mounds now.  Just have to watch about hitting it long/right.

[Greg Tallman]

Funny how ebveryone here bashes a number of $300 courses but laud Bandon at $240 which is the published public rate on all three courses.

Bandon will have a tough decision to make regarding pricing and may well underparice Pacific Dunes as it would seem they are set on keeping all three courses at the same rate. Probably don't want to play the game of labeling one as better than the others. If this practice is followed PD may be forever underpriced as the other two likely could not command a $400 green fee that Pacific Dunes could today.

At $240 the Bandon courses rate in the 15 most expensive resort/public rounds in the U.S. Not cheap by any means but likely underpriced in the grand scheme of things.  

Would be interesting if they chose the model of pricing preferred by the major golf resorts...

PBR
Pebble-450
Spy-300
Spanish-240

Pinehurst
#2-365
#4-250
#8-250

Kohler
Straits-340(plus caddie gratuity)
Blackwolf River-230
Irish-210

Kiawah
Ocean-320
Turtle-215
Osprey-215
Cougar-215

Sawgrass
Stadium-350
Valley-190

Bandon (If choosing to follow suit)
PD-400
BD-300
BT-300

All rates are high season rates for each property quoted in May 2006.

[Brian Joines]

Personally, I find Pinehurst at #6 behind Bandon Dunes, Whistliing Straits and Kiawah - Ocean is bad. I would put Pinehurst right up there with PD and PB, defintiely not behind the others.

[Matt_Ward]

I'm on the road as I wrote this but after a quick glance I have to say the listing is nothing more than mostly a collection of the high-end places to play in the USA.

Are all of them architecturally significant ?

No, they are not.

Case in point -- the fact that Black Mesa is not among the top 25 courses. That is an omission that goes beyond ignorance -- it is sheer stupidity.

Unfortunately, too many of the listed courses get their position solely because of previous standings. Frankly, I can say that a number of the more recent courses are making major strides and too much of what I see with such public ratings fails to demonstrate the kind of due diligence that gives them the sort of credibility that makes them worthy of any attetion at all.

[Joe Hancock]

Are all of them architecturally significant ?

No, they are not.

Case in point -- the fact that Black Mesa is not among the top 25 courses. That is an omission that goes beyond ignorance -- it is sheer stupidity.

Matt,

How does an omission make something else architecturally insignificant? I'm lost on your logic. In fact it's beyond igno....never mind!

Joe

[Eric Olsen]

How many of the listed resort courses have winter rates?  While Bandon's winter rates increase as spring approaches, in January 2006, you could play 36 holes for $115 ($75 first round/$40 replay).

[Greg Tallman]

I am sure the American Club has some great winter specials!

I believe Bandon's off season rates are published at $185 now.

[Matt_Ward]

Joe:

Allow me to help your lack of understanding.

Magazines, especially the big ones like Golf, do have considerable standing among many people and when they opine on what is the best public golf courses it does have some impact -- about what constitutes quality public golf.

Frankly, the due diligence, or lack thereof, astounds me because if real quality time were spent in the field they would really see what is truly happening within the domain of top tier architecture.

Black Mesa is one of the country's premier public courses IMHO -- Golf Magazine clearly needs to do a bit more homework from their end to assure its own credibility in such matters of this type.

Joe -- I don't know if you have ever played Black Mesa. If you do I'd be curious as to your position on just how great the course is.

[Mike Vegis @ Kiawah]

Kiawah
Ocean-320
Turtle-215
Osprey-215
Cougar-215

All rates are high season rates for each property quoted in May 2006.

I don't know about the other properties, but these high season rates for Kiawah are for those just walking off the street to play.  For those staying through the resort, the rates are a good 20% or more less expensive.  For those who come to play on a package, the green fee portion is substantially less.  I'm sure it's that way on the other resorts as well.  You're doing the equivaliant of walking into a showroom and judging the affordability of a car by only looking at the fully-loaded, pimped out model sitting the the showroom floor.  Always look at the various options and the factory rebates...

[Adam Clayman]

Eddie and Pat Should just charge the panelists $500/rnd That will get their attention.

Actually, I just spent close to these amounts to play a top tier course.

In my evaluation, it wasn't worth it.

Golf is pricing itself right out of existence. Either that, or we are on the verge of an inflation burst that will make the seventies look like a walk in the park.

[ed_getka]

Any public list that doesn't include Lawsonia is not worth looking at.
   Some of the price points of the high end courses are getting ridiculous, but we beat this to death a few years ago. I doubt I will ever play Whistling Straits, Pinehurst #2, Ocean Course, because at those prices I don't think I would find them that much more architecturally superior to some courses at half the price or less. However, I appreciate supply and demand and obviously the demand is there. It would be nice if the biggies above had a replay rate that might make the steep green fees a bit more palatable.
    I was shocked that Pacific Dunes was empty on  a gourgeous evening in June this year when there was plenty of light left to get a round in. It was nice though to have PD to myself as my own personal playground.  I actually overheard someone at Bandon say he thought he wouldn't golf that day and just relax and have some drinks. How on earth someone can be at Bandon and not golf is completely beyond my comprehension.

[Kevin Pallier]

Funny how ebveryone here bashes a number of $300 courses but laud Bandon at $240 which is the published public rate on all three courses.

PBR
Pebble-450
Spy-300
Spanish-240

Pinehurst
#2-365
#4-250
#8-250

Kohler
Straits-340(plus caddie gratuity)
Blackwolf River-230
Irish-210

Kiawah
Ocean-320
Turtle-215
Osprey-215
Cougar-215

Sawgrass
Stadium-350
Valley-190

Greg

Thanks for the information - I'm just glad I live in a country where one can play it's #1 Public Access Course for a day rate of $100AUD  [$76USD]

Some of those rates you quoted are obscene - where does one draw the line of "value for money" ?

Appreciate economics drives the pricing models but still I wouldn't go near some of those courses on the basis of those costs regardless of what's there.

As a point of refernece, with regard to Australia's Top25 or so PAC courses, I would have thought very few are in the $100-$150 AUD mark [ie: max. $110USD] !!  

[Tags:]

Tags:

[Tags:]

Tags:

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()