Links Courses & Containment Mounds

[Scott Witter]

Is it me or does anyone else find similarity between containment mounds found on many modern designs over the past 40 years and the fact that so many links courses in Ireland are located between the mounding of sand dunes etc.

Just go back to the Lahinch thread and look at those photographs Mike Dugger posted and also think about many of them you have played or seen photos of....see anything familiar?  Care to comment?

[ed_getka]

Scott,
   Those can certainly be looked at as the original containment mounds. However, the dunes generally have taller grass on them that you don't want to visit on those older courses. On modern courses the containment seems more designed to kick balls back towards being in play, and not as penal to end up in.
    Plus I think there is a big difference between using what nature gave them back then, and building something like that on purpose today.

[JohnV]

Perhaps the picture at the top right is where the idear for containment mounds came from

[Ian Andrew]

Scott,

There's a huge difference between routing a course through a natural valley made by hills or dunes and creating mounding to simulate a valley hole. One is a natural occurance so it will blend perfectly in, the other is contrived and always looks that way even after the growth of long grass. Whether they play the same or not, aesthetically there is no comparrison.

[Scott Witter]

Guys, like usual you all read more into a post/comment than there actually exists...all I said was do you find a similarity.

Ed, I agree and obviously there is a BIG difference between then and now with respect to designing containment mounds.

Ian, nothing was mentioned about routing in natural-vs-manmade terrain, but gee wizz, thanks for the education anyway  

[David Kelly]

Guys, like usual you all read more into a post/comment than there actually exists...all I said was do you find a similarity.

Ed, I agree and obviously there is a BIG difference between then and now with respect to designing containment mounds.

Ian, nothing was mentioned about routing in natural-vs-manmade terrain, but gee wizz, thanks for the education anyway  

I was going to comment but after reading your reaction to the other guys I'll keep it to myself.

[Scott Witter]

David, is it really that easy to scare you off.

Naturally, there much more different between these two features of design than there are similarities, but as an observation only, with no comparisons to fundamental design elements, or as an aesthetic, I was merely caught by what appeared to visually be a similarity and then of course wondered if they could be connected and linked in some small way.

Dave, if you have something to offer, please do, I promise I won't yell at you, but the others should realize that I wasn't lashing out at them either, I just believe they, other than Ed, may have misunderstood, or read more into the original post.

[A_Clay_Man]

Scott, I do think there are some who jump to the conclusion that a certain mound, or mounding is containment. I'm not saying you're one of them. But not all mounds are containment.


Maybe it's like pornography, I know it when I see it and I'm not sure I can adequately describe the difference, but... mounds, which are semetrical, if struck on the wrong side, do not contain. They do the opposite. Therefore containment involves more than just one mound or knob and is a function of size and placement.


I think some of the more interesting use of mounds, surround the eight green at ANGC. That's the green complex they had re-built to the original good Doctor's spec's (sort of), soon after Cliff Roberts death.

[Scott Witter]

Adam,

If you reread my original post you will see that I don't say that the mounding in Ireland is containment mounding.  As I glazed over the photos once again because I admire these courses so much I suddenly noticed the larger landscape which brought about these holes and thought, mind you, that I may have seen a similarity...but apparently my eyes MUST have playing tricks on me.  

"But not all mounds are containment."  That is absolutely true.  "Therefore containment involves more than just one mound or knob and is a function of size and placement."  This is also true.  I only noticed and commented on a familiar 'look' between the mounds/dunes that 'contained' the valley holes on these links legends and the containment mounding created by modern designs.  Are they the same? Absolutely NOT, but is the look familiar? are they a chip off the ole block? maybe.

[ed_getka]

Scott,
   I haven't played many of the courses across the pond with the big dunes with holes running in between. Of what I have seen, I haven't seen any of the courses over there that would work like the containment mounds that are created today. Have you seen some like that in Ireland or elsewhere? It generally seems like you have tall ball-eating grass coming donwn the dunes until it flattens out, so you don't get the funneling effect of the modern containment mounds.
   It would be interesting if the first use of containment mounds in the modern era were for the purpose of simulating dunes, and perhaps it later morphed into what I am more used to seeing today, with the funnel effect.